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Ukraine

Discussion in 'BBS Hangout: Debate & Discussion' started by NewRoxFan, Nov 25, 2018.

  1. SamFisher

    SamFisher Member

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    In the < 1 year time horizon. In the present day.

    The vast majority of Ukraine - which has not been invaded by genocidal mercs and colonialist climbers that make up Putin's gangster army (along with the forced labor cannon fodder) - is way better off, even being drone bombed, than being drone bombed and then also gang raped and pillaged by the Putin-Trump foot soldiers.

    You're basically making a version of the very vapid argument that Noam Chomsky made in 2022, which was something like: Ukraine should just lay down their arms and literally surrender to Putin and his gang in the name of harm reduction, because their defeat was inevitable.

    This argument has 2 fatal flaws

    1) the weird utilitarian bent that Ukrainians have no right to self determination and have to submit to imperial Dominion (by a reprehensible gangland empire) for some elusory "greater good"

    2) the now (though in fairness, not then) clearly obvious underestimating of Ukraine's capacity to beat back the invasion and the general ineptitude of the Russian empire.

    I mean it's funny you're talking about how Ukraine should surrender to Russia because their economy is wrecked - sure instead be absorbed by Russia whose economy runs on alcoholism and looted washing machines.

    Also, I'm free to make these observation from my couch and not from a trench in Bakhamut.

    Doesn't make them less true. If it were true you'd see Ukrainians surrendering en masse.
     
    glynch likes this.
  2. astros123

    astros123 Member
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    @Nook Why did you not correct @glynch in his assertion that there was some sort of peace deal available after the first month of the war? s

    There was no confirmed peace deal available after the first month of the war. This is a rumor started by the internet and people mis interrupted what the Israeli PM said in hebrew. The "deal" that lefties always like to point to is nothing but rumors. Israeli PM said himself that after Bucha happened the ukrianians pulled out of the talks and he didnt know if the deal was possible or not.

    Theres literally zero evidence that ukraine could've gotten a better deal elsewhere. Dont let people spread conspiracies and disinformation without being corrected. Its all people do nowadays after @AroundTheWorld .The state department and CIA chief have been aggressively denied the rumor yet somehow people still spread the rumor as it is fact.

    Its scary how much disinformation is rampant in every corner of society.
     
  3. Invisible Fan

    Invisible Fan Member

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    A cost of war?
    Europe's $1 Trillion Energy Bill Only Marks Start of the Crisis
    Europe got hit by roughly $1 trillion from surging energy costs in the fallout of Russia's war in Ukraine, and the deepest crisis in decades is only getting started.

    After this winter, the region will have to refill gas reserves with little to no deliveries from Russia, intensifying competition for tankers of the fuel. Even with more facilities to import liquefied natural gas coming online, the market is expected to remain tight until 2026, when additional production capacity from the US to Qatar becomes available. That means no respite from high prices.


    While governments were able to help companies and consumers absorb much of the blow with more than $700 billion in aid, according to the Brussels-based think tank Bruegel, a state of emergency could last for years. With interest rates rising and economies likely already in recession, the support that cushioned the blow for millions of households and businesses is looking increasingly unaffordable.
    "Once you add everything up bailouts, subsidies it is a ridiculously large amount of money," said Martin Devenish, a director at consultancy S-RM. "It's going to be a lot harder for governments to manage this crisis next year."

    Government fiscal capacity is already stretched. About half of European Union member states have debt exceeding the bloc's limit of 60% of gross domestic product.

    The roughly $1 trillion, calculated by Bloomberg from market data, is a broad tally of more expensive energy for consumers and companies some but not all of which was offset with aid packages. Bruegel has a similar estimate looking at demand and an increase in prices, which was published in a report this month by the IMF.​
     
    AkeemTheDreem86 and astros123 like this.
  4. basso

    basso Member
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  5. Commodore

    Commodore Member

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  6. astros123

    astros123 Member
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    What's his ****** doing in Ukraine anyways ? People polling 1% pretending to be powerful. What a joke
     
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  7. Commodore

    Commodore Member

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    no better way to demonstrate one's courage and virtue than a pilgrimage to see St. Vladimir
     
  8. dmoneybangbang

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    Chris Christie is the only GOP nominee I'd vote for.... just refreshing to hear a conservative not engaging in populism.
     
  9. dmoneybangbang

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    Russia had always planned on using commodities to fight against the West. The Ukraine invasion after the heels of Covid wasn't a coincidence.

    You can see both China and Russia trying to secure as much of the world's strategic resources as possible.
     
  10. Deckard

    Deckard Blade Runner
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    Indeed. I admire Governor Christie, a Republican, for acting like a Republican, instead of being a demented far-right extremist like DeSantis and like trump, also known as "trump the Pig."

    A coin with the image of Saint Vladimir:
    [​IMG]

    trump is a Pig. It is known.
    [​IMG]
     
    #13210 Deckard, Aug 6, 2023
    Last edited: Aug 6, 2023
    Xopher, ROCKSS and dmoneybangbang like this.
  11. Deckard

    Deckard Blade Runner
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    The result of a donated drone:

     
  12. Commodore

    Commodore Member

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  13. Ottomaton

    Ottomaton Member
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    Niger/Nigeria about to turn into the second front for Russia's war on European LNG, Wagner is in Niger working for the coup leaders. Remember when Prigozhin said that Wagner was "going back to Africa" like 3 weeks ago, and now suddenly here they are... funny how that works.

    IMG_20230806_161539_219.jpg





    Nigeria (and ECOWAS) had a deadline to restore the elected president Bazoum to the presidency which expired today. They've been threatening to invade to restore him if Niger let it expire.
     
    #13213 Ottomaton, Aug 6, 2023
    Last edited: Aug 6, 2023
  14. tinman

    tinman 999999999
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    where’s lizzo?
    @Jontro
     
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  15. rocketsjudoka

    rocketsjudoka Member

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    Yet more reason why developing renewable distributed energy sources and energy efficiency is a good idea.
     
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  16. tinman

    tinman 999999999
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    It’s also a good idea for people not to be big and fat
    But that’s not going to happen
    @Os Trigonum
     
  17. ROCKSS

    ROCKSS Member
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    I would agree, he has no chance IMO but I like his moxy. I thought I might like ronny d, but he took a hard right turn and his woke, woke, woke agenda is tired. Unfortunately, the gop is under the spell of trump and unity is not on the agenda............F the libtards, now were going streakin in the quad

    [​IMG]
     
  18. Nook

    Nook Member

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    It isn't about what I want, or what you want.

    The Ukrainian people want to keep fighting for their homeland.
     
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  19. Nook

    Nook Member

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    This is really insidious propaganda.

    You can find similar activities during WWI, WWII and Vietnam.
     
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  20. Deckard

    Deckard Blade Runner
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    You are exactly right. The Russian propaganda machine has been pumping out huge amounts of this kind of material in hopes of influencing the people of our country, as well as the citizens in countries who are our friends and allies, as you obviously know very well. They've been doing this sort of thing for many years.

    They send similar propaganda to developing countries, and to countries who are essentially our enemies, the latter in the hope that they will pick it up and spread it around, which they are happy to do and in such a way that it looks like it's legitimate. China's media is very happy to do so. They are busy doing the same thing themselves.

    There's a reason I have @tinman on ignore. In this forum, he litters it with endless amounts of bigotry and finds it amusing to do so, he posts Russian propaganda, which he may or may not understand, but finds amusing, and blatant Republican lies - all with the attitude and "understanding" of a 12 year old. He's always sure to "tag" other members that he thinks enjoy what he's posting. Some don't enjoy what he's pumping out, but encourage him anyway. Why? Because it amuses them to troll the forum. In my opinion.
     

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