If this was 2016 sure... but I would respectfully remind you guys that Donald Trump just won the presidency in 2024 as a convicted felon who has promised to be a dictator on day 1, and nominated Kash Patel to be FBI Director. I don't think people have really come to grips yet with where we are about to be as a Democracy with any sort of lingering values. The era of "Presidential Restraint" is gone. The era of Democratic values is toast. The only question is what happens as a reaction to whatever is coming after the Trump 2.0 reign of hell. It sure as sh$t won't look like anything that came before, and the electorate will view opposition "restraint" as weakness. The opposition to Trump will be demanding action. Not restraint. I'd love to opine over the better days that is represented at the Magic Kingdom's Hall of Presidents, or at the Lincoln Memorial, or whatnot. But that's history now, and the Presidency moving forward is sadly a relic of the past. The position along with the rest of our governing makeup will need to be reformed after what is coming regardless. So again with all due respect, I would encourage folks to maybe come to grips a little bit more about the realities of "Presidential Restraint." In 2028 we are most likely looking at either a radical opposition and reform party that is running against Trump AND Biden, or we are looking at a subservient, and weak Democratic party that will lose in perpetuity, and only stand there as a punching bag for the MAGA right who will rule over us as a monarchy for generations. *Also... if this was your son or daughter who was about to be the subject of the ire of a Trump "Justice" Department, I'm sure you would do the exact same thing to protect your family over any sort of loyalty to a memory of an era of Presidential decorum. Just look at how these MAGA posters are FURIOUS today that they won't get to see Hunter rakes over the coals for their entertainment. Go look at the poster above my post's retweet as evidence to this. Trump knows his base wants the entertainment of a Hunter Biden prosecution. Knowing this as a father I know you'd do the same thing to protect your son or daughter from this disturbing blood lust from the masses of Trump supporters.
related After Hunter’s Pardon, It’s Time To Prosecute The Rest Of The Biden Crime Family https://thefederalist.com/2024/12/02/after-hunters-pardon-its-time-to-prosecute-the-rest-of-the-biden-crime-family/
It's a noble sentiment. But no one would have left his own child dangling for this incoming administration to maul, given the circumstances. As far as "any crimes [Hunter Biden] may have committed," well, so far we have a gun charge and tax evasion. And dipshi**ery.
It would be time if there were actual crimes committed. We haven't seen evidence of any so far, despite hearings and investigations.
Yep. Just look here at the anger that MAGA posters are spewing because they are mad they are denied this public lynching. It's all the evidence any father would need here to justify saving a family member... especially your lone remaining son after losing your other Son and wife... from this mob of blood thirsty crazy people. Biden knows that Trump knows his people, and the entertainment his mob needs to satisfy their lust for more Hunter Biden content. Decorum, and norms doesn't mean sh$t when you are a father and it is your kid that is about to be public enemy #1 of this mob.
Joe Pardons Hunter https://reason.com/2024/12/02/joe-pardons-hunter/ excerpt: In his statement, Biden attempted to justify the pardon on the grounds that "no reasonable person who looks at the facts of Hunter's cases can reach any other conclusion than Hunter was singled out only because he is my son." In terms of the gun conviction, there's some truth to that. As Reason's Jacob Sullum has argued, the statute that Hunter violated is "widely flouted, haphazardly enforced, and constitutionally dubious." The tax fraud issue is another matter; such charges are "routinely brought against people who are not political targets," argues The Atlantic's Jonathan Chait. More seriously, the presidential pardon is so robust that it offers Hunter Biden protection from as yet unproven allegations of influence peddling on behalf of foreign business interests. An earlier attempt to grant Hunter such protection in exchange for pleading guilty on tax-related offenses collapsed after a federal judge balked at the degree of immunity being conferred on him. There's no sugarcoating what the elder Biden has done: He has issued what may well be remembered as the most disreputable presidential pardon in the U.S. history, and he has done it at a time when his party is attempting to make the argument that President-elect Donald Trump is a unique and pernicious threat to democracy, law and order, and American political norms. more at the link
What I would do isn't really relevant. I'm not qualified to be President of the United States, nor am I willing to make the personal sacrifices the job requires. As I said, I understand it's a difficult decision to make on a personal level. But this is the job Biden wanted.
I agree with you. But I also allow more allowance for understanding given that the incoming administration campaigned on being vengeful and using the DOJ to bring about as much revenge against perceived political opponents as possible. It isn't unreasonable to believe that had Trump lost the election, the pardon wouldn't have been issued. I still agree with you that the best presidential example would have been to not pardon, Hunter, but it adds to the factors that could have contributed.
Nor is anybody really. We are all humans, and flawed. This idea that the presidency is anointed with honor, and valor kind of smoke and mirrors. The Constitution requires a powerful Congress to ensure we don't need anointed rulers. The Presidency is designed to be a custodial managerial position. Not an anointed monarch. You are right though that this is the job Biden wanted. You do put your family in the cross hairs if you put yourself in this position so it was unwise of him to run if he knew half of what Hunter was sticking his nose into... quite literally. Of course again... he is human, and as a father sometimes you are blind to see your own kids faults. So it happens, but yeah he shouldn't have run to begin with if having to pardon his son was baked in. I would just say it actually does matter what you or I would do. I would disagree with that notion that this is a position where we should bypass the human element of decision making because in the end we are all looking for a business reason to make personal decisions to justify. Even if you look at the Bible and the story of Abraham as an example of the ultimate sacrifice, Abraham didn't even go through with that sacrifice although the Bible makes it look as though he was willing to kill his kid for God, we don't actually see him go through with it. It's a philosophical question about the human nature of sacrifice and family. I don't know that we need to say one way or another what someone should or shouldn't do in these cases, but in this case.. yeah don't put yourself in a position to choose to begin with if you don't have to. Joe Biden shouldn't have run in 2020 if Hunter Biden was compromised for sure.
5 pages in less than 12 hours... I'd say the volume of the MAGA posts here speaks enough. You guys are obviously worked up about this.
Where have you been since 2016? It has been a circus for almost a decade. Once a President opens up a door - it is almost always followed by the next President. Expect a lot of pardons and questionable BS for the foreseeable future until the American people decide that they will not tolerate it.
I'm old enough to remember when they were all peddling the lie that the laptop story was Russian disinformation. Also the "they're persecuting my son card" is wildly pathetic.
I asked you to quote the angry people in this thread. All you told me is this thread is 5 pages long, which any literate person can see. Further, I also stated I have no problems with Biden pardoning Hunter. I simply said Democrats were hypocrites for getting ragey when Trump threatened to pardon people AND democrats/biden stated they would do the 'right' thing and not pardon Hunter. Again. Hypocrites. You guys are the brain washed Republican Christians of the 60's. Rules for thee, not for me. That is the modern Democrat message.
These are all things he has said he would do before.... the man he just appointed as head of the FBI has said that he and Trump will be looking for revenge, hunting people down....... It is going to be a blood bathe and there will continue to be questionable behavior across the board until the American people decide they will only vote for ethical people.... but I don't think that happens anytime soon.
You are projecting onto "Democrats" what you want us to be. Nobody on the left is going crazy to defend the honor of Hunter Biden. Most if not all of us were totally down with booting Joe Biden out when it was clear he was not an effective enough communicator at his age to run in 24. Most are upset for him not getting out sooner, and his handlers for thinking they could shield him through a rigorous campaign. That's not fealty like Republican Christians in the 60's like you'd like us to be. I don't know what liberal chick ghosted you or whatnot to make you so damn grievanced by Democrats but it's pretty sad. We aren't who you want us to be so you can have that villain you think you need in your life. Nobody gives a sh$t on the left about Hunter Biden. There's an interesting deeper conversation to be had about family, honor, the presidency as defined by the constitution, and all that BS, but the subject of Hunter Biden and his endeavors is all you guys, and your desire to have a scalp of a Democrat to prosecute for some reason to make yourself feel like your side isn't all that bad. And please doing even try to gaslight Democrats for being "ragey" about Trump. You aren't going to gaslight us into believing that Trump becoming president again in 2024 wasn't an existential threat to our country. If you think it isnt then just wait about 6 months. Happy to be wrong, and for you to come back here to tell us how wrong we were about Trump, and how he really was just a normal John McCain Republican who had no intention of overturning Democratic norms, and corrupting our Constitution.
