I understand not liking the Jalen contract. Every argument the pundits have used to argue against it is fair. Where it doesn't make sense to me is those same arguments not being used against the awful contracts handed out to Mobley, Cade, Barnes and Wagner. They're making *more* money on longer terms than Jalen while all being role players at best. Only Jalen is basically being told "become a superstar or **** off". Meanwhile Cade is basically Luka Doncic body with Kevin Porter Jr's decision making and he's not part of the Pistons problem? Evan makes KAT look like Kevin Garnett. Idk what Barnes and Wagner are even supposed to be. LA Fitness Kawhi Leonard and We Have Dirk At Home? Again...I too am curious about Jalen's contract. I just dont understand questioning it and being OK with any of these other contracts.
The thing is why are we so worried about others of the 2021 Draft class and how much money they make and how well they are progressing? I enjoyed watching Franz. I do not watch much of Toronto.... sometimes I watch the Cavs.
They may not be a "large" group, but they're definitely there. You can tell them by never ever referencing in game action and living and dying entirely by "the metrics" which they worship almost as hard as they do Morey, even though most of those things are made up estimates and not actual statistics based on reality.
Thin logic often results in long-ass sentences. This is one, long-ass sentence. I would have just said media perception of Cade is still defending draft day expectations.
Every teams situation is different. If Jalen was on the pistons, he would have gotten a max because they have nothing else. Cade would not have gotten a max if he was a Rocket. Mobley and Barnes are way better than Jalen so they're not relevant comps. Franz is very iffy, i haven't heard anyone who said it was a good contract and i would not have done it but they're capped out anyway, and again he's also been much better than Jalen.
Just so we're all clear here, the metrics also say that Cade isn't very good. From reading the last few pages, a lot of the non-math guys seem to think the pro-metrics guys all like Cade because "the numbers" say he's good. They don't say that. They say he's bad. He is very slightly ahead of Jalen Green, but not by a lot. The metrics say that both of them are not very good.
Thin logic is self evident and can easily be dismantled with sentences directly confronting said thin logic rather than deflecting with criticisms of sentence structure.
And yet the person in question pointed to the metrics saying "Cade is a much better player and more likely to be a great player." So there you go.
Yes, that's exactly why I made my post. If you just read this thread, and you don't know what all the metrics actually say, you are probably led to believe that "the numbers, the figures, the stats, the metrics" say that Cade is good. I am correcting the record, I am clarifying for people who don't look at that stuff. They do not say that.
Everyone listens to different stuff, the pods i listen to all pretty much view it the way i said. The pistons have basically 2 paths to not being trash: 1. Cade explodes, 2. Tank. They have no other players who matter or who will need to be paid, so if cade flops it won't matter to them long term outside of wasting some cash.
I mean obviously part of the reason for the deal is that there is more uncertainty with Green vs Sengun so you want the option to make sure if he stagnates or regresses it doesn't become a long term albatross contract that can't be traded. As of now, if Green merely stagnates,l but doesn't regress that contract is tradable. The option is there. That is the point of why this is a 3 year deal. Everyone already should know that by the very core reason why Green didn't just get a normal max. Because there is uncertainty. Everyone knows there is uncertainty with Green. We all know he has shown the highest to be a all-star but also know he has shown the lows at a high enough frequency to believe he also could be a career sixth man. He has a wide range of outcomes and the contract reflects that.
This is where we fundamentally disagree I think Jalen is better than Cade. Cade is playing in the Leastern conference playing scrub teams 4x a year and his team is bad so if he puts up stats thats good lol. Meanwhile Jalen is playing in the super tough WC he gets put on the microscope a lot because he is on a good team. Who is the worst team in the West? Spurs with freaking Wemby right? What about East? You have so many trash teams Det, Cha, Wash, Chi etc. You play these garbage teams 4 times then you look a lot better than you really are. This context is important when comparing players because its harder to score vs Nuggets, Dallas and Wolves than Bulls, Hornets and Wizards. Jalen is a better defender and is more athletic than Cade so basing on potential Jalen has a higher ceiling cuz Cade honestly is extremely unathletic and will always be a defensive liability. Healthwise Jalen is an ironman while Cade already missed an entire season on phantom injuries. If you factor in salaries Jalen is making 80% what Cade is so there has to be 20% differential before you consider them equal. Jalen's shooting is a lot more inconsistent but Cade isnt exactly Steph either. Career TS%: Jalen: 54% Cade: 52% So what we can see here is everyone on CF hates on JG for being the brickmaster but even he is still better than Cade in terms of overall efficiency. Cade has no skill that sets him apart in the NBA and his lack of athleticism puts a cap on his growth IMO.
Minor point: He makes it sound like the trade kicker contributes to it being more tradeable. I guess he saying a trade kicker means Jalen’s side negotiated it knowing the trade ability of the contract (like wanted some reward and a margin of controlling destinations via waiving it). Certainly, no trade kicker makes it more tradeable.
I really enjoy your reasoning and see where you're coming from, but I think you're missing something crucial here. There are some people out there who are deeply motivated by engagement on the internet. Look at reddit or a site like gamefaqs (basically this place but for video games) where it becomes a pit of misery, complaining, etc just because that gets them a lot of attention. I bet you there are some weirdos on here who used to watch a little basketball and now just parrot the same narratives they heard on social media because it pisses other people off. There are absolutely people spending time on message boards that they have no real interest or knowledge in.
