1. Welcome! Please take a few seconds to create your free account to post threads, make some friends, remove a few ads while surfing and much more. ClutchFans has been bringing fans together to talk Houston Sports since 1996. Join us!

[Official} Astros @ Giants

Discussion in 'Houston Astros' started by Castor27, Jun 10, 2024.

  1. kaw1988

    kaw1988 Member

    Joined:
    Oct 10, 2022
    Messages:
    719
    Likes Received:
    1,596
  2. Houstunna

    Houstunna Mr Graphix
    Supporting Member

    Joined:
    Dec 9, 2013
    Messages:
    38,439
    Likes Received:
    33,553
    If the Astros continue losing close games, of course they'll miss the playoffs. I just don't believe it will happen at its current rate over the course of 162.

    If Abreu continues his suckage, do you really believe he will survive a full 162, or even June? Will Yordan be sub-900 OPS an entire season? Will Pressly remain the 8th-inning guy by July if he continues his poor play?

    Changes will be made soon enough. Seattle won't continue their level of luck and Astros' unfortunate won't last either.

    Right now, Seattle is a little better version of the 2016 Rangers. I say better because they're doing it with pitching instead of slugging. Mariners have been injury-free the entire season -- that's an automatic advantage for any team. So yeah, if they get perfect health and continue winning close games at an 80% rate, they can duplicate the 2023 Rangers luck.

    Astros still have a chance if Crane finally swallows his pride and does what needs to be done.


    Picsart_24-06-13_06-27-56-883.jpg

    Look at expected wins... if Seattle can continue their luck (health + close game) and Astros continue their unluck, then yes, Seattle will win the division.
    .
     
    #722 Houstunna, Jun 13, 2024
    Last edited: Jun 13, 2024
    seemoreroyals likes this.
  3. seemoreroyals

    seemoreroyals Member

    Joined:
    Feb 10, 2018
    Messages:
    1,809
    Likes Received:
    2,201
    I see your point but we just finished playing our 69th game of the season. That's a pretty good sample size of what to expect for the entire year.

    If we DFA Jabreu and fire Espada it still might not be enough. But it might. Just a change in these two areas may make a huge difference

    If we keep doing what we have been doing all we are going to do is tread water and eventually sink. We need to do something and putting it off only postpones the inevitable.
     
    Houstunna likes this.
  4. Houstunna

    Houstunna Mr Graphix
    Supporting Member

    Joined:
    Dec 9, 2013
    Messages:
    38,439
    Likes Received:
    33,553
    I would really like Espada fired, but it might not even take that. He just needs some power taken away. Game 1 vs SF was inexcusable. Rookie manager clearly needs help from a higher authority.

    Framber didn't pitch well yesterday, but some of the drama was caused a CF playing while a better option was available. Dubon could've still played, but at different position (1B or DH) --- but that wasn't possible with Abreu's "needed" to play.

    Get Abreu out of fans/teammates face and limit Espada's power. Both of those lay in the hands of upper management.

    My question is how money does Crane lose by missing the playoffs vs Abreu's contract? Is the point of contention money or pride?

    Do the right thing and watch the Dynasty dynasty. Seattle is a fraud.
    .
     
    seemoreroyals likes this.
  5. ROCKSS

    ROCKSS Member
    Supporting Member

    Joined:
    May 9, 1999
    Messages:
    7,437
    Likes Received:
    7,905
    I get that Crane and company might have the upper hand on saying if he is on the roster, but does the manager have to play him? If he is "forced" to play him then that's even more F`d up.....maybe I am being naive, but Espada clearly has to see he is a black hole, its one thing to try and build up his confidence and its another when he is part of the reason you cant produce any runs
     
    seemoreroyals, RussE and Houstunna like this.
  6. RussE

    RussE Member

    Joined:
    Apr 23, 2017
    Messages:
    16,201
    Likes Received:
    12,648
    That’s just bullshit.

    Looking at the AL standings this morning the Astros are in bad shape to make the playoffs.

    Which goes along with them being a below .500 team. Just not good enough. So play Abreu:(
     
    Stephen66 likes this.
  7. RussE

    RussE Member

    Joined:
    Apr 23, 2017
    Messages:
    16,201
    Likes Received:
    12,648
    I think Seattle is legit. I picked them to win the division. Only hope is wild card and the Twins are several games ahead at the 6 seed, plus there’s other teams around .500.

    Do something Crane!
     
  8. lnchan

    lnchan Sugar Land Leonard
    Supporting Member

    Joined:
    Apr 14, 2010
    Messages:
    11,707
    Likes Received:
    15,297
    Sacrificing 10%+ of your lineup intentionally and thinking you can win is ridiculous in MLB.
     
    ROCKSS, Stephen66, Nook and 1 other person like this.
  9. lnchan

    lnchan Sugar Land Leonard
    Supporting Member

    Joined:
    Apr 14, 2010
    Messages:
    11,707
    Likes Received:
    15,297
    But the back of the baseball card shows that he was worth the investment from the front office and that investment will pay off... right... right?!?!
     
    ROCKSS likes this.
  10. lnchan

    lnchan Sugar Land Leonard
    Supporting Member

    Joined:
    Apr 14, 2010
    Messages:
    11,707
    Likes Received:
    15,297
    Shhh... he will say you aren't happy when the Astros get a win if you inject some reality in your posts.
     
  11. IdStrosfan

    IdStrosfan Member

    Joined:
    Nov 26, 2021
    Messages:
    8,734
    Likes Received:
    10,984
    Yes you are bring naive

    The only reason Crane is not allowing Brown to DFA Abreu, is that he is still hoping for a turnaround and the September 2023 Abreu to suddenly show up.

    If that's the case, it's not happening from the bench.

    I'm sure Joe could sit him for 2 games and justify it as rest, but he'd be in a world of hurt if he did it 3 games in a row, or more than say 3 off days in 7-8.

    Crane made the signing decision and he won't accept benching him until he finally agrees to DFa him (which I do think is close)

    The best thing Astros fans can hope for is Brown make a trade for Alonso or Vladdy Jr, or maybe Walker - then Crane will agree to DFA Abreu and they can get him out of the lineup.
     
    ROCKSS likes this.
  12. Tomstro

    Tomstro Member

    Joined:
    Jun 30, 2016
    Messages:
    25,751
    Likes Received:
    22,818
    Abreu’s september was fools gold. He hit .237 with an on base% of .299. Yeah he had 13 extra base hits but it was fluky. He did well in the postseason but still not good enough to propel us past the rangers. Was that his fault? No, just proof that the guy isn’t taking us anywhere. His at bats in all situations, especially clutch situations are piss poor.
     
    Radricky likes this.
  13. Kemahkeith

    Kemahkeith Member
    Supporting Member

    Joined:
    Mar 27, 2018
    Messages:
    4,081
    Likes Received:
    5,653
    Anyone fired?
    Anyone DFA'd?

    Just checking
     
    Radricky, Jake Tower and Tomstro like this.
  14. Nook

    Nook Member

    Joined:
    Jun 27, 2008
    Messages:
    59,756
    Likes Received:
    132,156
    Sadly, this was incredibly predictable.

    It is one thing when a team is simply declining, but that isn't really the complete picture of what is happening.

    The Astros expected record right now is 36-33.

    The Astros actual record is 31-38.

    The Astros and Mariners have exactly the same expected record - but the Astros are already 8.5 games out of the division lead at this point.

    Some of the problems have been injuries.... so of it has been poor pen work and an inconsistent line up and a washed up first baseman.

    However - the real issue has been how the organization has decided to handle these problems.

    First- they are playing a Jose Abreu when there is no real excuse to - he is costing them wins.

    Jose Abreu has a negative WAR of 2 - but really he is worse than that, his OPS+ is 4 ...... 100 is average. He has an OPS around .400 and has 7 rbi all season. Defensively he has cost them two wins I know of. Jose Abreu is washed up, and he isn't really the problem - Father Time came for him and he is undefeated, the issue is that the Astros solution is to not cut him because he makes so much, and to play him A LOT....... and when he doesn't play, another below average player plays, in Singleton. They have simply ignored the problem and that position alone has likely cost them 4 wins this season in less than half a season.

    The other issue is that the Astros manager is terrible. He isn't mediocre or even passable - he is terrible. His handling of his pen is atrocious and then he does stuff that deflates his team. Look at his line up in the swing game against the Giants? TERRIBLE.

    I am pretty confident that the Astros will be 10 back at the break and still hold onto this belief that they can turn it around. It isn't likely this gets better. The Astros first half is far easier than the second half - and the Mariners have assets and money to add to their team. The Rangers get back two potential top of the rotation guys.

    I am done with this team - for now.... not because they are losing, but because they are doing it to themselves, and the organization has decided to freeze like a rabbit in traffic.
     
    Tomstro, Radricky, ROCKSS and 4 others like this.
  15. Tomstro

    Tomstro Member

    Joined:
    Jun 30, 2016
    Messages:
    25,751
    Likes Received:
    22,818
    Well said. Agree on all of it except that Singleton wasn’t below average when he was playing every day.
     
  16. Snake Diggit

    Snake Diggit Member

    Joined:
    Mar 12, 2012
    Messages:
    14,829
    Likes Received:
    24,105
    I am a big Jim Crane fan/defender, he’s been an amazing owner, but if they’re 8+ games out of the division and 5+ games out of the wildcard by July 15 and don’t sell, I will be convinced that Crane has lost his way and that the organization will continue into an extended decline.
     
    Nook likes this.
  17. Nook

    Nook Member

    Joined:
    Jun 27, 2008
    Messages:
    59,756
    Likes Received:
    132,156
    Singleton was okay when Abreu was sent down - but last I checked, he had cooled off. There were options for the Astros..... they could have played Singleton, they could have played Loperfido, they could have played Dubon... or they could have made a trade.

    Instead they did absolutely nothing, they stuck Abreu in the line up every day and he has responded hitting .160, which is simply beyond unacceptable and shows the arrogance of the organization and coaching staff.
     
  18. Nook

    Nook Member

    Joined:
    Jun 27, 2008
    Messages:
    59,756
    Likes Received:
    132,156
    I don't think he will sell - at least not players under contract beyond this season. He will believe he can contend in 2025. The best bet to get him to sell is to have players ask to be traded or the GM really planting the seed early.
     
    ROCKSS, IdStrosfan and Snake Diggit like this.
  19. Snake Diggit

    Snake Diggit Member

    Joined:
    Mar 12, 2012
    Messages:
    14,829
    Likes Received:
    24,105
    It would not surprise me if Verlander wants out. I assume he hates losing and does not want to spend any more seasons on a team not guaranteed to make the playoffs. And if you trade JV and Bregman, then it just does not make any sense to hang on to Tucker and Valdez given how much trade value they have.
     
    Tomstro likes this.
  20. lnchan

    lnchan Sugar Land Leonard
    Supporting Member

    Joined:
    Apr 14, 2010
    Messages:
    11,707
    Likes Received:
    15,297
    Even if his teammates like Abreu as a person... I can't imagine how his presence in the lineup at a 5 game per week rate is good for morale... especially for players who know that if they don't perform at least 3x better than him that they would be sent back to AAA.
     
    Tomstro likes this.

Share This Page