Nah this is complete misinformation, compared Green and Jaylen Brown is a fair-ish comparison (though Green absolutely destroys him in all honesty.) Comparing Green to Kwame Brown is a straight up insult and only serves to fuel a false narrative. Let's examine that bullshit you just wrote: Jaylen Green Year 3 19.6PPG 3.5 APG 5.5RPG 0.8SPG 0.3BPG - 11 30pt games, 2 40pt games Jaylen Brown Year 3 13PPG 1.4APG 4.2RPG 0.9SPG 0.4BPG - 1 30 pt game Jrue Holiday Year 3 13PPG 4.5APG 3.3RPG 1.6SPG 0.3BPG - 1 30pt game Steve Nash Year 3 7.9PPG 5.5APG 2.9RPG 0.9SPG 0.1BPG - 0 30pt games or above Kwame Brown Year 3 10.9ppg 1.5APG 7.4RPG 0.9SPG 0.7BPG - 0 30pt games or above Michael Olowokandi Year 3 8.5PPG 0.6APG 6.4APG 0.4SPG 1.3BPG -0 30pt games or above Darko Milicic Year 3 4.8PPG 2.7RPG 0.7APG 0.3SPG 1.4BPG - 0 30pt games or above At this point in their careers, Jalen GREEN is so far above and beyond every single player Good OR Bad on the list that it makes you look either like a massive hater or that you simply have no idea about basketball and where players actually are at this stage of their career. Here's a hint: Jalen Green is better than half of the stars in the league were at his age, and you're all full of ****.
Seriously. Jalen Green had a first three years more similar to Bradley Beal's first three years than let's say Ja Morant's first three years. Not great. A bit disappointing but within the margins of a top 5 pick expectation but on the lower end. But then people being up names like Michael Olowokandi? Might as well bring up Anthony Bennet at this point. Jesus Christ people just have no idea how to do measured criticism.
jalen green is the only player we have whose ceiling is high enough to take us to the promised land, so i have no idea why a true rockets fan would hate on a young kid. If he can get that three ball going he's going to be a superstar. Who else can break down a defense from the perimeter with crossover step back fade away 3s? Superstars can do that against a great half court defense. He can get his shot. He can break down a defense. Yes his defense isn't the best. He's going to get paid by us. no, we're not going to let him go, so we may as well root for him as hard as we can. him actually being a late bloomer is actually good for us, cuz we may not have to pay him the max. 25 to 30 mill a year? we're going to pay that for sure. If he plays like he can for most of the year, he's getting the max.
The fact that these guys are STILL trying to make arguments based on raw numbers pretty much says all that needs to be said about the level they are operating on when trying to analyze basketball. According to how you judge quality, Jalen chucked 17.9 shots a game in his "best" season with 0.034 WS/48, a -13 net rating, -2.1 BPM, he shot 33.8% from 3, with a 53.8% TS% Kwame's "best year" according to the raw points per game numbers you value above all, he only took 8 shots per game, his WS/48 was 0.105, his net rating was 2, his BPM was -0.6, he didn't shoot a significant number of 3's to count, but his TS% was 54.7%. I could go down the list, and typically the real difference between them is playing time, opportunity, and if they were a chucker or not. When you look beyond raw scoring numbers, you'll find that Jalen, to date, fits right in with the rest of his draft bust peers and all of this PPG BS is pure sophistry trying desperately to make the lesser argument appear the greater. Focus on hoping that Jalen finally has his first decent season rather than just trying to be dishonest about his first 3 awful seasons.
Just a heads up so you don't look stupid, winshares isn't a thing modern nba analysts care about. This isn't the MLB. VORP and BPM though are better attempts at advanced analytics. You don't want to use winshares trust me. Because it will say that Jalen Green was a better offensive player in his second year than Ant Edwards in his third year. Ya Green had a higher offensive winshare than Ant Edwards in the 22-23 season. It's a very junk stat.
You understand though that I'm responding to absolute morons who are going off of raw points per game as their ONLY criteria, right? I just barely scratched the surface picking a few metrics at random and I showed how hilariously awful their "analysis" was and that was the point. It's one of those things that is so obvious that there's no a need for a deep dive to point out the obvious dishonesty of their narrative. Also, I know for a fact that if Jalen looked even halfway competent via either raw win shares or WS/48, you and the rest of the Jalen faithful would be spamming the board with those metrics. As it stands, to find anything at all that can even be twisted into a positive you guys are stuck using raw points per game or potentially some truly obscure metric....and I'd imagine if you found one that you liked, it would have to ignore efficiency and defense....or would be some obscure metric behind a paywall that we'd just have to take your word on. Either way, I think you might even be willing to agree that an analysis done solely on raw numbers like PPG is just about the most dishonest "analysis" possible.
Brah almost every player on that unhinged list of busts compared to Green in the earlier post that includes guys like Bennet etc haven't had a season where their VORP was above replacement level player(0). Jalen Green has a VORP of 1 which is higher than pretty much every player on that list even including their peak seasons with 5+ years of NBA experience. And that was his third year in a transition year learning a new coaching philosophy, new role etc.
So you won't agree that an analysis based solely on raw points per game is just about the most dishonest "analysis" possible? Well, I'm not 100% surprised you would refuse to throw your fellow cultists under the bus, but it's another example of dishonesty from you. As to VORP, Jalen had a 1 last season, up from 0 the previous season and -0.5 the season before that.....Kwame Brown was 0.8 in his 3rd season...so that's pretty much in line with Jalen's 3rd season. Also, VORP essentially ignores defense outright, and defense is basically the only thing Kwame did halfway decently....so the fact that they are nearly the same in a metric that ignores Jalen's biggest weakness and Kwame's biggest strength is kind of a bad thing for the Rockets SG. So yeah, the point is that Jalen is well in line with historical busts, he's just been given A LOT more leeway to mindlessly chuck and hurt his team without consequences, which is something you basically never see.
Preach dude. We're some 3PT training and shot-selection-sharpening away from having a deadly NBA scorer. That's very difficult to acquire and would be incredibly valuable. He's responded well to tough coaching, earning praise for his persistance. There's no reason to think he won't keep improving. If Green and Sengun come back with improved 3PT shots it changes everything for our future. It makes our future so easy matching offers in the open market. Udoka stated on a couple of occasions that each of them should be working on their shot this summer. I have faith he's monitoring things closely. Green can really benefit from passing off more often on his most difficult 3pters - he takes too many unnecessarily difficult 3's. He seemed to understand that better towards the end of the season. Need to see fewer jumpers and more drives from him. I think it's a pretty easy fix along with what Udoka learned about Green during that 11-game streak (more pace and space is good for this team).
VORP is BPM adjusted for minutes. BPM is a combination of offensive and defensive box score stats and offensive and defensive impact relative to the team they play on. In fact BPM is divided into DBPM and OBPM You can't be this confident in your claims when you don't understand these basics of terms you use confidently.
i agree on his shot selection. He only needs to take those difficult shots when he has to, since he's the only once who can. Now that he's bulked up a little bit i hope he can get to the line and make those free throws. He will be a future number one option running point like russell westbrook, pushing the pace. But westbrook never had the bag that green does. Just him having his speed opens up so much space for everyone on the floor. Once he's surrounded by great 3 point shooters around him, he can run a five out system. If sengun can hit that 3 green can set him up all day long. We need to run run run and then set up sengun in the as a secondary option. we have the horses to run with amen and cam and jabari and now reed.. Green has the potential to shock the NBA once he gets that 3 ball down. Everyone else will repent once this happens.
The "adjustments" largely erase defense, which is why there is such a drastic difference in outcome. For example, Jalen is tied for 4th on the Rockets in VORP, but 11th in BPM. Now look at offensive BPM, Jalen is 5th on the Rockets, vs tied for 16th when it comes to defensive BPM. It certainly seems like they weighed the offense SIGNIFICANTLY more than the defense, doesn't it? That's the difference between someone merely reading and regurgitating what the metric says it does vs knowing what it actually does in practice....that's just something you'd have to have experience looking at these kinds of metrics to know. Also, this is just distracting from the fact that the conversation was about simpletons using raw scoring numbers as the sole basis for analysis.
LMAO Winshares/ WS/48 is the literal fakest, non-statistic bullshit known to man. Here's the definition: Win Share is a measure that is assigned to players based on their offense, defense, and playing time. WS/48 is win shares per 48 minutes and invented by Justin Kubatko who explains: “A win share is worth one-third of a team win. If a team wins 60 games, there are 180 'Win Shares' to distribute among the players. So literally 3 people on a team where usually 9-11 play in the game can get a "win share" decided by some arbitrary bullshit. Go tell the Dynasty GSW teams that only 3 of them mattered in their wins. It's not a real thing, it's just more made up nonsense for Morey's ********ers to pretend they know anything about sports with.
If there's one way to stop Bobby from posting, it will be Jalen playing well. Dude was a no-show last March while Jalen was lighting it up, and then miraculously came back to posting 10x a day once Jalen started struggling. If someone really didn't "hate" Jalen Green, he would just let the Jalen Stans say what they want to say and get excited about rooting for a player on their team. He wouldn't need to constantly post about Jalen, while also bringing Jalen up in topics that have nothing to do with him. He also wouldn't go M.I.A. whenever Jalen Green plays well.
I actually can't wait for the masses of "Trade Sengun to Boston/Dallas/OKC/Any other contender" posts once Jalen breaks out and becomes the dominant franchise player he was born to be. They couldn't handle it in the Silas years and tried the "it's best for everybody" garbage and proved they're not Rockets fans, it'll be worse once he's a confirmed "Robin"
Of course you hate it, that metric suggests that Jalen is awful at basketball. Despite your complaints, it's funny how the good players on the Rockets don't struggle in that metric....only Jalen. The real issue with metrics like WS/48 and any per 36 or per 48 type metric is that you have to pretty much ignore them for guys who almost never play or only play garbage time minutes. For example, WS/48 would suggest Nate Hinton and Jermaine Samuels were the best players on the Rockets last season which is obviously ridiculous....but then if you eliminate players who played under 150 minutes, you have something more useful that points to Sengun, FVV, and Amen as the best players on the Rockets last season. I think more importantly, you can't base anything on just one metric, you kind of have to look at multiple and see if there's a consensus and realize that all of them will be imperfect. If nearly every metric points to a player being really good or really bad, there's very high confidence in that being accurate. If nearly every metric points one way, and just one suggests otherwise, it's dishonest to cherry pick the one and go with that.
