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Hamas attacks Israel: Yom Kippur War, 50 years on

Discussion in 'BBS Hangout: Debate & Discussion' started by basso, Oct 7, 2023.

  1. basso

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    this is an astonishing interview.

     
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  2. basso

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    https://im1776.com/2023/10/11/israel-monsters/

    WHAT HAMAS’S ATTACK MEANS FOR ISRAEL AND THE WEST

    Lenin’s famous line that “there are decades where nothing happens; and there are weeks where decades happen” has proven its truth once again. Over the course of one bloody weekend, decades of stalemate has ended and the cast of the next ten years has been set.

    In a sophisticated sneak attack after two years of inaction, more than a thousand Hamas fighters stormed undermanned checkpoints between Southern Israel and Gaza early on Saturday morning, before apparently enacting a massacre of almost incomprehensible savagery.

    Early reports indicate that Hamas’s actions included the gang rape, torture and murder of young women attending a peace festival on the border of Gaza, and the mass murder of children. Almost all of this is denied by the pro-Hamas side, which claims that stories of atrocities are Israeli fabrications, while specific points are disputed by skeptics. The body count has been estimated at over 1,000: easily the deadliest day so far in Israel’s history.

    Beyond any arguments about context and legitimacy – arguments which today appear as obscene – what happens next is inevitable. The scale of brutality, captured on camera phones and broadcast to a horrified world, has left Israel with no choice: a psychological line has been crossed that there is no coming back from. There can be no return to the status quo ante. Hamas must be destroyed.

    But is this even possible? Counterinsurgency warfare is notoriously dirty and bloody. In order to achieve its mission, Israel will be compelled to do to Gaza something like what Putin did to Grozny. This means incalculable suffering for Gaza’s civilian population. People who do not support Hamas and have done nothing wrong – people, for instance, like the relatives of a friend of mine – will perish in their tens of thousands. Hamas, for whom the value of human life is less than zero, will work systematically to maximize civilian casualties in order to weaponize them as atrocity propaganda. Scenes of civilian suffering will be captured on camera phones, and disseminated across the Muslim world including among Israeli Arabs, and in Europe and the United States. The result will be mass civil unrest and wild cat terror attacks on Israeli and Jewish targets worldwide. Appeals for the US and Europe to remain on the sidelines of a regional war accordingly have no chance of success: the domain of conflict is already global. Meanwhile the mood in some sections of Israeli society is close to psychosis. The prospect of Baruch Goldstein-style terror against Israeli Arab and West Bank targets also cannot be ruled out.

    We are now at the edge of a global paroxysm of violence from which no retreat is possible, and in which the best possible outcome is the “merely” catastrophic. Already, following the initiation of airstrikes on Gaza, Saudi Arabia, engaged for over a decade in its own brutal conflict against Iranian proxies in Yemen, has announced the suspension of delicate negotiations to normalize relations with Israel. At some point in the next several days, Israel will commence highly uncertain ground operations in Gaza, and Hezbollah will escalate attacks on Northern Israel “in response to Israeli aggression” and open-up a second hot front.

    The obvious geopolitical winner from all of this is Iran, which funds and controls Hamas, and has already applauded their action; according to the Wall Street Journal the Iranian Revolutionary Guard Corps helped to plan it. According to journalist Sohrab Ahmari, pro-regime Iranians are openly speaking of an eschatological final showdown against the broader geopolitical background of the increasingly directionless, deranged and overstretched United States and there is every reason to anticipate this prospect. One can note uselessly once again the most critical error made by the United States in recent decades: following the end of the Soviet Union, Russia could, and should, have become a crucial partner in a global north stretching across the planet. But that opportunity was missed. Instead, three decades of hubris and corruption have led to the birth of a global system of counter-power which threatens the West existentially, and perhaps has already destroyed it.

    Hamas clearly has counted on all of this: leaving Israel no choice except to respond with ferocity suggests at least one explanation behind the savagery of their tactics. But the problem is evidently not only Hamas. As public squares from New York to Sydney filled with demonstrators openly celebrating a weekend of atrocities, with the bodies of their victims not yet cold, the intellectuals of the anti-colonial Left were already issuing statements simultaneously applauding Hamas and blaming their violence on Israel.

    What is at work here is the same matrix of nihilism now at work everywhere, and underneath everything, from blasé celebrations of war crimes, to crazed calls for genocide, to preening statements of affected indifference and delusional arrogance and empty rhetoric and hollow gestures. But perhaps what we are also witnessing is the end of this too. Already in 1970 McLuhan predicted that World War Three would be “a guerrilla information war, with no divisions between military and civilian participation.” With the atrocities that flooded social media on Saturday, and are still continuing to flood it, this war has now begun. What is desperately needed at a moment of extraordinary danger is genuine moral courage and leadership: whether or not it is found will determine if the West can save anything from what happens next.


    Daniel Miller is a writer, critic, and IM—1776’s literary editor.
     
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  3. AroundTheWorld

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    40 beheaded babies in one village alone.

    These monsters need to be eliminated.
     
  4. basso

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  5. basso

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  6. basso

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  7. basso

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    Guerre Israël-Hamas : Gérald Darmanin demande « l’expulsion immédiate » des auteurs étrangers d’actes antisémites
    Le ministre de l’Intérieur a donné comme consigne aux préfets de faire preuve « de fermeté » face aux auteurs d’actes antisémites. S’ils sont étrangers, Gérald Daramanin souhaite que leur titre de séjour soit retiré « immédiatement ».
    https://www.nouvelobs.com/societe/2...es-auteurs-etrangers-d-actes-antisemites.html
     
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  8. basso

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  9. AroundTheWorld

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    An Israeli I know who invested a lot of money and dedicated many years of his life to improve relations between Israelis and Arabs posted this on LinkedIn:

    There is a ton of disinformation floating around about Gaza. So, time for the facts....

    1. Israel fully pulled out of Gaza in September 2005, leaving the Palestinian Authority in charge. Initially two border crossings, one to Israel and one to Egypt were opened. In December 2005, a Palestinian who was a resident of a Palestinian Authority controlled area killed several people in a suicide bombing in Netanya Israel, not surprisingly resulting in the Israeli government closing the border.

    2. In 2007, Hamas took over Gaza in a military coup. Hamas' charter calls for the destruction of the State of Israel.

    3. Hamas has used the money international donors gave to the Palestinian residents of Gaza for food and shelter to build rockets and terror tunnels into Israeli territory (Yes, rockets cost lots of money). Several tens of thousands of rockets have been fired into Israel. These rockets were built through materials transferred through the same crossings that were open to provide Gazans with food, water and fuel by Israelis and Egyptians.

    4. If Canada or Mexico were to fire rockets at the United States, the US military would make both countries in to "large parking lots", almost immediate. Israelis have been facing this for over a decade.

    I do not know of any reasonable Israeli who does not want Gazans to live freely or in prosperity. But I do not know any democracy anywhere in the world that would allow itself to have rockets fired on it for over a decade without reacting even more strongly.

    Just as there is no moral equivalence between ISIS or Al Qaeda and the US, there is no moral equivalence in this conflict either. Until the world wakes up to the truth of Hamas, there will never be peace.

    I believe in a two state solution and have spent a lot of time and money trying to bring Jews and Arabs together. But, if you want the same thing to happen, you should be joining us, unequivocally and without qualification, in calling for the eradication of Hamas.
     
  10. tinman

    tinman 999999999
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  11. AroundTheWorld

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    Another post by an Israeli founder:

    Posting on LinkedIn is the last thing I want to do right now. But the world needs to know what's happening in Israel, and silence is not an option.

    On Saturday morning thousands of Hamas terrorists crossed the border from Gaza and brutally slaughtered hundreds of innocent people, including children and the elderly... the images and stories are gut-wrenching... decapitated infants, gang rapes, torture, entire families burned alive... At least 260 people killed at a peaceful music festival where a close friend of mine watched two of her colleagues gunned down on the dance-floor as she ran to cover.

    Over 150 babies, children, women, men, and the elderly, including holocaust survivors, were hauled back into Gaza and taken hostage where they are being subjugated to a living hell. In one voice recording a Hamas terrorist tells his friend he’s found him “a cute blond, just how he likes them," after killing “all the ugly ones.” In another video proudly shared by Hamas on social media a young Israeli woman is tied up naked spread-eagled in the back of truck while she is paraded in the streets brutalized and beaten.

    I’ve been working for peace in this region for over two decades. I support the foundation of a viable Palestinian state, and I condemn violence against civilians under any circumstance. I've been critical of Israeli policy and remain critical of Israeli policy on Palestine, and I try to always see the nuance and complexity in any situation.

    But let me be unequivocally clear- nothing can justify these barbaric and evil actions. NOTHING. Hamas, like ISIS, is a terror organization, that has explicably called for the annihilation of Jews and Israelis. They objectify women, execute gays, use their own women and children as human shields, teach hatred and racism in schools, and sanctify death over life time and time again. This is the evil we're dealing with, and we need to call it by its name.

    This post is a plea to my friends, colleagues, and professional community- please stand with Israel today. Take a stand. Share your support and voice your outrage. We need your help today more than ever. We will prevail.
     
  12. CrixusTheUndefeatedGaul

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    Awesome move. I applaud you France. We should do the same damn thing here.
     
  13. tinman

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    @Os Trigonum

     
  14. DatRocketFan

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    What is considered antisemitic acts? Folks Saying i hate jews? Our country allows freedom of speech hence why neo nazi and other hate group to b still around.

    It ain't happening in our country.
     
  15. AroundTheWorld

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  16. basso

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  17. AroundTheWorld

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    Another LinkedIn post by an Israeli tech person.


    In the last 48 hours a lot of love has been pouring towards all of us Israelis who are dealing with the horrors of our very own 9/11. To the supporters - thank you so much for your love and concern, it’s deeply felt and very much appreciated.

    Unfortunately, some people on social media really shocked me with their lack of empathy and implied justification of these heinous acts. To them I want to say:

    You can have empathy for the Palestinian people - I do - and feel horrified when 260 young people are massacred at a festival.

    You can vehemently disagree with the policies of the Israeli government, even find them reprehensible - I do - and know that raping women and driving their violated, naked bodies around Gaza is beyond barbaric and should be condemned with everything in you.

    You can feel compassion for the Palestinian civilians that die in an endless, senseless war cultivated by the terrorist organization that rules them - I do - and not justify burning people alive in their homes or their cars for any reason.

    You can mourn Palestinian children, who died for no reason other than the quest for power of religious zealots and politicians on both sides - I do - and still condemn the murder and capture of Israeli babies and toddlers as hostages.

    You can want a solution for the humanitarian crisis in Gaza - I do - and know that executing 700+ people in cold blood and unspeakable cruelty is not the right way to get there.

    You can want a thriving Palestinian people - I do - and question whether the Gazan population is best served by billions in aid going to tens of thousands of missiles used to attack the Israeli civilian population.

    You can ache at the way innocent Palestinians suffer - I do - and still show basic empathy when humans on the other side, who are just as powerless as you to change the world to fit their values, spent 48 hours not knowing what happened to their loved ones, or watching them get murdered or captured by terrorists in full technicolor on social media.

    If you can’t do all of these at the same time, and can’t condemn inhumane violence against innocent people before jumping to debate complex political situations you likely do nothing to support outside the comments section, maybe you should check your humanity. It’s a prerequisite to becoming a keyboard warrior for justice.
     
  18. basso

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    there are some here, I won't name names at this moment, who could not.
     
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  19. hooroo

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    Arabs are also a semitic peoples. Then again, it's the French we're talking about here. They have a history of discriminating against Jews & Arabs.
     
  20. basso

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    @Deckard has been oddly quiet in this thread.

     

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