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Ukraine

Discussion in 'BBS Hangout: Debate & Discussion' started by NewRoxFan, Nov 25, 2018.

  1. Amiga

    Amiga Member

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    CSIS did a breakdown of the minerals deal. I highlighted a few paragraphs below.


    https://www.csis.org/analysis/breaking-down-us-ukraine-minerals-deal

    The bilateral agreement is markedly different from the original minerals deal proposed by the Trump administration. The initial deal called for Ukraine to use its mineral resources to repay the United States $500 billion for military aid previously provided. The agreed upon framework does not designate the rights of $500 billion worth of minerals revenues to the United States nor does it include a security guarantee for Ukraine. Rather, the agreement establishes a reconstruction investment fund with joint U.S. and Ukraine ownership. Ukraine will contribute 50 percent of all revenues earned from the future monetization of all Ukrainian government-owned natural resource assets into the fund. This includes minerals deposits, oil, natural gas, and other relevant infrastructure, but, notably, it does not include resources that are already serving as a revenue source to Ukraine, such as the operations of Naftogaz and Ukrnafta, Ukraine’s largest oil and gas producers. This means, the profitability of the fund is entirely dependent on the success of new investments in Ukraine’s resources.

    Therefore, the response of private industry is key to the success of the fund and will determine how much value the United States ultimately derives.

    The agreement includes little to guarantee Ukraine’s security or reaffirm U.S. financial and military support in the ongoing conflict. However, the idea is that with joint U.S.-Ukraine investment in the nation’s resources, the United States will continue to have a stake in Ukraine’s security, stability, and lasting peace and therefore be incentivized to uphold and defend Ukrainian security.

    it takes an average of 18 years to develop a mine and costs $500 million and $1 billion to build a mine and separation plant.

    Even in the long-term, the success of the bilateral agreement ultimately hinges on the ability of Ukraine to attract private investment in its mineral resources. The U.S. government cannot command private companies to mine in Ukraine as China and Russia can with their state-owned enterprises.

    First, there is very limited data on whether Ukraine’s rare earth elements and other strategic materials are commercially viable to mine. According to the former director general of the Ukrainian Geological Survey, there is no modern assessment of rare earth reserves in Ukraine. Existing mapping was done 30–60 years ago by the Soviet Union and relies on old exploration methods.

    Second, the war has wiped out essential infrastructure.

    Ukraine has been left with only about one-third of its prewar power capacity. There will need to be a significant buildout of energy infrastructure for mineral exploration or production to commence.

    Lastly, mining companies are reluctant to make long-term investments due to the ongoing security risk in Ukraine. The absence of security assurances in the bilateral agreement further complicates the situation. A new mine can run for over 50 years. Confidence in the political and economic stability of a jurisdiction is critical given the size and longevity of the investment.




     
  2. Andre0087

    Andre0087 Member

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    Wow, what a cluster**** on national TV...Trump looking more insane by the day.
     
  3. Newlin

    Newlin Member

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    Absolutely shameful. Trump so embarrassing.
     
  4. Commodore

    Commodore Member

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  5. Andre0087

    Andre0087 Member

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    Russia's getting their money's worth from the grifter in chief...
     
  6. Surfguy

    Surfguy Member

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    Baboon diplomacy….thats a new look.
     
  7. Andre0087

    Andre0087 Member

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    ...and the slow and dim like @Space Ghost will continue to support the regime inside and outside of Russia.

     
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  8. Kemahkeith

    Kemahkeith Member
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    Im
    Im For weaning Ukraine Off our teat
    But this is rough.
     
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  9. J.R.

    J.R. Member

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  10. Andre0087

    Andre0087 Member

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    It's like everyone in this admin is on speed and just disconnected from reality. This should have been done in private and makes me miss the corpse of Joe Biden only a month in. These guys wanna adapt the authoritarian playbook from Putin but we won't go down with a fight.
     
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  11. Andre0087

    Andre0087 Member

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    Push that propaganda somewhere else...Stevie Wonder could see the bullshit Trump was trying to pull.
     
  12. Kemahkeith

    Kemahkeith Member
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    Maybe he cant see it but he can surely smell it.
     
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  13. JuanValdez

    JuanValdez Member

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    Staged for public consumption to justify the double-cross Trump will pull later.
     
  14. Aware

    Aware Member

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    if you're still backing trump and the republican party, you are either a moron or a foreign agent. possible a racist as well

    we are watching American influence destroyed in real time by its own president. like wtf?
     
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  15. Amiga

    Amiga Member

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    Reality TV show.

    Next up: kisses with Putin for the season 1 finale.
     
  16. mtbrays

    mtbrays Member
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    It's a tricky situation. Zelensky wants a ceasefire with security guarantees. Even if Trump were not in office, I don't think the American public would support that. But, Trumpism is an isolationist movement. It puts Zelensky behind the eight ball when combined with its leader's irrational temper, grudges, and ignorance about geopolitics.

    Disregarding Trump's odd reverence for Putin in particular, this is emblematic of how Trump views the world. He sees it as zero-sum and transactional. That's why he wants Ukraine's mineral rights and why he used to say we should've taken the oil from Iraq. He respects Putin's ability to unilaterally wage a war of ego, seize land, and rewrite history. There are no higher ideals for this man. It's why so many of us on the left get so angry at the Reagan-era Republicans who are now gleeful Trumpists; at least with Reagan they tried to convince us they had principles. Now it's nothing but ugly, transactional, id.

    All of that is to say that I kind of see Trump's point about not saying bad things about Putin in public if it's all about striking a deal! Where that falls apart is the utter lack of respect he shows every other Western leader in public. It isn't believable when he fawns over the Putins, Kims, and MBS' of the world.
     
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  17. Space Ghost

    Space Ghost Member

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    What does racist have to do with this thread? Clearly you're the war mongering racist.
     
  18. Aware

    Aware Member

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    nah, i stand by it.
    there is no other reason to be drawn to trump or the republican party right now.

    rule of law? nah ignore the courts. tightening the budget? nah lets get these tax cuts and add trillions to the debt. make america great again? nah fill positions with fox news personalities. show american strength abroad? nah lets pull out of nato

    you either have to have a real bad case of the brain worms, be a foreign agent, or find some of his dog whistle appealing to back him.
     
  19. Amiga

    Amiga Member

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    Looks very much pre-planned. It would be interesting to know what happened before this joint appearance on TV. I wouldn’t be surprised if he didn’t realize the details of the deal until later and decided it was unacceptable, planning this reality TV show to get a better deal.
     
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  20. Andre0087

    Andre0087 Member

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    I have news for you, they're waaay past first base...and it's still an embarrassment for the country.
     
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