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Jalen Green will be the Rockets' Numero Uno

Discussion in 'Houston Rockets: Game Action & Roster Moves' started by kpdark, Jan 2, 2024.

  1. fchowd0311

    fchowd0311 Member

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    I think asking a bunch of young dudes to give the effort on defense he asks for will harm scoring efficiency. Doesn't mean the young players can't eventually grow the cardio conditioning over repetition of this consist level of defense game in and game out.

    Young NBA players are less injury prone and suffer from things like soreness and ligament pain less than vets but vets usually have better cardio conditioning because the amount of NBA games under their belt.

    I think what Ime is doing for these guys now will benefit their careers in the long run.
     
  2. astrosrule

    astrosrule Member

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    There's some validity to that idea for sure, no way to know either way though if you believe the current performance is not their real ability level.
     
  3. fchowd0311

    fchowd0311 Member

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    Do you genuinely think a player like Green at age 22 has reached his max ability? You understand a lot of all time greats had their rookie season at Green's current age.
     
  4. BigMaloe

    BigMaloe Member

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    Could i interest you in the idea that he really just needs 1 more 3 every 4 games to become league average efficency.

    Does that seem plausible?

    Because the following has been said by both sides, league average or better efficiency Jalen, with this defense, is a star.

    I think the confusion came from the original posters sloppy representation of the leap Jalen needs to make. Its not that grandeous of an improvement needed.
     
  5. peleincubus

    peleincubus Member

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    I don’t think there is any arguing that these guys would collectively have better shooting numbers if they were not so good on defense. Over the next few seasons they will be asked to maintain the defensive prowess while getting better on offense. Hopefully it happens.
     
    kpdark and fchowd0311 like this.
  6. astrosrule

    astrosrule Member

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    Of course he can improve, anyone can. He’ll be 23 in a couple weeks and has played like 8500 minutes though. Idk what Duncan or bird or whoever being a rookie at 22 matters to anything?
     
  7. fchowd0311

    fchowd0311 Member

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    Brain development aren't finished until around age 25. Peak physical prime for a human is between 25-30. There are basic things that have nothing to do with minutes that will allow Green to improve most importantly for Green, conditioning to be a consistent shooter while being a high usage offensive player and high energy defender.

    HIs first two seasons didn't train him with that conditioning also thanks to a certain former coach.
     
    Chad Butler, kpdark and gfab-babyboi like this.
  8. astrosrule

    astrosrule Member

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    His shooting is EXTREMELY consistent year to year actually
     
  9. kpdark

    kpdark Member

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  10. kpdark

    kpdark Member

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  11. kpdark

    kpdark Member

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  12. Roomba

    Roomba Member

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    And I think this is through a minor injury too! He’s been icing up his legs in the last two games (and he definitely wasn’t as explosive as usual against the Wizards). I don’t believe in “turning the corner” but I do believe in progress. And we are seeing progress! Just got to stay healthy and if Jalen keeps playing like this, the Rockets will be even better
     
  13. kpdark

    kpdark Member

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  14. Stephen_A

    Stephen_A Member

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    No, using league avg alone is flawed. League avg as used here by many fans to include the entire league including non starters and big men etc who have a high TS% and misrepresents the data. Some have compared to other guards but again that list is usually the entire NBA. You need to compare him to other starting guards with similar numbers such as minutes, FGA etc.

    I used NBA.com and compared the TS% of guards and filtered for:
    Starting Guards with:
    >=32 min a game
    >=25 games played
    >=16 FGA per game


    This gave me 20 results. Avg 58%
    Highest TS% was Lavine at 64%.
    Num 2: SGA 63%
    Num 3 Norman Powell. 62%
    Num 4: Herro 61%


    Powell’s TS% is better than Tatum (60%) Fox (58%) Booker (57%) and Anthony Edwards (58%)

    Are these players not as good as Lavine? Powell?

    Below avg TS%: Booker (57%) Jaylen Brown (55%) Maxey (54%) Jalen Green (53%) Trae Young (56%), Jalen Williams (55%)

    Is Norman Powell better than Maxey? Is Herro better than Booker? I think not.

    TS% doesn’t measure a player’s complete value or even offensive value. It’s not a measurement of who’s a better player than whom. It’s simply a measurement of how many points a player scored per shooting possession (scoring efficiency). But fans see this and either think it’s shooting efficiency or they think it measures how good a player is. It doesn’t measure either.

    THIS IS WHY PICKING AND CHOOSING METRICS WITHOUT MORE DATA AND BACKED WITH GAME OBSERVATION IS ARBRITRARY!
     
  15. kpdark

    kpdark Member

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  16. Corrosion

    Corrosion Member

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    It's not about simply making one more shot per game, it's about consistency - even if the math is one more shot per game in the totals. That's not contextually correct.

    Less games where he shoots poorly and more games where he shoots average or better.

    This season, much like last year, he's wildly inconsistent game to game - which Jalen shows up.

    Last season he had 43 games where he shot .286 or worse from three and 27 games where he shot .400 or better.
    Last season he had 58 games where he shot below league average from the floor and 24 games where he shot league average or better.

    This season 19 games below .286 from three and 10 at .400 or above.

    This season 28 games below league average from the field and only 8 games where he shot league average or better (from the floor).
    He doesn't simply need to make one more three per game, he needs to eliminate most of the poor shooting nights. Tho it has the same impact on his season totals, it's not the same thing.
     
    #10096 Corrosion, Jan 8, 2025
    Last edited: Jan 8, 2025
  17. fchowd0311

    fchowd0311 Member

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    Here are the scoring efficiencies for the three main shot creators on this team:
    Fred: 50% ts
    Jalen: 54% ts
    Alpi: 54.2% ts

    Seems like it's just hard to score efficiently on this offense if you are a primary shot creator on the team. Probably due to the energy they are expected to expend on the other end.
     
  18. Corrosion

    Corrosion Member

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    Or maybe perhaps of them are particularly efficient offensive players ?
     
  19. fchowd0311

    fchowd0311 Member

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    Besides Fred's rookie season these are career low scoring efficiency numbers for both.


    So Green could have improved relative to the new dedication to defense that is dedicating more went to that side.
     
  20. Mr. Dominant

    Mr. Dominant Member

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