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The Zach Dezenzo era begins

Discussion in 'Houston Astros' started by Radricky, Aug 6, 2024.

  1. verse

    verse Member

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    In our current minor league system, and I want to limit this to AA & AAA only, whom would you consider (if anyone) to be among the "very few"?

    At this point, I only list Matthews and (maybe) Melton.
     
  2. raining threes

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    Matthews
    Baez
    Blubaugh
    Cole
    Brito
     
    #102 raining threes, Aug 9, 2024
    Last edited: Aug 10, 2024
    Wulaw Horn and verse like this.
  3. verse

    verse Member

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    What tools have Blubaugh shown that impressed you such? Pitchers are just so difficult to project, less they have Skenes-like obvious dominance. And I noticed no Melton for you.
     
  4. raining threes

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    From what I've read and saw on highlights, he's got pretty good control, throws 97 and has a breaking ball he can throw for strikes. There's any number of guys on here that are much more knowledgeable about prospects than I am. I just go by what I read for the most part.
     
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  5. Buck Turgidson

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    How did Luhnow screw up Jon Singleton?
     
  6. vince

    vince Member

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    This trade had dire consequences for the franchise in 4-d mode.

    First Fiers and Gomez were merely average in their times with the Astros.

    Second Hader and Houser have carved some good careers as former Astros - hopeful After paying him all that money Hader can serve up some good sauce for the Astros during his contract.

    Third Fiers snitched on a scheme that was proven didn’t even help with winning, but it gave the organization a black eye.

    Fourth, this is the trade that led to Luhnow not only getting fired, but blacklisted in the MLB.
     
  7. raining threes

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    Extending him when he first came up to the majors.
     
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  8. Nick

    Nick Member

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    He was promoted because he signed the extension…
     
  9. vince

    vince Member

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    lol… so true. Thank goodness Matt Dominguez not only scuffed at the similar Astros offer to him, but even laughed at the Astros offer.
     
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  10. No Worries

    No Worries Member

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    And both of 90%-ers are wrong ;)
     
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  11. IdStrosfan

    IdStrosfan Member

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    In order to stay relevant and in contention, a team like Houston MUST hit on 1-2 rookies each year.

    Maybe these are just bullpen or bench players, but 20-25% of the roster simply must be pre-arbitration (or in 1st arb year at most) and positives on the field.

    The better they are, more impactful roles they play and sheer number of them determine how much the team must spend to fill holes in the roster.

    Later level arbitration salaries and free agent prices simply kill any chances at having depth otherwise. And then injuries and unexpected poor seasons kill a season.

    Therefore, prospects must be developed and kept.

    For hitters, Power and speed determine the ceiling while hit tool determines the floor. Defensive ability and versatility have a hand in both.

    For pitchers, fastball and the number of potential plus secondary pitches determines the ceiling while command/control determine the floor.

    Obviously work ethic, baseball IQ, and health/injury risk impact both.

    I think there are 4 types of prospects:

    1) high ceiling high/mid floor that are potential stars and should be kept and identified as likely replacements for current players approaching FA, retirement, or potentially traded.

    2) high ceiling mid/low floor guys who should be shopped to improve the team. And coached up hoping to hit that ceiling if they stay.

    3) low ceiling high/mid floor guys who should be developed to be used as bottom half of the roster MLBers.

    4) low ceiling low floor guys who are filler.
     
    #111 IdStrosfan, Aug 10, 2024
    Last edited: Aug 10, 2024
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  12. lnchan

    lnchan Sugar Land Leonard
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    We did kind of hit on 1-2 rookies per year... but it takes patience to realize that it takes time for players to hit their stride (Bregman and Tucker) and some will hit sophomore slumps (Pena).
     
  13. IdStrosfan

    IdStrosfan Member

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    I agree

    Over the past few months, the biggest gripe I have with Espada is leaving guys like Loperfido and Leon on the bench in favor of Dubon.

    Joey and Pedro have a much higher ceiling and Dubon's floor is not NEARLY high enough to justify sitting them and keeping them from developing.
     
  14. Htown Stros

    Htown Stros Member

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    I get what you’re saying, but in Espada’s defense, he’s been searching for every ounce of offense he can find. Dubon has struggled with the bat lately but he’s without question a better hitter than Loperfido and Leon at this point in their careers.

    We don’t have the luxury of a big division lead to see if Leon or Loperfido are capable. Clearly the FO didn’t think much of either of these guys either, as one took forever to get the call up and the other was traded. So far Loperfido is 4-30 with 14 Ks while being in a platoon with the Jays. Meanwhile, Dezenzo has played everyday showing you what the FO thinks about him.

    Edit: And Dubon struggled last July before a .919 OPS in August and a .861 OPS in September. Almost zero chance Loperfido or Leon put up those numbers.
     
  15. IdStrosfan

    IdStrosfan Member

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    I completely disagree.

    Dubon is the most known option at this point, but he has a wRC+ of 84 this year (58 since June 1st and 27 since July 1st) and 85 for his career.

    Espada has no idea what Joey or Leon woukd do with everyday playing time but it is very likely to be better than that and better defense
     
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  16. Htown Stros

    Htown Stros Member

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    That’s very likely untrue. We are watching Loperfido play everyday in Toronto right now and look how he has performed. Dubon was a league average bat last year and was this year before his slump. If you think two guys with the K rates they displayed in the minors are “very likely” to come up and immediately be better than league average, you’re going to be wildly disappointed.

    Also, I think this board underrates Dubon’s defense in the OF. He’s not terrible like everyone acts like. You love using baseball savant, go take a look at his page - he’s played almost exclusively in the OF this season.
     
    #116 Htown Stros, Aug 10, 2024
    Last edited: Aug 10, 2024
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  17. IdStrosfan

    IdStrosfan Member

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    Dubon was a league average bat last year and Chas was an exceptional bat last year.

    What matters is now

    And I never said they are likely to be better than league average. I said they are likely to be better than Dubon's numbers I posted above.
     
  18. BlindHog

    BlindHog Member

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    In hindsight it is possible to argue his mar1juana usage (not allowed in the minor leagues) made him a use him now or lose him player. The potential in him was just viewed to be to great to have to let him go over a minor league rule infraction.
     
  19. BlindHog

    BlindHog Member

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    That says more about the state of the outfield than it says about Dubon.
     
  20. Htown Stros

    Htown Stros Member

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    I agree, I’m not arguing he’s a good option out there but saying Leon or Loperfido are for sure better isn’t accurate regardless of what he says.
     

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