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Ukraine

Discussion in 'BBS Hangout: Debate & Discussion' started by NewRoxFan, Nov 25, 2018.

  1. astros123

    astros123 Member

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    "The Bidens" lol Joe Biden did not have a single shell company anywhere. His son did not have any role in the government in any way. You have zero evidence joe biden ever did any favors on behalf of his son.

    Your cult hero is making billions on meme coins from unknown buyers on unregulated Chinese exchanges and you cry about Hunter Biden. Utterly hilarious
     
    AleksandarN, Nook and No Worries like this.
  2. Ottomaton

    Ottomaton Member
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    AGAIN for the thousandth time, THE UKRANIAN CONSTITUTION FORBIDS ELECTIONS DURING MARTIAL LAW. EXPLICITLY. It said that before Zelensky had anything at all to do with politics.

    Demand Ukraine do something "simple" that violates the basis of their entire legal system, and say if they dont do it they've proven they are corrupt.

    Very honest talking point. :rolleyes:
     
    #17262 Ottomaton, Feb 19, 2025
    Last edited: Feb 19, 2025
    AleksandarN, Nook, No Worries and 3 others like this.
  3. Reeko

    Reeko Member

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    imagine republicans calling Zelensky a dictator while they dick ride Putin
     
  4. Invisible Fan

    Invisible Fan Member

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    Been seeing David Sacks(Rome) retweets too often on here. He cries about dedollarization but fully backs crypto. Fitting as our new "Crypto Czar".

    Anyhow...

    David Sacks’ Ukraine-Russia commentary has gained traction on social media despite his lack of formal geopolitical expertise, driven by a confluence of narrative alignment, platform dynamics, and ideological signaling.

    Here’s why his views resonate:

    1. Anti-Establishment Branding
    Sacks positions himself as a contrarian truth-teller battling the “DC blob” and “neocon-leftist collusion.” This framing appeals to:
    • MAGA-aligned audiences skeptical of bipartisan foreign policy.
    • Tech libertarians distrustful of government intervention.
    • Anti-war progressives disillusioned by Iraq/Afghanistan parallels.
    His rhetoric—e.g., “Biden’s Backfire” and “Woke War III”—translates complex geopolitics into digestible culture-war slogans, amplifying shareability on platforms like Twitter/X.

    2. Algorithm-Friendly Simplicity
    Sacks’ arguments thrive on social media due to:
    • Provocative Soundbites: Claims like “NATO provoked Russia” or “Ukraine is a laundry machine for the deep state” cater to outrage-driven engagement.
    • Conspiracy-Adjacent Narratives: Echoing Kremlin talking points (e.g., blaming Ukraine for the 2024 Moscow terror attack without evidence) taps into distrust of mainstream media.
    • Populist Economics: Highlighting sanctions’ impact on U.S. gas prices and European far-right gains frames the war as a domestic burden, resonating with cost-of-living concerns.
    3. Platform Synergy
    • Podcast Megaphone: Co-hosting the All-In Podcast (1M+ listeners) provides a direct pipeline to tech elites and politically disaffected listeners.
    • Elon Musk Amplification: Musk’s endorsement of Sacks’ takes (e.g., calling them “accurate”) ensures viral reach among Musk’s 170M+ X followers.
    • Right-Wing Media Ecosystem: Sacks’ appearances on RealClearPolitics and Tucker Carlson’s network embed his views in pro-Trump media circuits.
    4. Ideological Utility for MAGA
    Sacks’ Ukraine stance serves as a gateway issue for broader GOP goals:Undermining Biden: Blaming Biden for “sabotaging peace” reinforces MAGA’s “America Last” narrative.
    • Dollar Weaponization: Linking dedollarization to Ukraine aid aligns with Trump’s push for Bitcoin reserves and anti-Fed policies.
    • Anti-Interventionist Coalition: Unites anti-war progressives, libertarians, and Tucker Carlson conservatives under a “peace through strength” banner.
    5. Silicon Valley Cred
    As a PayPal mafia member and Craft Ventures founder, Sacks leverages tech-bro authority to rebrand isolationism as “disruptive realism.” His critiques of “woke” defense contractors (despite investing in Palantir) appeal to anti-corporate sentiment, even as he profits from military-tech ventures.

    Why It Works Despite Expertise Gaps
    • Celebrity Over Credentials: Social media prioritizes clout over expertise. Sacks’ billionaire status and Trump fundraiser role grant him unearned foreign policy legitimacy.
    • Epistemic Nihilism: Platforms reward certainty over nuance. Sacks’ declarative style (“WWIII is imminent”) overshadows analysts’ caveats.
    • Tribal Affinity: Pro-Trump audiences interpret his Ukraine takes as loyalty tests, not policy debates. Critiquing Sacks becomes synonymous with attacking MAGA itself.
    Criticism & Contradictions
    While popular, Sacks’ views face pushback:Factual Inconsistencies: NATO’s defensive nature and Putin’s pre-2022 territorial ambitions contradict his “provocation” thesis.
    • Hypocrisy: Craft Ventures’ Palantir ties undercut his anti-war moralizing.
    • Amplifying Kremlin Narratives: His ISIS-K terror attack blame-shifting mirrored Russian state media (TASS/RT), raising kompromat speculation.
    Conclusion
    Sacks’ Ukraine commentary thrives not despite his lack of expertise, but because of it: his outsider status lets him weaponize anti-elite sentiment, while his tech pedigree and MAGA adjacency ensure algorithmic and tribal amplification. In an era where “vibes-based” foreign policy dominates social media, Sacks’ blend of contrarianism, catastrophe rhetoric, and Silicon Valley clout makes him a potent—if polarizing—voice.

     
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  5. Invisible Fan

    Invisible Fan Member

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    From @Os Trigonum favorite poop reading rag, the NY Post.

    Putin must think he's winning the propaganda war after listening to Musk and his pals on Twitter
    Dalibor Rohac 5-6 minutes 2/13/2024

    On my 2022 trip to Kyiv, I met Stas Aseyev, a Ukrainian journalist who had spent two and a half years in a secret, illegal prison in Donetsk, where he was tortured, electroshocked, placed in long solitary confinement and subjected to mock executions.

    His crime?

    Working as a stringer for the US-funded Radio Liberty, writing dispatches about life in the Russian-occupied territories.

    Stas was among the lucky ones.

    He was released in December 2019, scarred and malnourished, as part of a prisoner exchange instead of serving his full 15-year sentence, issued by the bogus “Supreme Court of the Donetsk People’s Republic.”

    Stas’ story encapsulates why Ukrainians fight.

    Russia’s war is not about territory or Russian President Vladimir Putin’s fears of Ukraine in NATO.

    As he told Tucker Carlson last week, Putin does not believe Ukraine is a real nation.
    This is a war of annihilation, in which Ukrainians — increasingly looking to the West and making real progress in building democratic institutions — are left with a choice between fighting or being assimilated into a Russian dystopia.

    Nobody brought up Stas’ story or Putin’s interview in the online Ukraine discussion Elon Musk and David Sacks hosted Monday night on Twitter/X Spaces.

    Instead, joined by three Republican senators opposing assistance to Ukraine — Ohio’s J.D. Vance, Wisconsin’s Ron Johnson and Utah’s Mike Lee — the panel sketched essentially an alternative version of the universe.

    In their world, US assistance to Ukraine serves only as a “fertilizer for the ego” of Washington elites, “adding fuel to the fire” without doing any favors to the Ukrainians, who would be better off trying to strike a deal with Putin.

    There was an opportunity to end the war, all participants agreed, during the negotiations in Turkey in March 2022.

    In their recounting, British Prime Minister Boris Johnson’s gung-ho rhetoric during his Kyiv visit encouraged Ukrainians to fight on, without a credible path to victory.

    Let us leave aside the fact it was around the same time the news of mass killings of Ukrainian civilians in Bucha came out — more than 400 of them found in basements shot point blank, often with their hands tied behind their backs.

    There was no indication then, as there is none now, the Kremlin is interested in anything short of a “de-Nazification and de-militarization” of Ukraine — i.e., its end as an independent country.

    The online event was replete with cognitive dissonance.

    On one hand, Vance recognized, correctly, just how “stressed” our defense-industrial base is, leaving us vulnerable to a conflict in the Indo-Pacific.

    Of course, most appropriated funds have been spent in the United States to replenish our stocks and place contracts for modern weapons systems while older ones are being transferred to Ukraine.


    At the same time, however, Johnson wondered: If we are going to spend $60 billion to help Ukraine, can’t we just spend less on other items in the Pentagon budget?

    Much of the conversation revolved around corruption and “blank checks” to Ukraine’s leadership, ignoring the scrutiny from three US inspectors general, European Union institutions and the World Bank — just to name a few.

    Thanks to GPS trackers, we know that Western weapons systems have invariably reached Ukraine’s front lines instead of the black markets.


    America’s financial assistance to Ukraine, meanwhile, has been modest compared with the contributions of European nations.

    And it was Lee and his allies this week who thwarted efforts at amending the supplemental bill in the Senate, thus killing Sen. Dan Sullivan’s (R-Alaska) proposal to drop the financial, nonlethal part of the assistance.

    For the three Republican senators and their tech-savvy hosts, it was obvious that Russia, a country with a smaller gross domestic product than Italy, would not lose the war in Ukraine.

    “No way in hell,” Musk said.

    Americans should think twice about what the emerging conventional wisdom on the right means.

    If the United States is unable or unwilling to sacrifice 5% of its defense budget (mostly spent at home) to teach Putin a lesson in Ukraine, then we may as well forget about geopolitical competition with China and start taking Mandarin lessons.


    Dalibor Rohac is a senior fellow at the American Enterprise Institute.
     
  6. astros123

    astros123 Member

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    This is such a ****ing crazy thing to say. He's just openly lying and spewing disinformation. If you want Ukraine to settle @Space Ghost and a end to the war that's fine but do that **** in private. Bashing and spewing lies towards a war time president is just sicko stuff.

    Youre the damn President of the free world. Have some damn respect of the office.
     
    Space Ghost and dmoneybangbang like this.
  7. DatRocketFan

    DatRocketFan Member

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    I just find it wild that conservatives in our country have an utter disdain towards the liberal/left calling them communist and whatnot.

    Meanwhile the orange one is cozying up to fking putin while calling Zelensky a dictator. not to mention we have some conservatives supporter waving the fking nazi flag of all things. not a fking peep from the conservatives on this outlandish behavior

    I swear these guys will sell out our country if it means owning the left. Patriotism my ass
     
  8. astros123

    astros123 Member

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    Every "leftist" President is backing Ukraine and claiming what Trump wants is insane. When you lose socialist presidents with your conspiracies you're in a very very bad place
     
  9. mvpcrossxover

    mvpcrossxover Member

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  10. El_Conquistador

    El_Conquistador King of the D&D, The Legend, #1 Ranking

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    LOL, that's true of MULTIPLE of the Trump indictments! Including the "conviction" in NY. And the scandal with Hunter is what he WASN'T charged with -- which was selling access to the US government. And drugs. And wire fraud. And failing to register as a foreign agent (what they convicted Manafort on)...

    Libs don't even realize how out of touch they are! Every. Single. Time.


    GOOD DAY
     
    Space Ghost likes this.
  11. pgabriel

    pgabriel Educated Negro

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    I'm watching a Putin documentary. It was a joke when W said he looked into his eyes and saw his soul. One of the people on the documentary, he saw his soul, whatever that means

    Then he played W, and he is playing Trump.
     
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  12. pgabriel

    pgabriel Educated Negro

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    One of the the themes in the documentary is how the hard right aligns with Putin. Sad state of our affairs
     
  13. heymak

    heymak Member

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    This is not the republican party, this is MAGA. Reagan and his crew are rolling over in their graves. As a cold war veteran, I find it disheartening to watch the decades of service of our veterans and state department unraveled by these MAGA Russian sympathizers.
     
  14. Andre0087

    Andre0087 Member

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    All the experienced adults with a sense of morality have left this administration, there are no guardrails left except for the courts...God help us.

    [​IMG]
     
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  15. Space Ghost

    Space Ghost Member

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    uKraNiaN lAw FoR bIdS eLeCtIoNs WhEn tHe PrEsIdEnT dEcLaReS hImSeLf dIcTaToR.
     
  16. Space Ghost

    Space Ghost Member

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    Two things can be true at once. If I were extremely wealthy, I would have a couple residences in Europe. Much of it is beautiful and a great place to live.
    Also for clarification, I never said they were worthless. Inefficient and short sighted, yes. Its almost as if the entire continent forgets it gets razed every 100 years or so and they are sitting around on their asses saying 'this time its different if we can stop rUsSiA'.


    The Three Body problem always interested me, especially in game theory. US, Russia and China can not independently exists from each other. Its quite obvious Russia is the slow gazelle here. The US has always turned a blind eye when it suits them, but here we are, somehow convinced ourselves Ukraine has always been and always will be the future beacon of American democracy. I have compassion for any soldier dying on that battlefield who wishes not to be there. I really do not give a rats ass about Ukraine or Russia's sovereignty, both highly corrupt countries.

    A couple points-
    Its not America's responsibility to rule the globe.
    Its my belief that we are quickly approaching peak American hegemony. The US will still be the superpower well past my lifetime, however we live in a very different era and the controls used to keep every other country on this globe in submission is unraveling.
    We need to strengthen our neighbors. The US has this issue of keeping countries dependent. Like a parent who is more interested in spoiling their kids for peace and acceptance instead of raising them to be their best version, the US does the same to our neighbors. We need strong neighbors, not strong enough to stay sovereign but weak enough to never pose a threat.

    I wish as humans we cared more about our species than we do our tribe. But yet I am the racist/bigot who wants inclusion for all instead of driving out anyone who disagrees with me while hanging a rainbowed banner of inclusion and diversity.
     
  17. Commodore

    Commodore Member

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  18. sealclubber1016

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    "He's not actually on Russia's side he just wants Europe to pull it own weight"

    "Well we really shouldn't be financing this at all and should stay out of it"

    "Ukraine was the aggressor and started this whole thing, Russia is the victim"

    There's no line too far for Trumpers, they will follow their god king and defend his every choice to the bitter end. No matter what he says they will twist themselves into supporting it. "Owning the libs" is literally all Trump has to do in their book.
     
  19. El_Conquistador

    El_Conquistador King of the D&D, The Legend, #1 Ranking

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    What is the Over/Under on the timeline before Zelensky is out of power? 60 days?
     
    Bandwagoner likes this.
  20. No Worries

    No Worries Member

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    What is your obsession with facts with known liberal bias? Are you a commie?
     

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