His arm is my biggest problem. There's no hesitation at all for opposing teams to run on him, even with their slowest runners. Yes, he covers a lot of ground and is one of the best at that. But his late career Bagwell-esque throws cost runs. They did against Detroit.
I didn’t say he’d fetch $15M/yr on the open market. I said he’d put up $15M worth of value each year for the next few years. That’s because free agency doesn’t value defense. The trade market also undervalues defense, because there aren’t enough smart teams (like TB) to properly value defense. Meyers is thru 3 pretty savvy GMs (Luhnow, Click, and now Brown) who all bought in on Meyers as an everyday CF. I do think this board underestimates what he’d get on the open market. I think if Meyers were suddenly a free agent (at age 28) he’d probably get something like $27M/3yrs plus incentives and maybe a vesting 4th year. Behind maybe Bader he’d be the best CF available in free agency.
...and one of the biggest plays in a tight 2022 World Series game was when a CF with a lanky arm turned a potential tying run at 2B into an out by covering a lot of ground.
The Astros worst “everyday” hitter in 2017 was Beltran (76 wRC+), in 2022 it was Maldonado (71 wRC+). A team can win a World Series with a guy like Jake Meyers (career 87 wRC+) hitting at the bottom of the lineup everyday. The problem this season was that Meyers got the 6th most pa thru a combination of injuries and Abreu and McCormick sucking.
I think we all agree that the 2023 Astros did not have a deep enough lineup. Remember those cereal commercials as a kid where they'd say whatever sugary cereal they were hawking was "part of a balanced breakfast" while showing it surrounded by a lot of healthier foods? Of course Meyers can be part of a productive lineup hitting 9th - hell, Maldonado was "part of a productive lineup hitting 9th" and we won a title that way. The Astros have too many less-productive parts to the currently constructed 2024 lineup. And that's before they (potentially) lose Bregman. They need productive hitters. You can afford to have Pena, or Meyers, or Singleton, or "random rookie playing 3B", or "random OF/DH depending on where Yordan plays" in the lineup hitting in the bottom third. But all of those together means a lineup that's way too thin for the playoffs. We can afford, at most, two of those to exist in our lineup with Altuve-Tuck-Yordan-Diaz. That means hopefully finding 3 bats this offseason who can play every day. McCormick could be one of those if he can return to form. He might not. It's one reason why I think they need to keep Bregman - you just can't afford to thin out an already top heavy lineup.
I'd rather win a World Series and lose an Wild Card Series than to not win a World Series in either year. I'm also implying that for every run that scores because Chas and Meyers have lanky arms, they save at least 3 runs by covering ground and making plays on would-be doubles. Regarding playing every day, that is a huge goal post moved. Chas would need to relearn to hit.
Top 9 hitters in terms of pa with wRC+: 2017: Altuve 160 Springer 140 Bregman 123 Gurriel 118 Reddick 127 Marwin 144 Beltran 76 Correa 152 McCann 103 2022: Bregman 137 Tucker 130 Altuve 164 Gurriel 85 Alvarez 185 Pena 102 McCormick 115 Maldonado 71 A Diaz 97 2024: Altuve 127 Pena 100 Alvarez 168 Bregman 118 Y Diaz 117 Meyers 86 Dubon 87 Singleton 105 Tucker 180 Move Tucker up to 2nd (if he hadn’t gotten hurt), then slot Abreu (wRC+ ~120 if he hadn’t died) and McCormick (wRC+ ~115 if he hadn’t fallen apart) ahead of Meyers in place of Dubon and Singleton and all of a sudden that lineup is on par with the best years and Meyers doesn’t look at all out of place. The need this offseason is to adequately replace Bregman (3B) and upgrade at least one of Singleton (1B), Dubon (LF), or Meyers (CF), preferably 2.
You think he suddenly forgot how to hit at the age of 29, or do you think it might have been a result of his hamstring injury and later his hand injury he suffered last season? Maybe even related to the back injury he sustained in the 2023 postseason?
I was saying this all season but the vast majority of posters here gave him zero leeway. They were calling for his head early and often. It was predictably a lot of blind Dusty loyalists, who like to see Chas and Diaz struggle. Also there were those that had simply been openly negative about those 2 players in the past and didn’t want to eat crow.
I actually expect Chas to have a nice bounce back season...but penciling him in as a starter would be extremely foolish after what he did last season, regardless of what caused it. Ideally we find a lefthanded bat for OF, and we see what version of Chaz we're getting next season. I think we have a pretty safe floor for Meyers at this point.
I dont hate Meyers but I want 9 guys that are at least league avg hitters in the everyday lineup. He will never be a league avg hitter. The lineup needs depth and if you have to give up a little bit of defense, but have a guy that is a good defender with an avg bat then you've upgraded. Where we disagree is that Meyers is a starter level CF on a championship team. Why would you want to settle for a guy like Meyers if you could upgrade from him, which wouldn't be hard to do IMHO. If you want to fandom a guy to keep, then put Chas in CF and hope that he can bounce back, or he holds down the fort until hopefully Melton is ready.
You and I have gone back and forth on many things, and Chas is one of them. I don't think for a second that the 2024 Chas is the real Chas or what we can expect in 2025. At the same time, I don't think 2023 Chas is the real Chas or what we can expect to see in 2025. I think Chas is a marginally ( by MLB standards) talented, hard working, overachiever (prior to 2024). Those players have a lower ceiling and a shorter shelf life. For 2025, I expect somewhere right in between but certainly not under 100 wRC+/OPS+. Maybe 100-105 worth about 1.5 WAR. That's a fine and valuable player. If the team keeps Meyers though, I hope he is traded so the OF can get some offensive versatility.
Is a guy like Chas glove so bad that his bat doesn't make a difference between him and Meyers? Slater is that type of guy also. Give me a better bat and Chas level defense everyday. Meyers became unplayable in the last month of the season and particularly against top tier pitching in the playoffs. Meyers is fine as a defensive replacement/4th OF type on a championship team, but he's just not a starter on a championship team.
We had Martin Maldonado and a massive pile of garbage in LF when we won in 22. You don't need 9 good hitters to win a WS. As of right now we have offensive holes at 4 positions. We can't address them all with full time starters.
There's no question that Diaz doesn't need to be playing 1B defensively. I like him at C because he caught one of the best pitching staffs in MLB and is improving while learning on the job. If you want Diaz moved then put him in LF, let Caratini catch, re-sign Bregs and trade for Lowe to put at 1B. Put Chas in CF and hope he bounces back or Melton is ready by the all star break. Or let Bregs walk trade for Robert and plat Dezenzo at 3B.
Sure you can. If the Stros have 30-35 mil available and can open up another 30 mil by trading Pressly/Caratini and not going to arb with Urquidy/ Chas/Meyers etc.. Then you could sign Lowe/Walker and trade for Robert. That would level you with playing Dezenzo at 3B. That would give you a lineup that would be good defensively and have above avg to league avg bats. You may not need 9 league avg hitters, but why wouldn't you want 9 league avg hitters in the lineup? Also that was a great pitching staff. This pitching staff while still top tier isn't at the level of the 2022 staff.
