Houston offered "several" Nets picks to Brooklyn for Mikal Bridges

Bridges won’t move the needle much. The Rockets need to quit going after these marginal but solid players and need to aim higher.

They need to try and get Trey Young. He’s the answer…

 

I remember at least 1 swap to the Cp3 trade, but maybe I'm blurry on the details.

Harrell, Bev, Lou Will and Dekker aren't just filler lol. They certainly had more value than Josh Christopher, Usman Garuba and Tyty at the time.

Bev for example just won All defense NBA first team that's pretty valuable and worth at least a low frp.

 

semantics, maybe you could get a low 1st for bev, idk. We didn't trade anyone who was a legit starter, harrell/dekker were fringe guys at best. There was also no swap. We essentially upgraded from pat bev to cp3 by sending the last pick in round 1 and an ok bench guy in lou will. Not completely free but pretty close

 

Lou Will was a year removed from winning 6th man he was just an ok bench guy? Why everyone saying Morey made a god level trade when he got him? He was worth a frp we literally just traded for him.

We paid Brooks 20M a year because he was a first defense all NBA, Pat Bev was the same and he is a fringe guy? And Bev was actually accurate from 3 unlike Brooks who never shot the 3 well until this season.

Harrell signed midlevel and eventually won 6MoY for the Clippers. Prior that he got 25 MIP votes even if he didn't win the award..

You are the one talking semantics, whether or not they were starters they were players who had value and we lost all that value for 1 season of Cp3 when we could have used that value for either assets or to offset the cost when we had to dump Cp3 later.

Like I said we didn't even get any discount from Chris Paul we still paid him the 4 yr max so whats the point of trading for him? Lost 3 rotation players and 1 pick for 1 year rental smh.

 

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yes i'm more than happy to lose what we lost to increase our championship equity from 0 to whatever it was, 20-30%. It's totally different with bridges where he changes our title equity from 0 to 0. Brooks is god awful so if we could dump for nothing i would be thrilled. Bev was better and not paid much so he had a lot more value but we got a massive upgrade. Harrell i always thought sucked, never worth anything, and lou was mostly a chucker. I know those guys are popular for 6moty but i put very little value into those guys.

 

I don't care what you think about those players my point is they had value whether you like them or not. You aren't even a team in the NBA what you think of them doesn't matter.

Objectively speaking 6th man of the year cost something to acquire them nobody would say a 6th man of the year is just a fringe NBA player. Which guy who just won 6th man got dumped for nothing in the history of the NBA?

.I don't even get your point we were still getting cP3 regardless he could have opted out and become a free agent and we paid him the max anyway. We were still gonna increase the championship equity regardless except we could have gotten assets instead of lost them.

 

how many players would have had to be dumped to open up the room to sign cp3? Rockets got lou for very little, pretty sure harrell got traded for nothing or signed for the minimum. Remember, the 6moy is someone that's theoretically the 151st best player because he doesn't start (ya there are some exceptions like manu)

 

Morey didn't give up assets rather than acquiring them for fun. We worked with CP3 on a trade because asking him to opt out and sign with us in free agency would have cost him an extra year on his deal. You must think that must because he wanted to be traded here that he wouldn't have considered going anywhere else and would be okay with a discount. In actuality CP3 has never left a dollar on the table, nor was he dead set on Houston that summer. He threatened to sign with San Antonio if he needed to opt out, not us. They had the cap space ready to sign him, we did not. Telling him to opt out so we could give up fewer assets and pay him less money would have been a great way to insult him and push him towards the Spurs. Trading for CP3 was a guaranteed thing, letting him opt out and pursuing him as a free agent would have introduced the risk that he could just renege.

Not to mention that having to trade players for non-guaranteed contracts to clear cap space ruins your leverage. You don't get the assets you want because those teams know that you MUST dump salary. How many assets did we get to get rid of Usman Garuba, Josh Christopher, and Tyty Washington last summer so that we could sign Brook Lopez? They were three recent first round picks still on their rookie contracts. We got zero assets. In fact, we had to include picks to dump their salary. And guess what, Lopez ended up reneging.

You're preaching to the choir here. I don't think of Bridges as a must-trade-for player. But some people think he's a #2 or #3 option that would get us into the playoffs or contention. If they truly believe that, again I don't, then they would not want to wait for his free agency.

 

yeah non defensive 3 pt chucker ..he's the needle mover to you?

 

Trae is still a crappy defender but offensively no one can stay in front of him and he can pull up from anywhere. He just needs a change of scenery and the right coach.

 

Harrell signed for the mid-level, yes he got traded for nothing cuz he was just lumped in this deal. Rockets didn't pay the luxury tax so it's not like we went over the cap.

I'm not a cap guru but we already opened up a ton of salary with these 4 players. 6 man of the year is generally regarded as at the very least starter level. Saying he is automatically the 151st player is really dumb considering not all starters are ranked based on ability. Last year 6th man of the year is Malcolm Brogdon you think every starter is better than him?

 

Ok let's disregard Bridges since we agree on him.

Usman etc don't hold a candle to Pat Bev, Lou Will and Harrell. Those guys didn't even see any play and Usman and Josh C are due for an extension that's why they didn't have any value, they were seen as busts which is what happens when you're in your 3rd year and still not get minutes for the worst team in the league. Daishen Nix got more burn than all of them combined. Lopez reneging is irrelevant. Rox literally just paid a low frp for Lou Will that's his value. Pat Bev just won 6moy so yeah they aren't comparable at all. Of course teams want to low ball the Rox in that scenario but given the usefulness of these 3 players I'm pretty sure they would have netted at least 1 frp. So that's 2 frps at the very least we could have gotten/kept since we also had to pay 1 more pick to get cP3. If we had those 2 picks in the bag we could've kept some of our picks when we had to trade cP3 later, since our picks were also projected to be low picks at the time.

Chris Paul doing a Melo is actually a red flag and should have been an indicator we shouldn't have traded for him. Rox weren't even giving him a discount their offer was literally a 4 yr max. If cP3 still prioritized every dollar over winning a championship that showed he isn't worth getting and tbh that's what happened. In contrast look at LeBron. LeBron always finished his contracts and only joins a new team in free agency. That's because he wants his new team to have as much assets as possible so they can compete better. That's why LeBron has 4 rings and Cp0 has none. And as for San Antonio having capspace that's mired by the Kawhi Drama happening at the time. Spurs didn't even get 1 max free agent with their capspace so they just got used for leverage. I don't even know if Pops woulda signed cP3 cuz like I said they didn't even use their capspace at the time, just resigned Paul Gasol.

cP3 wasnt the only max free agent in the market at the time, the smart play would have been to wait a year for cP3 to opt out. If he didn't opt out Rox could have gone in a different direction. Here's the list of free agents Rox could have signed instead of Cliff Paul:

https://www.sbnation.com/nba/2017/6/30/15897582/2017-nba-free-agency-signings-tracker

Did GSW trade for KD? No right they signed him in FA. And KD is so much better than Cliff Paul.

 

Here's the correct order:

1. Find the stars
2. Surround them with quality players

We're still on step 1, and trading for Bridges is a step 2 move.

 

Looking at the new era the correct order seems to be:

1. Tank
2. Draft the star and supporting cast
3. Fill any holes in free agency

Celts, Minny, Denver, OKC all have drafted major pieces. Yes Minny got Gobert, but that clearly a major mistake since they don't even need him and prob gotten same result with Kessler.

 

This is such a weird hill to be on. Are you saying that the cp3 trade was bad or an overpay? None of our main guys got traded, and it was one very late first. I don’t remember the cap situation in 2018 but it’s very safe to assume it was impossible to sign cp3 as a FA without dumping a lot of salary. The KD example is stupid because that’s the year of the cap spike, 2018 was not that

 

The salary we traded already served as trade filler so if we traded those for assets we could've achieved the same effect except we would have picks instead of dumping them. Yes it was bad and overpay. Every time someone could have been free and you paid for him that is bad and an overpay by default.

You are the one trivialising 6th man of the year candidates saying they wouldn't be worth anything on the market. Just look at past 6th men of the year and tell which of those are seen as scrubs? Naz Reid? Brogdon? Tyler Herro? Clarkson? Lol ok nobody would want these guys, gimme a break. If Minny out Naz Reid on the market to save on salary you think no team will give up a low frp to get him?

GSW had the right idea not trading for KD and just signing him. Even if there was no capspike they can trade their players for assets I'm sure other teams would taken Iggy and Bogut was expiring any. If GSW had been dumb like Morey and traded for KD they woulda lost a ton of depth and picks and swaps and wouldn't win a ring. It would take Iggy and picks minimum and Iggy was key for them in their title runs.

 

Again, you don't get full market value for your players because the only teams that can absorb salary without sending salary back are teams under the cap. Your list of suitors is small and they have you by the balls. Teams under the cap tend to suck and aren't willing to give up first round picks for marginal players. They want picks instead. We traded Corey Brewer and the 28th pick for Lou Will, and somehow the next year we're supposed to get a 1st round pick from a team that doesn't need to send any salary back? Pat Bev never won 6MOY. You're just making stuff up now. Bev's been traded seven times, Harrell traded three times and they never nabbed a 1st round pick even with a full market available to their teams.

Look, if CP3 went up to Morey and said "I want to sign with you in free agency. I'll opt out." and Morey said "Nah bro, I want to include a 2018 first round pick in a trade for you instead, just for funsies" then I'll agree that was a bad move. But acting like we didn't need CP3 or that we should have demanded to acquire him only on our terms is just backseat GM'ing. There was a reason we traded for him instead of signing him outright.

LA Clippers trade Chris Paul to Houston Rockets - ESPN

If you think we shouldn't have traded for CP3, fine. That's a perfectly valid opinion. But you said Morey traded a king's ransom (ha!) for him when we were planning on signing him for the max anyway. That is not what happened. Acting like there were all kinds of deals available to us and we would have been better off overpaying Blake Griffin, Gordon Hayward, or Kyle Lowry in free agency instead isn't healthy. Nor is acting like we were in the Warriors position in 2017.

 

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looks like the cap in 2018 was 99 mil. Between harden, ryno, gordon, tucker, ariza, nene, capela, luc, gerald green that's 83.2, if you add tarik black it's 86.5. You would still have had to get rid of at least 12 mil to sign cp3 as a free agent, and that's WITH everyone who was traded also off the books