What “our actions”? Self defense laws haven’t changed and in that case they clearly is a situation where third party self defense is justified. The Neely case though no witness has said that Neely was actually violent when Penny put him in the hold. I’ll stress again I haven’t seen new evidence regarding this case and thinks it could go either way. To me a critical portion of the case is whether Penny knew that was he was doing could kill him.
Sorry I missed this earlier but as someone who teaches martial arts it is an important issue. To a certain extant yes. Self defense laws literally say “reasonable and appropriate force” to that is understood and supported by case law as you can’t use lethal force to a non lethal threat. There are thought many complicating factors for example if a 90 pound woman was facing a 230 pound man who was unarmed but physically assaulting her. In that case because of the disparity in force it would be reasonable and appropriate for her to possibly use lethal force.
If a marine stopped that dude from attacking her The woke people would blame it on the marine and Al Sharpton would be on tv talking about it
It's so weird how guys like Commodore and Stupid scour the internet for black violence stories that have nothing to do with the original debate. I don't know anyone who would defend some guy beating a person to death, when they weren't physically attacked first, or held at knifepoint or gunpoint.
What black violence stories did I scour the Internet for? The only two stories I have discussed in this thread involving black people and violence were the thread topic and the George Zimmerman/Trayvon Martin incident (which was raised by @Rocket River). My commentary on the original topic was that it didn't look good for the defendant and that from what I had read the defense of others claims were problematic.
Race card is tops breh @ROXRAN @Salvy Play the race card! Wokes only know race is the reason for everything
Would you help someone on the subway if they were attacked by a lunatic ? you might not do it knowing the media will call you racist if the person you stopped was not the narrative the media wants @Salvy you don’t want Al Sharpton talking about you breh
The DAs dropped the charges to Williams and Alba after they both defended themselves by stabbing their attackers. Of course, a lot of public outrage was needed before the victims were freed from jail. In my opinion, a victim should have the advantage in self defense. It doesn't have to be fair.
Yes and while in college in Berkeley actually stopped an assault by a black man on a black woman both were possibly homeless. This was before the days of universal cell phones. And during the George Floyd riots intervened to prevent looting in my neighborhood.
I don’t know the exact facts of the case you cite so cant give a solid opinion on it. If someone slapped someone would you consider it fine that the person who was slapped to stab their attacker since it doesn’t have to be fair?
I linked you the articles. Jose Alba was national news, too. It depends on the context of the slap. Most cases where it's a single incident, probably not. But is there a history of abuse between the two parties, like a domestic abuser or bully? Yes.
If you read the tweet thread, it is the witness that originally refers to the defendant as "the white man" and the prosecutor uses the same term. I would note though, that he doesn't use the same term the witness used for the decedent (who the witness refers to as Jordan but the ADA refers to as Mr. Neely). It is a bit strange to change the terminology of one but not the other. I would say when questioning a witness, if there is an easily distinguishable characteristic about one of them that the witness refers to, it can be okay to use the same reference point. Like, if a witness says, "the guy in the mask came in and pulled out a gun". I might refer to "the guy in the mask" instead of saying the defendant's name.
1. Seems like it would be up to the defense to object to that characterization if they found it objectionable. And up to the judge to decide if it is or isn't. 2. It might be language that the defense prefers because referring to an assailant as "the white man" reinforces for the jury that it is an open question whether the witness is able to do a positive ID and say for certain that the white man in question was Daniel Penny. Whereas there is no question about the identity of Jordan Neely. Idk if that's an issue -- I'm paying no attention to this case. 3. While I endorse the idea that court cases should be open to the public for transparency's sake, I think it's lamentable that social media makes it possible for muckrakers to pluck little exchanges out of context and blast it to a million people who are ignorant of the rest of the proceeding so that they can score points on some unrelated political agenda.
I have seen courts admonish people to refer to others by a title and last name without objection. Most frequently when defense attorneys keep referring to their client by their first name. (Which apparently has also happened in this case, the defense referring to client by first name I mean). Sometimes, yes. ID isn't at issue here. No one disputes who any of the parties are. I would prefer they all just get put up on video sites (YouTube and/or equivalent). Let the Internet public have the same access that anyone who shows up and watches in person has. That way there is no gatekeeping by muckrakers, and everyone is free to see it for themselves.
https://thepostmillennial.com/jorda...body-before-daniel-penny-intervened-witnesses On Thursday, a 911 call was played during the Manhattan manslaughter trial of former Marine Daniel Penny in which subway passengers could be heard telling dispatchers that a homeless man, later identified as Jordan Neely, was "trying to attack everybody" before the former Marine put him in a chokehold. That encounter later led to Neely's death. In the audio, 18-year-old Moriela Sanchez could be heard asking the 911 operator to send police and an ambulance because someone was attacking passengers on the uptown F train subway car. The audio was played during her testimony in the Manhattan Supreme Court. During the 1 minute recording, Sanchez said about Neely, “He’s trying to attack everybody.” She described the attacker as black and that “There’s one white man holding him down, holding the homeless guy down.” Sanchez added, “Penny put his hands around [Neely’s] neck and then dropped him down so he wouldn’t attack anybody.” Sanchez’s friend Ivette Rosario, who testified on Monday that she was “scared” of Neely, was the one who took the video of the May 2023 incident with her cellphone that showed Penny holding Neely on the floor of the subway car. Sanchez also recorded a video of Neely lying on the floor of the subway car, which the jury also watched.
