I bring up context and you get angry. How can I bring it up without you being upset? Id like to not upset you. See this is how a discussion board works. People make claims and I address the claims. I bring up context when someone says something relevant to being up said context. That's all. Why are you like this? Why are you upset that I bring up merely context to consider? None of your words make sense. It seems like you are just upset for no reason. You are optimistic about a player with horrible advanced stats? Okay? Why are you optimistic about a player that has had horrible advanced metrics for their first three years? What are you angry about? Please help me man. I feel like you are gaslighting. Because I simply don't understand how you are optimistic about him when any form of context triggers you about Green? Dude has **** efficiency. **** analytics. Is this something you just say to not seem biased? Please explain your optimism for Jalen Green. Because quite frankly I've never seen you express words on why you would even be remotely be optimistic about him.
Again, you guys dramatically keep saying things no one ever said. I count every single month and both sides of the court. No one ever said the other months don't count. Seems more likely you only count scoring efficiency while I count everything.
I also dislike advanced defensive metrics for the same reason, but Jalen's defensive improvement is coming in the same way that anyone calls a player a good or improved defender. A combination of stats and eye test is what we're using on everyone and on Jalen so I don't think we'll take it away just because it's Jalen. Further, what if I showed you Udoka interviews which is an added layer on top of metrics and eye test? Would that convince you?
It is really not that hard to be optimistic about players on your team as long as they give you something to work with. And I have expressed the reasons several times, not as much as you mentioned his on/off stats though. He showed he is coachable, he improved on d, passing angles, attacking the basket. A coachable, super athletic guy, who has shown decent improvement. I'll take it any day as long as he keeps improving. He has a lot of holes in his game, and I am not sure about his mental toughness to handle it at the highest level but that's something we can worry about later. You keep coming back at me, how I get triggered by context, let's have a look at the context you provide. So Murray would have bad efficiency under Silas, but Green would build upon his numbers because Silas wouldn't ask him anything on defense. What a miracle that the same silas makes Murray stats worse but Green would have been better under silas, but too bad he switched to Ime. And now playing in a better team with better team mates, being asked to play defense made his life harder. But players like Murray or booker were in better situations because they were in better teams. How does that work? That's really context my friend.
April: 17-4-5 on 38-29-88 splits Oct/Nov/Dec/Jan/Feb: 18-3-5 on 40-31-81 splits. He was not bad in April, he was back to being himself. His usage was very high. That is something you can look up, you know? Prayers up he finds March forever, but let's not act like April doesn't count. It all counts. Right now he is Kevin Martin on defense. He makes Courtney Lee look like Ron Artest. Offensively he has not shown the ability to consistently make his teammates better. For an inefficient guard, that is concerning too. Often compared Trae Young is a sublime passer, so he can get away with some of those shooting woes.
I understand what you're saying but I've never said that nor have I heard someone say Sengun had it easy. In fact I have posts going back to his rookie year detailing Sengun's challenges exactly as you have. Again though Sengun had those challenges but those challenges were not as bad as being a HS'er who no one taught fundamentals to. Silas was not Sengun's English teacher. If you don't know how to play team basketball, that's the worst thing. You shouldn't get on the court without that. You can hide a player who's missing a skill or physical conditioning. You can't hide a HS'er. Jalen improved his handle immeasurably under Silas. He put on the muscle he was supposed to. That's an individual thing. He improved defense under Udoka as much as Sengun did. Someone had it the worst. Each person has their own opinion of who had it worse. My case is the least experienced guy with no fundamentals had it worse. Is that so outrageous?
Fundamentals are a holistic and a huge problem of the national youth bball programs for sure .... kids learning to shoot 3s, run out and dunk the ball......(American kids vs Euro kids growing up) That is why you select the Basketball savants that are outliers that are more skilled than your average athletic kid.....with the 2nd Overall Pick. There should be no excuses......similarly Jabari Smith was only a shooter but had questionable handles and did not have much of a post game at the draft.
How's this relevant? I don't agree but also don't wish to start a debate that's been had a million times and even WE have had. I'm just addressing your statement that said the other months count. They all count. If he improved defense and off ball movement in the first few months they would not appear in these very specific stats you chose so you're putting me in an impossible situation. Of course if I judge the game as you have done in this post, I'd not see much improvement either. I also find it disingenuous that you're discounting his defensive improvement from worst in the league to around average - that's a bigger deal than improving 3PT% which would have made you happy.
It's relevant because of the silly excuses I am seeing you post for April when nearly identical numbers were seen for the entirety of the year. His defense improved some, but let's not get carried away in here. If Jalen Green continues to improve at the rate he improved from year 2 to year 3, he might be ready around his 36th birthday. It's not good enough.
It's not relevant at all, you are shifting goal posts. You said the other months don't count to us. You're making that up, it's a super lazy argument. I've explained in detail what I think. I think Udoka improved - almost month by month - Green's defense, then rebounding and assists and the scoring came on late in the season especially when we finally spaced the floor and increased our pace. If that's what happened, your stats wouldn't show any improvement till March. When asked before the season, Udoka said he would focus on rounding out Jalen's game and we know Udoka is a defensive coach. As Udoka himself put it, he only wished the scoring packed up a little sooner otherwise he was happy with Jalen. No one improves their defense + movement + passing + rebounding + shooting + finishing early in one season - this is a ridiculous bar you've set for him. Before March he improved everything but his jumper. That's most of basketball. Sorry it's not good enough for you but that's big for the Houston Rockets that we were able to squeeze in most of the improvements in just one season of decent culture and coaching.
Not addressing anything else in this post - just the part about Udoka and what he has to say about Jalen or anyone on the roster for that matter - (His actions spoke louder than words.) What do you expect him to say? Jalen sucks and I should bench him? No way no how. Not even if Jalen was traded would you hear that from any coach. Coaches almost never outwardly criticize their own players or even those on other teams. They speak positively about players almost all the time. Coaching is just as much about the relationship as it is the X's and O's. I'm sure his words to Jalen are more along the lines of "you have a lot of potential. you do this this and that well, but you need to be more consistent at XY&Z".
I expect him not to compliment Jalen about his hard work and resilience more than everyone else. No one is forcing him to go out and voluntarily say great things about Green. Let's focus for your sake on totally unprompted compliments. You can pull up the interviews yourself and see how he discusses Sengun and Green as an equal duo. I've said a million times, if it's professional courtesy why is he praising Jalen more than the minimum he's doing for others? I do agree that prior to last seasons deadline he was attempting to trade Green and you can see how he stopped complimenting him. He changed course right after he threatened to bench a starter and Jalen began improving his shot selection. Udoka himself later said: - Playing slow did not suit Green (I believe he even used the words unfair to Jalen) - We're going to start playing with more pace and space - Green figured it out, he just wishes it was sooner so we could have made the playins Udoka screwed up too. He designed the offense around two role players instead of the core 6. It was not his first time screwing up an offense for half a season, it's not out of character. I don't blame him, you guys are not seeing just how much development work he had on his hands after two years of Silas. Don't you think there's a possibility he viewed the month of March as more than just a hot streak? Like we have to chalk up all the evidence to professional courtesy and then instead of saying "so we don't know" we should say "he's lying, he didn't like Green"? Doesn't make sense. If you want to say there's no hard proof, fine. That makes the both of us. That's why we speculate based on evidence. As you say, actions speak louder than words. Jalen Green is still a Rocket and Udoka's plan before the off-season was to work closely with Green and to build a dynamic duo with Sengun. His off-season plan is designed to make them mesh (his words not mine). I get that coaches have to be courteous but Ime Udoka is no optimist, never holds back criticism nor is he Leonardo DiCaprio with these acting skills people are alleging he has. It's just a LOT to ignore and sweep under the rug. I'm genuinely curious. Let's say Green just steps up to your standards next season. How will you explain this past season? Won't you then believe Udoka was just being as honest as he always is?
Jalen Green = Jordan Poole because of "sTaTs" Cool stat Jordan Poole has 66 dunks in his career. Jalen had 69 in his rookie season - LOL
Would any of the Jalen optimists give him the max extension if he puts up the same numbers, including efficiency, as last season?
