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Why politicians hate libertarians

Discussion in 'BBS Hangout: Debate & Discussion' started by AroundTheWorld, Nov 25, 2023.

  1. Invisible Fan

    Invisible Fan Member

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    I think libertarianism as a party would work if they campaign on slashing departments and headcount AND stick to it as a measure of success. It would be a total baton pass because it'd be massively unpopular and the scapegoat for any failure

    It would rustle many jimmies, but no department will responsibly claim they dont need the money on good harvest years and will fight tooth and nail during belt tightening years.

    Use that money or lose it.

    Ofc, when an American libertarian does manage to steal or sucker their way into office, they decide staying in power is more worth it than practicing their ideals.

    Use that power for self gain or lose it.

    Wishing Milei all the best. He might be a crazy b*stard, but he's better than what Argentina has been working with for generations.
     
  2. Nook

    Nook Member

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    Libertarians are foolish.
     
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  3. AroundTheWorld

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    I think very few people subscribe to a school of thought of libertarianism where government doesn't exist at all. That would be anarchy. But government bureaucracy is expansionist by its very nature.

    Other than military and police and (most) roads, I would argue that most services benefit from private competition. Government bureaucracy is rarely the best or most efficient way to get things done.

    What's child like is actually to have a very simplistic view of the world and not to realize that there is a lot of nuance between "no government at all = anarchy" and a sprawling bureaucracy that keeps raising taxes but is actually highly inefficient in doing the most basic jobs of government, like ensuring public safety (see: parts of California).
     
  4. DaDakota

    DaDakota Balance wins
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    You are right and you are wrong.

    When 11 companies own all the others there is no more competition - monopolies are unchecked capitalism which leads to Oligarchy - which is where we are....

    Government now is paid to support business, NOT THE PEOPLE it is supposed to govern.

    We need to break up the 11 companies get back to taxing corporations at a 50+% on profit, eliminate buy backs, eliminate lobbying if any money is involved, and eliminate insider trading for congress.

    We are upside down, we are in the Robber Barron era part 2.......we need to break out of that before the public rebels and starts lopping off the heads of those that are exploiting the workers.

    Unchecked capitalism is just as bad as Facism or Communism - government should be checking capitalism - that is it's job.

    When 6 people have more money than the rest of the 330million that is a problem.

    DD
     
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  5. Space Ghost

    Space Ghost Member

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    You're describing an anarchist. Libertarians are not anarchist
     
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  6. CCorn

    CCorn Member

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    You ever been to a libertarian convention? They boo people that believe blind people should not be able to drive a vehicle.
     
  7. Space Ghost

    Space Ghost Member

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    How do you get a monopoly when there are 11 companies?

    Whatever your twisted definition of a monopoly is, that is ultimately not the problem. The bigger issue is these companies have significant lobbing power and have continuously pushed garbage food into all of our food chains touting it as healthy food. (Never doubt the authoritarians, they know everything, ammirite?)
     
  8. AroundTheWorld

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    Sounds crazy...no, I haven't.
     
  9. AroundTheWorld

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    I am in favour of competition, and therefore of antitrust laws.
     
  10. StupidMoniker

    StupidMoniker I lost a bet

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    I see you decided to ignore that actual counter to what you posted, admitted that you were arguing against an argument I never made, and then doubled down on your nonsense that businesses can somehow demand people spend 10.5 hours a day devoted to someone else's profit motive. How about, instead, businesses offer work on transparent conditions and people can choose to accept that work under those conditions or reject it and find another employer? When was the last time there were massive riots over the prevailing wage at HEB when there is sub 4% unemployment?
     
  11. fchowd0311

    fchowd0311 Member

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    Can people "choose"? Can someone just find a plop of land if they don't have capital and do their own subsistence living without being labeled a vagrant and not chose to be employed?
     
  12. StupidMoniker

    StupidMoniker I lost a bet

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    Yes, you can choose not to work at HEB. Over 99% of Americans don't work at HEB. You can't legally/morally choose to be a squatter on someone else's property, but if you can find some unclaimed land, go for it. Most people are able to find a job that are really trying and then agree to work X hours for Y wage or salary. It is called the labor market. I know you commies hate the labor market, but it seems to have a pretty decent track record.
     
  13. AroundTheWorld

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  14. rocketsjudoka

    rocketsjudoka Member

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    Libertarians aren’t anarchists and libertarians do recognize a need for government primarily to protect contracts and property.

    The problem though is that limiting government regulation to those things usually leads to robber barons, massive wealth inequality and poor health and environment. This is what the US was back when it was run far closer to what libertarians advocate.

    Yes burdensome regulations are problematic and a centralized planned economy becomes very inefficient and corrupt. Both too much regulation and too little regulation is a problem.
     
  15. rocketsjudoka

    rocketsjudoka Member

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    This is why I still think that anyone who reads Atlas Shrugged should also be required to read Upton Sinclair’s The Jungle
     
  16. Os Trigonum

    Os Trigonum Member
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    Libertarians Are More Politically Homeless Than Ever
    The two major parties despise each other, but they hate the thought of leaving us alone even more.

    https://reason.com/2024/07/19/libertarians-are-more-politically-homeless-than-ever/

    excerpt:

    That's not to say there are no grains of wheat in the chaff. Republicans strongly endorse school choice and have at least a bit of awareness of the destructive power of the regulatory state, even if they kind of like it. They're also more open to shifting authority from the federal government to states. Democrats, for their part, are committed to reproductive rights and reject the GOP's tendency towards theocracy (though social justice ideology plays that role for some). Given Biden's deteriorated state, they're unlikely to emulate Republicans in embracing a cult of personality; the guy just isn't up to it.

    But the two major parties are, overall, farther from libertarians than they've been in a long time.

    Normally, I would drop in a mention here that at least we can park our votes with the Libertarian Party. But that column of smoke you see in the distance is the dumpster fire it has becomeafter an influx of populist trolls. Oh, well, it was nice-ish, and often amusing, while it lasted.
    more at the link
     
  17. rocketsjudoka

    rocketsjudoka Member

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    I agree Libertarians are largely political homeless but that’s almost always been the case with one side wanting more economic regulation and the other side wanting more social regulation.
     
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  18. glynch

    glynch Member

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    Politicians like Vance love politicians like JD Vance who they finance by the millions to give them tax breaks and subsidies for their businesses.
     
  19. AroundTheWorld

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    [​IMG]
     
  20. StupidMoniker

    StupidMoniker I lost a bet

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    Libertarians are politically homeless because the vast majority of voters want free stuff, want to tell other people what to do, or both. Being responsible for yourself and letting other people live their own lives is a tough sell.
     
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