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For those hating on Fred VanVleet...

Discussion in 'Houston Rockets: Game Action & Roster Moves' started by shakes05, Nov 1, 2023.

  1. Dankstronaut

    Dankstronaut Way, way out here.

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  2. OremLK

    OremLK Member

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    Amid all the hubbub about JG's hot streak, FVV has quietly been a lot better recently. Going to contradict my own pet peeve and do the #ArbitraryEndpoints thing: Over the past month (14 games) he is shooting 38.6% from three on 7.2 attempts.

    My larger point with this is not "he is hot therefore he is good". I see it more as regression to the mean (upward in this case? Progression?)

    Gotta remember this guy is a 37.2% career three point shooter. I don't see any reason to believe he would suddenly become a 33% guy right when he turns 30 without any major injuries to mess things up. I expect him to continue shooting well the rest of the season.
     
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  3. MystikArkitect

    Supporting Member

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    God damn sometimes I forget how much of a blessing it is to argue about Jalen's current form, Reed's future or Amen's handles when we used to have Kevin Porter Jr and Christian Wood on this team.
     
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  4. bluffkin

    bluffkin Member

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    What do y'all think we do this offseason? Bring him back for one last year or will Amen, Sheppard and Holiday be ready to take over?
     
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  5. A_3PO

    A_3PO Member

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    FVV might return, but it won't be as a starter.
     
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  6. topfive

    topfive CF OG

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    Harden would have also brought back his ego, so we'd get the constant strip clubs, Vegas trips on off days, wanting special treatment, and an offense centered around him. You don't need this sh!te on a team full of youngsters. I loved Harden during his time here, but he would have been a terrible choice for this team.

    FVV, on the other hand, brought a strong work ethic, fewer turnovers, and no drama at all.
     
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  7. sealclubber1016

    Supporting Member

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    Once Jalen started playing better he willingly took a reduced role in the offense, exactly like he should have. That was the goal all along for him to be phased out of the scoring load, but nobody was playing well enough to do it in the halfcourt. His 3 point shooting was always gonna improve. He's a proven good shooter that just had a slow start.

    FVV has done literally everything the team could have hoped for when they signed him in terms of helping an extremely young team take a leap. We went from the worst team in the NBA to possibly a 55 win team with him carrying an extremely heavy load. Somehow people still act like some other guy would have been better for the franchise and that he's holding us down, it's absurd.

    He is overpaid, in a way that is completely inconsequential and has no effect on our ability to make moves. Whether he was making 40 million or 15 million means nothing to our roster building. They had to overpay him to entice him to this dumpster fire.
     
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  8. Newlin

    Newlin Member

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    Well, Fred gets the last laugh because he has a ring, he’s helped to turn a franchise around, and he makes 43 million per year. It’s good to be Fred.
     
  9. VoR

    VoR Member

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    Fred is overpaid, but he is one of the better defending PGs in the league and can have some games where he goes off. With that being said, if we can get Sexton or Booker, I'm all for it. If we ride him into next season because the PG market is so thin, then there's still lots of potential to go on a run with him on the roster.
     
  10. pmac

    pmac Member

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    Pick up the option and extend the contract on a relatively low number.
     
  11. Furious Jam

    Furious Jam Member

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    On a championship team, Fred would be a 6th man. I mean, that was his exact role on the Raptors.
     
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  12. DaDakota

    DaDakota Balance wins
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    He was the right guy for the right time, next year he needs to be gone, as we have better players, and unless he wants to play backup PG, he won't be needed.

    DD
     
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  13. Little Bit

    Little Bit Member

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    None of those guys are ready and Holiday is not a point guard. Anybody watching the games can see how sloppy the Rockets are when FVV doesn’t play. In tight games that makes the difference between winning and losing like what we saw in Sacramento.
     
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  14. topfive

    topfive CF OG

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    Fred was our vet point guard for Rebuild Phase 2 (make the playoffs again). Next season we'll be on to Phase 3 (contend for the title) and we might not need a traditional PG at all. And if we happened to hit Phase 3 this season, Fred has earned the right to come along for the ride.
     
  15. ThatBoyNick

    ThatBoyNick Member

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    You talkin bout them Vaters? Vuck the Vaters…
     
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  16. withmustard

    withmustard Member

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    I feel encouraged that we are hitting phase 3 this season. We were a top 4 team all season having one of the least efficient 2-guards in the league getting heavy minutes. Now, said 2 guard has transformed into the MVP caliber player we thought we had to trade for. I don't trust Jalen yet, but IF this him finally figuring it out, we should be there, not mention the development of lots of the youth.

    All this said, I'd like to see a convincing win over each of the 3 teams above us, including a healthy OKC. The Boston game we seemed at tier below, maybe it was just a bad night. Grabbing a win in one of the upcoming CLE games will be big to see where we are.

    Now back to FVV, I don't feel we have time to "take Fred for the ride". I'm no Bima, but we can trade for salary equal to Fred's this season, but we couldn't pay someone else the same money in the offseason as a free agent if we drop Fred. The Rockets are on the clock before they have to pay Jabari, Tari, Amen and Cam. There won't be big $$ to go around after we make Amen the highest paid player on the team next summer, we basically have to trade at least 1, maybe 2 of the aforementioned names. Don't forget about Jalen and maybe Alperen dropping their PO in 18 months and signing a max, if they're deserving at the time. This isn't far from the predicament OKC was in when they gifted us Harden.

    I honestly don't know if keeping or dumping Fred is the right move, I try to play devil's advocate. The biggest counter argument for all my reasons for dumping Fred is, there really isn't anyone worth trading for that would match FVV salary and upgrade the team. Other factors to not rush would be not trusting Jalen's consistency (we've been fooled before) or Tari's health.

    These next 2 weeks will speak volumes as to whether we are a contender or not. We could easily drop from 4th in the league, to losing HCA in the 1st round.
     
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  17. DaDakota

    DaDakota Balance wins
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    As I said, next year.

    DD
     
  18. vince

    vince Member

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    Well the Rockets are going to need money to extend Jabari and Tari this offseason. The following offseason, it will be time to pay Amen and Cam.

    It’s a great time to be a Rocket, as all 6 of the 1st rounders are rounding into NBA star form!

    I think Reed is doing his thing at practice, and the Rockets brass seems quite pleased. So as Vanvleet is eventually going to be on the move, be it this offseason or next. Though it could be another Altuve situation where so many of us were expecting Delino DeShields to take 2nd base by the horn, yet Altuve quietly said, “hold my beer”. And DeShields isn’t even in the Majors anymore, yet Altuve is still an allstar.
     
  19. Losmi_34

    Losmi_34 Member

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    I would keep Fred, if he could accept a Brooks type deal.
     
  20. bilaal14

    bilaal14 Member

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    I love FVv he is a veterans vet and helps the young guys zone in.

    People just hate on him for no reason. He isn’t the best scorer, but his defense goes a long way.
     

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