I get your point, and I don't disagree. I do think it would be bad PR. I also think Crane might be (and should be) past the point of caring too much about whether it's bad PR. Sure, it's bad PR, but there's nothing really morally questionable about it and it's a reasonable baseball decision for the long-term betterment of the franchise. If he fires Baker and Brown in the offseason, hires back Hinch and Lunhow and throws a giant double middle finger at their introductory press conference (literally or metaphorically), that's the kind of PR you want to avoid. But this isn't that. Managers get let go all the time, and Baker has been let go many times in the past. In the end, all of this is a moot point. They have a ton of work to do before this should even really be a conversation, and if it happens, it will be a good problem to have. I hope the biggest offseason concern we have is "We just won back-to-back World Series. Do we have to bring back Dusty again?" Every sports fan should be so lucky.
My guess is the Astros go with a rotation of: Verlander/Valdez/Javier and then tandem start France and Urquidy in a game 4 scenario. The Astros will have to roll with a tighter pen than last year because the depth just isn't there.... Pressy/Abreu/Neris/Graveman will likely be the "big 4" and Brown will likely make it as a possible long man or lights out reliever. Montero and Maton I suspect don't make it with Stanek getting the call over both of them.
There are about a dozen regular posters in here who have been actively rooting for the 'Stros to lose... For weeks... Even months... Holding first place in the division... And to miss the playoffs... All so Dusty would be gone at the earliest possible date. So, yeah, it's ****ing disgusting and a pathetic betrayal of our values as both ClutchFans and citizens of the universe, and, yeah, it has to be asked. Doing the best I can over here, mang. I penned this plea for reason out of desperation: https://bbs.clutchfans.net/threads/for-steamers-shame-to-star-seed-a-sensible-supplication.320995/
I hate the idea of actually scheduling Urquidy for any innings in the post season. He and Brown have been awful. Using him in mop up is one thing, but actually planning to use him in a game before it even starts is scary as hell. I think they need to hope that the #3 starter and ideally #2 starter as well can go reasonably deep and the bullpen is fresh. I would prefer to use Maton, Stanek, Graveman, Neris, Abreu, and Pressly to cover 5-6 innings than use Urquidy in the 3rd-5th innings in a tandem situation. Maton has been very good when used in the right situations. He should never be brought in w/runners on base (a terrible decision Dusty frequently makes that isn't talked about) but starting an inning in low leverage he has been very very good. Stanek, too, has been good. He hasn't walked a batter since July (13.2 IP) but still has good K and BA against numbers. I wouldn't use him in high leverage but I feel better about him than I did last post season. Brown has electric stuff, like teams want to use in the playoffs. He can be a weapon but does not have time to prove he has the command required. He is essentially in the spot Stanek was going into the post season last year. I would still use all 3 of them before Urquidy to get through the 5th inning of any game and 6th if the lead is 4+ and/or the matchups good. Graveman, Neris, Abreu, and Pressly are the only guys who touch the 7th-9th innings unless it's Framber or JV on a ridiculous game, or the game is already decided (very big lead or deficit in not elimination game)
The question here is kinda silly. If people are rooting against the Astros so they’ll fire Baker, then they should reevaluate their relationship with the Astros as a fan. If the Astros are fully healthy and remain so through most of the season and say don’t resign Maldy, then you can make an argument Dusty’s style could work well. It’s hard to argue with playoff results and the underlying decisions too much. However, in a season like this one, it’s a really bad fit. How happy/sad I’ll be about Dusty potentially returning is less about Dusty and more about what the overall situation looks like for the Astros next year.
I don't think fans are rooting for the Stros not to win it all just to lose Dusty. I think it's just a feeling that they don't believe Dusty helps them win it all as much as another manager would. I think that, but would damn love another parade with the old codger.
It's just remarkably stupid, for, like, 500 different reasons. First - and perhaps most foremost: winning a championship does not guarantee Baker's return. Ask James Click about that. Crane could very well be tired of Baker's shenanigans or Baker could retire. Nor does losing hasten his exit, btw. Having said that.... I would sign up for Dusty Baker to be this team's manager until he literally passed away in the dugout to get another championship. Fans should not be so spoiled and certainly not so entitled. What is happening is not only unprecedented, it's literally once-in-a-lifetime. There will NEVER, EVER be a run like this by this team ever again. To actively root against it to run off the manager - who, it should be noted, regardless of how you feel about him, would be managing in his third consecutive WS and winning B2B rings - is so incredibly arrogant and pissy-baby, that I wish I could strip people who might feel that way of their fandom. There is a too-large subset of Astros fans that are miserably insufferable and should find something else to channel their energy into.
You would be unfortunately mistaken, Kim the Honorable. I have but to refer you to any series thread in the last month for countless examples - which is the weirdest part, because they are daily active, yet unabashedly root against the Astros. Interesting stuff.
The bottom line is this is a talented team that COULD win a World Series with anyone managing. Even Dusty And they might. And as a fan I would rather he be the manager and win than someone else and lose. Winning trumps all. But there is no doubt this team is winning despite him not because of him.
I have expressed this sentiment to these lost souls a hundred different ways, usually resulting in accusations of me being a narcissist and fandom gatekeeper. You can't make people love themselves, but you can try to plant that seed...
Well there is lies the rub, and it is why the Astros didn't win the division by 10 games. The pitching is inconsistent and the depth just isn't there. Javier's stuff has been a lot better the last two games, had the Astros decided to show up at his last start, he would have gone 6 innings with 1 run. Instead they had like three errors and misjudged several other should have been outs. However, even with Javier's stuff back, he isn't going deep in a game..... and it isn't likely that Verlander will at 40 years old either as they want to keep him fresh for deeper in the playoffs anyway. Valdez has the chance to go deep, but that is just about it. By default, France will be the #4 starter but he is gassed and not going very deep at all. Urquidy has been very up and down the last handful of appearances. He has had some very good and some terrible. My "guess" is Urquidy would come in to start a clean inning and if he pitches well they let him go, but if he gets in trouble they try to patch the game over with Stanek for an inning and maybe Brown for an inning or two - that will get them deep enough into the game for Graveman and Neris. The #3 starter isn't going deep. Javier just doesn't go deep - so we are looking at 3-4 innings of the pen being needed if he pitches well. Perhaps if we are up by 3-4 runs we can try to sneak a Stanek inning in there but that is about as good as it gets. Maton can get you clean innings but he is someone you have to be really careful with. Yes because he doesn't handle pressure well. I don't feel better about him honestly. I will defer to the Astros pitching coaches on this - because we have seen him as a starter this year, and he has been garbage this season. However, his stuff may be effective in the pen. If the pitching coaches say it is translating, then I would put him over all but 3 relievers. I don't like using too many relievers, you are bound to get to one that doesn't have it that day. Neris or Abreu could go over one inning in closing series game - but not Pressly.
My pitching plan: Fri: France 4ip, Urquidy 2ip, leverage based 7-8-9 (high leverage is Neris-Abreu-Pressly, low leverage is Maton-Stanek-Graveman) Sat: JV 6ip, leverage based 7-8-9 Sun: Javier 4ip, Brown 2ip, leverage based 7-8-9 Sousa and Montero are extra arms. If Sun is an elimination game then everyone except Framber would be available including France and JV. I would like them to swap out Sousa with someone who is stretched out who can mop up bulk innings if a game gets out of hand. Dubin would be my choice but Bielak and Blanco are other options.
I'm ok with this. The chances of anything coming close to comparing to the historic pitching situation of last year are low from where this fan is sitting. That's OK - we'll just have to find other ways to win, because that's what mother ****ing chompions do. Every petunia is unique, in bloom and decay... And that's the fun part :}
I get what you mean, but I'm just guessing deep down, they're going to love it if the Stros win another chip. The rooting against is based on the belief that the Stros aren't going to win another one with Baker so whatever it takes to get him out (more short term losses for long term gains) is what they want. I can't tell the future and I'm not a seamhead, but I've been persuaded by the anti-Dusty movement. I still get pissed when they lose though, but losing Dusty too would be the silver lining. Still would love the parade and I still believe that's a small possibility.
