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Hamas attacks Israel: Yom Kippur War, 50 years on

Discussion in 'BBS Hangout: Debate & Discussion' started by basso, Oct 7, 2023.

  1. Nook

    Nook Member

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    Hamas is an extremist Islamic terrorist organization.

    Hamas leadership has flat out said that it doesn't help or provide shelter civilians -and that includes Muslims.

    Life means very little to Hamas - and that includes Arab and Muslim life.
     
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  2. Nook

    Nook Member

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    There are special interests on both sides of this debate - and they know a lot of people involved only want to self masterbate with anything that supports their position on the topic.
     
  3. AroundTheWorld

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    Because you don't seem to apply it to very obvious Palestinian propaganda at all - a subconscious bias at display that you are woefully unaware of. Every single instance of you digging to "verify" is aimed at the Israeli side - while at the same time just assuming that Hamas is much nicer to women than the Taliban - where was your urge to "independently verify yourself" then? (to your credit, you immediately accepted the facts presented to you when it happened, instead of digging in, like some others would have done)

    Also, you miss the actual massive discrepancy in moral depravity by focusing on "form over function", so to speak.
     
  4. AroundTheWorld

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  5. Nook

    Nook Member

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    Uhh.... this is the kind of half truths/bullshit I am seeing from both sides.

    I believe they had to treat Sinwar because he was in an Israeli prison serving a life sentence at the time he got sick with cancer.

    It isn't like they invited the guy to Israel from the Gaza Strip and said that they were going to treat his brain cancer out of the kindness of their heart.

    Also to be clear - I don't give a **** about Sinwar. He is a terrorist that has murdered many people, and if he wasn't protected by Hamas, he would have been assassinated by the USA or by someone living in the Gaza strip that is sick of his bullshit.
     
  6. AroundTheWorld

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    Oh, they "had to"?

    Do you think Hamas would have extended the same courtesy to an Israeli hostage?
     
  7. Nook

    Nook Member

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    Yup - not all Muslims believe this, but too many do.
     
  8. Nook

    Nook Member

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    Yeah, they had to unless they wanted to run afoul of international law - which they don't.

    Would a terrorist organization like Hamas treat an Israeli prisoner as high ranking as Sinwar with brain cancer?

    No - they would either trade him for Palestinians or they would kill him.

    That has nothing to do with the tweet though - as it was not providing the whole truth. The tweet made it sounds like the Israeli's out of their own goodness had Sinwar come over from Gaza and they treated him, and he repaid their generosity by killing a bunch of Israeli's.... and that isn't what happened.

    I watch and read enough of this propaganda from both sides and you learn a lot about the tact taken - The Israeli's love to lie or exaggerate their level of goodness. They have a very high opinion of themselves, that often is dillusional. In that way they love playing the unblemished victimes.

    The Palestinians love to blame all of their problems on Israel - and they will lie and exaggerate to do it. They love to overlook the fact that many of their leaders would love nothing more than to drown every Jew in the Middle East.
     
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  9. durvasa

    durvasa Member

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    When a humanitarian catastrophe is actively unfolding, I have a bias against arguments (based on flimsy evidence) seeking to justify continuation of it. I fully admit it, and I’m fully aware of it.

    Do you think I’d be silent if I saw someone posting tweets on here defending the massacre of Israelis?
     
  10. AroundTheWorld

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    Sinwar was in jail for good reason.

    It would have been easy for Israel to botch a surgery if they had wanted to. But they didn't.

    It's just not remotely the same, and the "both sides lie" narrative either deliberately or inadvertently aims at creating some kind of impression of moral equivalence.
     
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  11. AroundTheWorld

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    The "humanitarian catastrophe" is 100% caused by Hamas, and a large percentage of Palestinians support them.

    They openly say they want to commit genocide like on October 7th again and again and again.

    Israel must defend itself; it has no other choice.

    There are many other "human catastrophes" which didn't catch your attention and empathy nearly as much - where Muslims killed many more Muslims than Israel has (supposedly) killed in this conflict.

    Ask yourself why.

    P.S.: I do not doubt your good intentions, I just notice a subconscious bias that I perceive as betraying your good heart, and I would encourage you to consider that possibility.
     
  12. Nook

    Nook Member

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    I agree that Sinwar was in jail for a good reason. He has killed a number of men with his own hands, and he has instructed the death of many more.

    Also - it isn't a fallacy that both sides are lying through their propaganda - the propaganda on both sides are riddled with half truths or inaccuracies - including the tweet that we are discussing right now.

    Could Israel have botched the surgery? Of course, but they also probably wanted less violence from Palestinians.

    On a side note - something interesting that no one is discussing much. Over half of the high ranking Hamas terrorist leaders were in prison in Israel, and were let out of prison, when Israel exchanged almost 1,200 Palestinians for a single IDF soldier back in 2017 or 2018.

    What does that mean in relation to the current situation in Israel and Gaza and the WestBank? I don't know for sure - but the power structure of Hamas was largely re-established when that prisoner exchange took place.
     
  13. Nook

    Nook Member

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    I will say this though @AroundTheWorld .... I would rather raise my family in Israel, than in 95% of the Middle East. That doesn't justify everything that Israel does, but it is safer and the rule of law is more consistent than in the rest of the Middle East.
     
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  14. durvasa

    durvasa Member

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    As I said, my attention is on arguments in defense of continuing actions that directly lead to humanitarian catastrophe. If I saw people defending Assad’s war crimes or that of other Muslim countries, I don’t think I’d be silent. But when does that ever happen on here?

    I’ll admit another bias. I am more focused on actions that lead to humanitarian catastrophe that my government is actively supporting.
     
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  15. AroundTheWorld

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    The only war crimes committed here are committed by Hamas.

    But your focus is on finding Israel at fault.
     
  16. tinman

    tinman 999999999
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    @basso
    Apparently the Hamas hates Filipinos
    Woke people hate the Philippines
    @tallanvor
     
  17. AroundTheWorld

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    2 million Arab Muslims think so, too.
     
  18. durvasa

    durvasa Member

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  19. AroundTheWorld

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  20. AroundTheWorld

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    I hope DeSantis takes action.
     

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