New York State AG Leticia James has filed a civil fraud lawsuit against Trump

The Victims in these CRIMES were every citizen in the state whose infrastructure budgets were not at the size they should have been.

Don't follow the Tucker Carlson Phrasology brigade....

The GOP talking points are ****ING STUPID......pure ignorance.

DD

 

The victims of the fraud are also other potential borrowers who had projects that weren't overvalued.

 

I understand fraud can happen but this is basics. Getting a legitimate appraisal is basic and if the bank isn't getting one it's because they really want to make the loan

 

How so?

 

If another developer has a project that isn't based on false evaluations yet don't get funding because another developer lied about their evaluations and got funding that would be considered harm.

 

That's not the case. These are big banks, Trump's loans aren't depleting their resources.

 

Those resources aren't unlimited otherwise banks would fund everything.

Anyway the argument that harm is done by someone else taking the opportunity that someone else might've had is the basis of arguments against Affirmative Action. That white or asian students didn't get a college admission or scholarship because a black student got it or for businesses that a minority owned business got a government project because of an affirmative action based government set aside.

 

Nice strawman with the affirmative action. Nobody is not got getting loans cause Trump got a loan. If Deutsche Bank couldn't.make loans it would be an be an even bigger story than this.

Edit: if a bank needs money they would get it from the government

 

In case trump and his crime family was thinking of moving money and/or businesses...

 

I've defended Trump on some of his lawsuits in which he was clearly guilty of the charges and I regret that. In this case I just think since the entities who have supposedly been defrauded have never made an issue, they fo whatever reasons wanted to do business with Trump. It would be different if they were accusing Trump

James has been pledging to go after Trump since running for office. No matter how you feel about him that gives him legitimate cause to claim a witch hunt. Deutsche did cut ties with Trump after the riot so when their people testify we should get some honesty about their dealings

 

A with hunt that has a witch though. There is no question that this case was driven by political motive, but that doesn't make him any less guilty. Given that it seems like the city will walk away with some money, it seems like the right decision to have filed this suit.

 

When I say there are no victims, no one has accused him of fraud because they apparently don't feel defrauded. Banks don't do these loans because you say I got a guy in Saudi who will pay this. There is more to it.

This isnt about a could have been a victim. There are the banks who lent the money. Where are they in this process?

 

It’s really that simple. It’s a crime to lie to a federally insured bank on a loan application. The banks can sue him, if they’ve been damaged, in a civil suit. This is a criminal proceeding. If you grossly overstate your worth on a loan application to a federal institution, it’s a crime.

This proceeding isn’t in a vacuum either. It comes on top of things like the Trump Foundation being a total nonprofit fraud in the same state.

 

Fraud did happen, and let's be clear: in New York, that's all that's needed for the state to file a civil lawsuit. Actual direct victims of fraud are not necessary.

With that said, I don't think we can definitively state what the banks (and others involved) did and why they did it. It's very likely that they conducted their own appraisal and decided to proceed with loans under certain conditions based on their appraisal. It's even possible that Trump might not have received any actual benefits other than to his ego and his public image (Forbes has stated that Trump is obsessed with inflating his business to be on their Top 400 list, which they have rejected with their own analysis). Anyway, this case could reveal more details if there are internal memos.

Also, remember that this case is now about determining how much Trump and his associates should pay in fines. The prosecutors will have to make the case for why they should pay at least $250 million in fines. It's not clear how fines are determined in cases like this, but remember that fines can themselves be a deterrent for fraudulent behaviors and are not necessarily meant to recoup "losses." Right now, we are speculating, but things should become clearer when more details become available. My stance is still that even if there isn't a direct victim, fraud should not be allowed to stand without accountability for basic reasons - maybe not 250m in fines, but something like a criminal prosecution.

 

This isn't a criminal proceeding

 

I stand corrected and you’re absolutely right. It’s a proceeding brought by the government, and I should have stated it that way

 

I see you raise your own strawman that banks can just get unlimited money from the government. The Government will bail out banks in the event of a crisis like in 2009 but that's not the same as them just being able to lend unlimited amounts.

Also how do you know someone didn't get a loan because Trump did?