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Ukraine

Discussion in 'BBS Hangout: Debate & Discussion' started by NewRoxFan, Nov 25, 2018.

  1. justtxyank

    justtxyank Contributing Member

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    I'm anti war. If the big countries stopped funding their war machine then Russia could just take over whoever they wanted and kill anyone they wanted but we wouldn't have war so there would be peace. Nanny nanny boo boo.
     
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  2. Mathloom

    Mathloom Shameless Optimist
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    You might as well be reading Pentagon documents to me right now. No, we would have achieved slightly less or slightly more with or without the US. Could have been the US, UK, Russia, China, doesn't matter. Whoever had the power to sell security or we do it ourselves. We would have been good either way because there's a **** ton of money buried under this land that can't be airlifted to your country all at once plus we lucked into intelligent leaders that steal less than your leaders and the leaders of other oil countries. Anyone's businesses would have helped our economy and taught us some new lessons. You're interchangeable. You think you're indispensable because you're conditioned to believe so - just like the British are conditioned to believe they helped India.

    No, conditions never ever improved due to foreign outcry. In fact, foreign outcry used to make them crack down harder. This is imaginary. All the organizations helping laborers would facepalm when these politicized organizations would make an outcry about it because then we'd have to all shut up. The worst off people in my country are far better off than the worst off people in yours. They are treated better. They access to more facilities. They make more money. Their life sucks, but it is improving rapidly compared to any other country in the world building mega cities. Homelessness is growing in the richest country in the world in human history. It's a joke if you think that slipped through and they're trying to do their best to change it.

    You can criticize my country till your heart desires and I will join you if you know ANY actual issue about my country. Everyone is entitled to criticize anyone's country. The food is better, the architecture is better, the infrastructure is better, the safety is better, the social ladder is easier, the concerts are better, the neighbours are better, the schools are better than the United States. Hilarious I've never seen you complain that I have no freedom of speech and that I would be in jail if I asked for it. Since you're acting like you have a finger on the pulse lol. You're throwing around PR talking points and don't get sensitive if I throw those back in your face because those are not the biggest problem in my country. If your homelessness problem was improving as fast as our labor problem, it would not be such a huge problem in your country right now. I gave you factual information about laborers homes, passports, money, etc. Yes they live in shitty dorms and their money doesn't allow them to hang out in the most expensive places in town. They knew that when they signed up - they signed up to save money and go back home where they can invest in a home and a family. You have no idea about this issue. These guys don't want to go home they weren't brought here by force - these guys just want their conditions to improve and they are improving faster than I ever dreamed 15 years ago.

    The UAE is not an interesting place that has built some nice stuff. This is a modern, high-tech country with cultural depth now. You are talking about a UAE that existed 20 years ago because those are the only talking points you have on you. That's another one of those. propaganda lies you're regurgitating. That's exactly what Tucker is trying to tell you in his videos. Dubai is not Las Vegas, it's not one nice strip that we're showing over and over again. Every corner of Dubai if beautiful, the poorest part is richer than yours and the richest part is as rich as yours. We are at a different standard than you as a mature city. We don't even have Moscow-type problems.

    Again, all metropolis' since the pyramids are built by mass cheap labor that have lesser working conditions than the rest of the country. This is not a UAE thing, you need to check your conditioning. This is happening in the US, I have seen what Mexicans are up to there. We don't have people who have cancer and diseases and no way of getting treatment for it, we don't have that stuff. We have different problems, so if you want to discuss the UAE go pick up a newspaper from this decade. I know it's shocking to you that after building the aesthetics, now the culture and social standards are improving rapidly too because they told you cities built on oil look good but aren't good on the inside. That's conditioning, that's programming. We all - over here - thought that was true too until we lived here and we visited you a dozen times. The conditions are flat out better. Only your nominal civil rights are better, and that's becoming pointless because wherever your speech can impact change they are using money to drown out your voice. At least I can go sit with the President this week if I wanted to tell him something.

    Also, of course my leaders don't agree with me. That's why they were chosen when they were chosen by who they were chosen. I'm not responsible for their opinions because we don't vote. Do you even understand the Middle East? You think you understand Dubai because you worked on a project? Then how come the only thing you seem to know is an expired talking point from decades ago? You don't know anything and you are just flinging pentagon pr points.
     
  3. Mathloom

    Mathloom Shameless Optimist
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    Sorry but you are not reading correctly. India was one of the richest countries in the world and its industrial sector was growing faster than most anyone else. It was 100000% on its way to becoming an industrial powerhouse without the British. Go ask your sub continent brethren. Have you heard of Gandhi? Maybe read his book. You can google it too. I know it's an inconvenient truth, but the truth it is.

    Oh so you're critical of the British in India but not America in the UAE? I WONDER WHY.

    I'm critical of both btw and of poor treatment of laborers. You don't have to take sides because of race and flags.
     
    #15303 Mathloom, Feb 17, 2024
    Last edited: Feb 17, 2024
  4. Mathloom

    Mathloom Shameless Optimist
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    It has existed forever and will stop existing at some point in the distant future. Whether by genocide or by power or by diplomacy or by some miracle, there won't be war between humans. Don't wait to be on the right side just because our ancestors were less intelligent than us.
     
  5. CrixusTheUndefeatedGaul

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    Hope you and your woke buddies in here can wake up and put America first.
     
  6. rocketsjudoka

    rocketsjudoka Contributing Member
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    There’s a lot of speculation and defensiveness here but I don’t need to respond to everything here. You yourself admit that you can’t vote and don’t really have much freedom of speech. That pretty much tells us about the political situation in the UAE.
     
  7. Ubiquitin

    Ubiquitin Contributing Member
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    Woke means being alert to and concerned about social injustice and discrimination, and it's about being aware of the social injustices blacks and other racial minorities have faced and continue to face in the United States.

    Woke has nothing to do with Ukraine or its existential fight against Russia.
     
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  8. rocketsjudoka

    rocketsjudoka Contributing Member
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    Mahatma Ghandi wasn’t alive prior to the British coming to India. He’s a great figure in World history but has nothing to do with India pre colonial period.

    India’s height was during the Mughal Empire in the 16th Century. That was 200 years before the British took over and by that time the subcontinent was divided by multiple kingdoms such as Maratha, Rajaput and even a Sikh kingdom.
    I have been very critical of US involvement in the UAE and other gulf states. If it was up to me we would pull back some. Your own leaders don’t think that’s a good idea and themselves have spent a lot of money cozying up to US politicians to make sure the US remains involved in the region.
    Given how defensive your tone is and how you keep on saying how great Dubai is while trashing the US it seems you’re the one taking a side.
     
  9. rocketsjudoka

    rocketsjudoka Contributing Member
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    It’s amazing how you have some posters criticizing the US involvement overseas for protecting US interests and then another criticizing it for not putting America first.

    And both are criticism of being “woke”
     
    #15309 rocketsjudoka, Feb 17, 2024
    Last edited: Feb 17, 2024
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  10. Ubiquitin

    Ubiquitin Contributing Member
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    India's economic output and development was absolutely hamstrung by the British. But it has been debated whether pre-UK rule that India had enough social cohesion to industrialize like Western Europe was doing during the 1800s if there was no outside Imperial rule. India was objectively quite rich under the Moghuls and then the various succeeding Hindu principalities, but economic output prior to industrialization was tied to population. But industrialization was an economic and force multiplier that allowed the British to come in and conquer the subcontinent with 50,000 troops.

    India even today still is not an industrial powerhouse. But maybe it does not need to be in the era of deindustrialization. Their GDP was at par with China in 1990, but the Chinese economy grew to the massive scale it is today while India's grew at a more modest rate. India has all the makings to be a true world power again, and as much as the Hindutva movement pains me as a liberal it should improve social cohesion as India becomes more homogenized. Right now, India is built more like the EU than China as there are far too many cultures, languages, and religions (specifically Hinduism and Abrahamic religions like Islam that are wholly intolerant of one another) when compared to other major world powers. But the BJP wants to see Indians worship the same god (Vishnu/Rama) and speak the same language (Hindi). It will almost certainly fail, but then again, the Indian subcontinent is no more a homogenous population than Europe or Africa is.

    [​IMG]




    India's De-Industrialization Under British Rule: New Ideas, New Evidence | NBER
    Potential of Industrial Revolution in Pre-British India on JSTOR
     
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  11. rocketsjudoka

    rocketsjudoka Contributing Member
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    Yes the British exploited the Indians but the argument that India was a massive power at the time the British took over belies that the British were able to take over.

    This isn’t a defense of colonialism but an acknowledgment of the historical facts. For example China under the Ming Dynasty was the largest and most prosperous nation. The Ming emperor was dismissive of the British when they wanted to trade. When Western powers and japan carved up China into spheres of influence in the 19th Century China was weak and corrupt so it couldn’t stop them. That doesn’t mean that things like Opium Wars were right but the acknowledgment that China wasn’t what it had been and a lot of that was due to internal problems in China.
     
  12. dmoneybangbang

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    So there won't be war between humans but also don't wait to be on the right side?
     
  13. Space Ghost

    Space Ghost Contributing Member

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    This has been said plenty about the Ukraine war - If you're so passionate about the war, then send yourself and your families to the front. Somehow its easier to support a war when a person has nothing to lose.

    This also has been said - Lands have been conquered since the beginning of time. The idea that Ukraines current government is somehow more important than the 10's of thousands of people dying is stupid. This is not WWII. This is a pissing contest between elites. There is not existential threat, despite what you may think. This is not the british and the US exterminating the local population.
     
  14. adoo

    adoo Member

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    when?
    what industry was India involved in?
     
  15. Amiga

    Amiga 10 years ago...
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    You’re not understanding. It’s not pro-Russia, anti-Ukraine, or even against spending US $$. It’s for the good of Ukraine and the overall well-being of humanity, including the unfortunate Russian and Ukrainian soldiers who may be unaware that they’re sacrificing themselves for nothing. My anti-war stance stems from my heartfelt concern and love for the people of Ukraine and Russia.
     
  16. Amiga

    Amiga 10 years ago...
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    Supporting Ukrainians in defending themselves isn’t being passionate about war, dofus.
     
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  17. DaDakota

    DaDakota If you want to know, just ask!
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    We need to help them build an ammo factory, the old teach a man to fish deal.

    DD
     
  18. NewRoxFan

    NewRoxFan Contributing Member

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  19. LosPollosHermanos

    LosPollosHermanos Houston only fan
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    lol you clown
     
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  20. NewRoxFan

    NewRoxFan Contributing Member

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    This was before putin told trump to tell cruz to say no…

     
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