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[NY Post] Trump wants to buy Greenland, again, after claiming US could take back ownership of Panama

Discussion in 'BBS Hangout: Debate & Discussion' started by Os Trigonum, Dec 23, 2024.

  1. Os Trigonum

    Os Trigonum Member
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    Morey surprise.gif
     
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  2. FranchiseBlade

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    We do have an idea that isn't for sale. They have said it isn't for sale. To speculate otherwise is believing something contrary to all available information.

    Yes. Politicians don't always tell the truth. Or things change. The leader of Denmark expressly said that it isn't for sale.

    The person with least reliable record for being honest is the president elect.
     
  3. Os Trigonum

    Os Trigonum Member
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    Thinking Through a Greenland Purchase

    https://chartercitiesinstitute.org/blog-posts/thinking-through-a-greenland-purchase/

    excerpt:

    A purchase of Greenland should only go forward if Greenlanders themselves are broadly supportive of such a move. Overt annexation is not and should not be considered an option. However, the question of a “sale” of territory is really the wrong framing for this discussion. Greenland was granted home rule by the government of Denmark in 1979, followed by full self-government in 2009. So while Greenland remains under the sovereignty of Denmark, in practical terms it really isn’t Denmark’s to sell. Denmark isn’t going to sell Greenland if Greenlanders don’t want it, in addition to Denmark’s own strategic reasons to want to retain Greenland. A more accurate framing might be to say that the US wants to buy sovereignty over Greenland, from Greenland itself, rather than purely as a deal with Denmark which ignores Greenlandic agency in the matter.

    ***
    It’s hard to gauge exactly how the Greenlandic public would feel about an American purchase absent a specific price. Given the support reported for full independence from Denmark, it’s unlikely that Greenlanders would respond positively to the United States simply taking Denmark’s place in the abstract. Let’s say, however, that the United States offers to pay $500 billion for Greenland, which is paid out equally to every Greenlandic citizen. This works out to about $8.7 million per person. What’s the price elasticity of sovereignty for the average Greenlander? An $8.7 million check might change some minds, but it does not seem far-fetched to suggest that sovereignty might be a very price inelastic good for Greenlanders passionate about their independence.
    emphasis added. more at the link

     
  4. dobro1229

    dobro1229 Member

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    You could say the same thing about anywhere. Denmark has about as much incentive to sell as we do with Alaska. We probably have a greater longterm risk of needing to sell property given our national debt.

    If you are really that concerned about Greenland and China then the right strategy would be to stay as closely tied to NATO as possible and maintain close diplomatic ties to Denmark. They know the US would buy if they ever put it up for sale. You don’t have to use these bully tactics and implied threats. Trumps antics would make Denmark more likely to want to sell elsewhere if they were open to it just to spite Trump.

    That’s why the implied threat is a real thing you are trying to act coy about and gaslight as though there’s no way one could interpret an implied threat. You said it yourself you just like fcking with “libs” so you have already shown your hand of bad faith argumentation.

    So either you want Trump to be a tyrant who invades Neignbors to take land and resources for conquest or you can argue for closer ties to NATO allies in order to thwart Chinese and Russian influence. Any other argument is about as incoherent as Trumps tweets at 3AM.
     
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  5. Os Trigonum

    Os Trigonum Member
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    lol lefties super triggered
     
  6. Tomstro

    Tomstro Member

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    No need to invade Denmark. I’ve said that all along. And **** the UN.
     
  7. Kemahkeith

    Kemahkeith Member
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    Bring the kind folks of Greenland some Starbucks
    And Chipotle franchises. That could change some things.
    Pumpkin spice holds a certain amount of clout.
     
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  8. TimDuncanDonaut

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    Instead of buying Greenland, how about selling Puerto Rico. They are again without electricity.

    Sell it to a someone who will love, cherish, and take care of Puerto Rico. :p

    With the sale money, U.S. can pay off some of the national debt.:cool:
     
  9. Os Trigonum

    Os Trigonum Member
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    https://www.wsj.com/opinion/buying-...vereignty-2a003c35?mod=hp_opin_pos_2#cxrecs_s

    Buying Greenland Isn’t a New Idea
    Denmark wanted to sell it a century ago. The U.S. didn’t bite but did acquire the Virgin Islands.
    By Steven Press
    Jan. 1, 2025 at 12:12 pm ET

    Critics are sharpening their pens to excoriate President Trump for again proposing to purchase Greenland. The real-estate baron wants to buy not only the land but also Greenland’s political sovereignty. Many commentators derided the idea when Mr. Trump raised it during his first term. Then and now, the discussion could use a healthy dose of historical perspective.

    In 2019, Denmark, which holds sovereignty over Greenland, deemed the president’s idea ridiculous. In the U.S., critics lambasted his project as megalomaniacal or un-American.

    But the idea isn’t outlandish or unique to Mr. Trump. Politicians from all parties have negotiated such deals throughout U.S. history. Thomas Jefferson made the Louisiana Purchase and then flirted with buying Cuba. As secretary of state, John Quincy Adams arranged debt relief for Spain in exchange for Florida. Secretary of State William Seward acquired Alaska. What Mr. Trump proposes is consistent with this American tradition—and with our current borders. Sovereignty purchases are responsible for more than 40% of U.S. land.

    Further, this practice has had international approval. When Spain, France, Mexico and Russia sold to America the lands that now make up a large portion of our country, they recognized the legitimacy of such transactions.

    Purchasing sovereignty has been an accepted custom of international law for centuries. The unification of Germany in the 19th century involved real-estate transactions in which states mixed sovereignty, property and money. In 1898, Imperial Germany leased sovereignty over Qingdao, a settlement on China’s Shandong Peninsula. Later that year, the U.K. leased from China sovereignty over a piece of land further south, in Kowloon. That land became a crucial part of a now-familiar trade hub: Hong Kong.

    Though Danish leaders today imply that the idea of selling sovereignty is out of touch with their national values, the country has a long history of doing just that. In 1845, the king of Denmark accepted millions of rupees from the East India Co. to transfer control over multiple Danish hubs in India. In the early 1900s, Denmark’s leadership, despairing over the loss of Schleswig-Holstein to Bismarck’s Prussia, floated a possible sale of Greenland to the U.S. The U.S. didn’t agree but in January 1917 paid $25 million to Denmark for another remote Danish possession of strategic importance—now the U.S. Virgin Islands.

    The world of 1917 isn’t the world of 2024, but it’s ahistoric to dismiss purchasing Greenland as a ludicrous idea. It’s better to scrutinize the terms of a potential agreement—particularly how it might affect Greenlanders themselves.

    Many of the precedents that legitimate Mr. Trump’s proposal for Greenland are tainted by terms that treated the people of the purchased lands as pawns. These arrangements were made without popular consent and sometimes involved coercion. Mr. Trump would need to improve upon his predecessors’ work in this respect, and it’d be a tough sell to the Greenlanders, whose prime minister has declared the island “not for sale.”

    Still, the people of Greenland could gain from a deal with Mr. Trump. History suggests the benefits of being open-minded about this. Inhabitants of Alaska wouldn’t be better off under Russian sovereignty. Bringing Greenlanders into closer affiliation with the U.S., and sweetening the deal with economic subsidies, could conceivably prove beneficial to all parties. It’ll be a complicated decision for Greenland, which will have to weigh the material and defense benefits against other considerations, not least the principle of national self-determination.

    In 1946, long before any Dane had heard of Mr. Trump, America made a formal offer of $100 million to buy Greenland, recognizing the strategic importance of the land to U.S. interests. Though the Danes didn’t say yes at the time, it’d be good for political commentators to keep in mind that this idea is neither new nor radical. At least so we might be spared spurious indignation.

    Mr. Press is an associate professor of history at Stanford.





     
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  10. FranchiseBlade

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    Not a new idea. Just a new idea for the modern age.
     
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  11. Os Trigonum

    Os Trigonum Member
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  12. Invisible Fan

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    Trump just found the most beautiful solution for zoomer homeownership.
     
  13. pgabriel

    pgabriel Educated Negro

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    We could buy Canada and Mexico, no inflation creating tariffs and rename the country the United States of North America
     
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  14. FranchiseBlade

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    Teddy Roosevelt actually had that same idea.
     
  15. pgabriel

    pgabriel Educated Negro

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    The. United States imports $26mm in goods from Greenland. Why would do we need to buy it? We have plenty of fish and lobster
     
  16. Exiled

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    lol
    There's no enough fund to buy hot lunch for FEMA . In unlikely event of hostile take over , US remap will shrink to Texas ,Florida and the swamp States in between. NY ,California and West Coast will elect to join Canada
     
  17. Buck Turgidson

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    The best part of this is that you and Orange Julius Caesar think all 3 of those things are the same size.
     
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  18. Sweet Lou 4 2

    Sweet Lou 4 2 Member

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    Let's see

    Denmark is a country at severe risk from oceans rising. Owns a massive island full of ice. Why wouldn't it want to sell it to a country that wants to melt it down lol?
     
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  19. Commodore

    Commodore Member

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    Greenlanders are going to vote for independence and then Trump will pay them with cash or resource development sharing to join the US. It's too attractive a deal to pass up.

     
  20. HTM

    HTM Member

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    Greenland is much better off being part of Denmark or the U.S.

    The appeal of independence is entirely emotional.

    Pragmatically, independence would likely be a disaster for the people of Greenland.

    See the differing fates of Mayotte and Comoros for a historical lesson on this.
     
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