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Ukraine

Discussion in 'BBS Hangout: Debate & Discussion' started by NewRoxFan, Nov 25, 2018.

  1. SamFisher

    SamFisher Member

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    Can't believe we're on page 833 of the thread with people not getting this piece - but Russia unilaterally invaded Ukraine because they are a territorial empire that wants to conquer it & run it as a puppet state like in the USSR days.

    Has nothing to do with NATO & the US, other than that Russia, our enemy, wants bad things for NATO and the US.
     
    Nook, ROCKSS, MadMax and 2 others like this.
  2. ArtV

    ArtV Member

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    Ukraine seriously start the peace agreement. Not sure if Putin will listen at this point but the end is near(er)
     
  3. FranchiseBlade

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    Sad day for democracy.
     
    ROCKSS likes this.
  4. basso

    basso Member
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  5. ROCKSS

    ROCKSS Member
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    I have a sneaky suspicion trump will call putin and say, don't do anything until I am in office so I can take credit for giving Ukraine to russia
     
    ROXTXIA likes this.
  6. FranchiseBlade

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    Yeah, the way Trump refused to say he hoped Ukraine wins, and Trump saying Russia can do whatever the hell it wants is very hopeful to Ukrainians.
     
    Newlin likes this.
  7. Nook

    Nook Member

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    Wow - I don't agree with this at all.

    What is the basis for this opinion, maybe I will change my mind.

    The only difference I can think of is that it is possible that Russia would have already taken the Ukraine without US support.
     
  8. pirc1

    pirc1 Member

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    Not everyone is in favor of spending tens of billions to support Ukraine (the only country the US do that for without any question is Israel), not all of them die hard Trump supporters. The middle east conflict also cost Democrats some votes. I agree with Sachs and Mearsheimer on the major cause of the Ukraine conflict is NATO expansion.
     
  9. SamFisher

    SamFisher Member

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    Well, you're wrong.

    The major cause of the "conflict" was the "invasion" by Russia.
     
  10. pirc1

    pirc1 Member

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    Why didn't Russia not invade Ukraine for all the time Putin was in power and Ukraine was not trying to join NATO?
     
  11. FranchiseBlade

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    When was Russia's invasion of Crimea (part of Ukraine)? Was that before or after what you're calling NATO expansion?
     
  12. SamFisher

    SamFisher Member

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    They have literally been fighting a war with Ukraine since 2014.

    It's pretty simple Ukraine threw out their corrupt Putin lackey President Yanyukovich in 2014 and then Russia invaded Crimea & donbass regions.

    Russia wants to control Ukraine, period.
     
    Nook, AroundTheWorld, Newlin and 2 others like this.
  13. Deckard

    Deckard Blade Runner
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  14. Invisible Fan

    Invisible Fan Member

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    No givesies backsies Trump!
     
    #16674 Invisible Fan, Nov 6, 2024
    Last edited: Nov 6, 2024
  15. SamFisher

    SamFisher Member

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    It's a dark day but not dark enough for me NOT to tell all the Putin PBs

    Slava Ukraini !

    **** 'em up good.
     
  16. Invisible Fan

    Invisible Fan Member

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    I respect Mearsheimers opinion. His biggest complaints about Ukraine intervention
    is that it increases nuclear escalation and that it distracts us from China.

    The strict rules we place on Ukrainians using NATO weapons on Russian soil sounds incredibly dumb and cold blooded but it also allowed the west to call Russia's bluff of using nukes for every little line the Ukrainians cross. Bottom Line: nuclear escalation by Putin is not an insanely irrational stance but something calibrated by how strongly he's in power. The more Ukrainians winning affects his base, the more likely nukes will be used.

    The other point about China is that Europe really wanted to intervene. Armchair analysts talk about our munitions/defense supply chain giving out from this war but Europe is far worse and under prepared from Russian aggression. These last three years could be seen as a transaction for them where we went in with moral justification and took the lead while they repaired their industrial base and started to wake up to the idea of an isolationist America. It'll take a good 5 more years to build upon, but does anyone want an armed Europe that's already in decline?

    In exchange, we made a killing off lng exports and the western alliance became less divided when it came to adversaries like China. There's a reason why you haven't really seen French b****ing about Israelis openly to grab headlines. That used to be low hanging fruit for them.
     
    Xerobull, Kim and SamFisher like this.
  17. Xerobull

    Xerobull ...and I'm all out of bubblegum
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    Not a bad idea. Get it while it’s hot - We won’t have it much longer here.
     
  18. SamFisher

    SamFisher Member

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    Today's a good day to give Ukraine some more weapons.
     
  19. LosPollosHermanos

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    imagine being so stupid you still can't figure out why biden harris lost the popular vote and got slammed to the floor

    People like you are why the dems are doomed
     
    AroundTheWorld and Space Ghost like this.
  20. Space Ghost

    Space Ghost Member

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    He was one of the 20% who didn't show up to vote because he knew his team were losers.
     
    LosPollosHermanos likes this.

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