My guy, I've been pro Jalen since the beginning and still think he's the #2 prospect from his class. I just know what chip level players look like and they're almost always 2-way players. Right now I haven't seen him do that. Can he? Yeah I think so but he has to absolutely be locked in defensively or go berzerk on offense. If I was a betting man, I'd say you're more likely to win chips with Amen/Jabari types than Jalen types. But we'll see. He's the third best "prospect" we have (2nd best player we have right now behind Sengun). It doesn't really matter though because no one was in a position to succeed last year and he does deserve credit for being in constant crossfire from the media and NBA circles due to the ineptitude from the front office. One thing I will say for sure is that the Rockets this season will go as far as Jalen takes them. Hoping he makes a leap. We'll see.
No one was in a position to succeed the past two years and Green talented his way into self creating his rookie year with significantly more efficiency than Jabari. What type of player is Jabari that Green isnt that you can win with him? Jabari scored at a 50% ts rate with self creation percentage in the 20s while Green scores at 55% ts his rookie year with 50% self creation. Both joined at 19. One joined after a Coivd lockdown where their Gleague season was canceled minus like 14 games. Green had everything going against him and still was significantly more efficient without needing teammates to spoonfed him. So what type of player do you mean by winning? Is the ultra inefficient on spot up shooting types the ones that will you to win? Like if your point it is more likely that Jabari will become an elite role player than Green becoming an elite primary option, sure I guess? Becoming a elite primary option is much more difficult to achieve than becoming an elite role player. But Jabari reaching his potential does not fill a need the Rockets absolutely need that Green is supposed to fill if he reaches his potential.
People are so enarnired with the mere concept of two way that a rookie who was atrocious as a defender in advanced analytics and had a 50% ts on mostly spot up shots has great "two way potential". Okay. Let us see him clear average on one side before we see him as someone who contributes to winning.
https://www.youtube.com/live/K1bOotD_zjY?feature=share 30:00 Sam Vecenie basically answering the same question the same exact way.
Has nothing to do with what some other person thinks. Jabari you've never seen perform great NBA defense for a season but you already tab him a two way player. I understand he gave great effort defensively. In fact he's not yet had an average offensive or defensive season yet for an average NBA player. What we've seen is effort and great physical attributes. I'm high on his future but I'm just pointing out how willing you are to be Uber optimistic about a certain player. Amen you've never seen play an NBA game and you know he's a 25% 3pt shooter but you already tab him a two way player. May end up better than Jalen, but how is this not a totally speculative position? Why is their no condition about him needing to prove he can be a non-negative scorer? Defense is not more important than offense and vice versa. Jalen you've never seen excel but suddenly you get all safe with the predictions and you don't believe he's the guy. You prefer two way players and are confusing that with the likelihood of championship success. There are no championships without 1-2 players who can excel in iso possessions - you ignore that. There are plenty of championships without two way players leading and moreso with each passing year, but you ignore that. If you said it's just your instinct I can respect that but the specific rationale you've laid out is full of arbitrary standards and bias. Your standards are shifting for each player so as far as objective analysis goes this position is ridden with issues. Anyway I get the idea this is your preference and that's ok too.
Well, the equation here is this: boring offseason + young team with unproven players + Internet message forum = speculative crystal-balling takes. Production is the ultimate pudding-proof, yes, but in the absence of reliable data you make predictions. At the end, however, reality is always richer than what our models predict. We may argue here about Jalen vs Jabari vs Amen, but I wouldn't be surprised at all if our core ends up being Sengun/Eason/Whitmore...
Jalen is absolutely going to ball out this season. The talent is too tremendous. Yall are way too fixated on all these metrics for someone who has only been in the league for 2 years. Fact is there isn't a perfect NBA player that produces all these fantasy stats yall desire in there first 2 seasons outside of Luka and Lebron. Kobe Joker Steph TMac DBook Giannis Kawhi Paul George.... all of these guys would have failed in your fake fantasy metrics world in the first 2 seasons in some form or fashion..
It's pretty simple. Plus defenders that are elite at one other aspect of the game project to be championship level players and deserve max contracts. Jabari projects as a Defensive 1st Team level player while also projecting as an elite shot maker. Coupled with his tenacious personality you can pretty much see "it". Amen Thompson projects as a plus defender with a lot of valuable defensive instincts (not completely dying when screened is one). Coupled with Top 5 athleticism, a knack for finishing around the basket and the best vision/passing in his draft class makes it so can pretty much see "it" as well. Jalen Green hasn't shown the ability to be a plus defender being shorter than the other two, smaller framed and riddled with poor defensive instincts. He dies on screens and loses his man off ball leading to easy cuts at the rim. His offensive acumen however is amazing as is his elite athleticism. He glides in a way you rarely see and can easily be the hub of a team's offense. He projects as an elite foul drawer. He also has a lot of questions about how seriously he takes the game due to various off court videos, interviews, trips, etc. He's not well spoken, doesn't appear to have above average IQ either. For these reasons, I have Jabari and Amen rated higher from a prospect perspective, than Jalen Green. I do not currently believe that Jalen Green is worth a max contract. That could change but right now he's third. I also don't particularly think that Jalen is going to project as a significantly better iso player than Amen. He probably will be worse actually. Jalen's handle isn't super tight and the threat of the pass isn't there nearly as much as with Amen. How do you rate the Rockets 6 young guns right now and why?
Season 1 is Part I. Season 2 is Part II. Each part has several chapters. That's how a lot of books are organized.
So nothing about on play court but perception of archetype. Jabari is a 0 way player in his NBA production so far. Green at least has shown something on one side.
Based on the last several comments the season needs to start today. It has all been said in a thousand different ways. A rehashed mundane conversation towards something that has happened with the variables having now changed.
Well, the equation here is this: boring offseason + young team with unproven players + Internet message forum = speculative crystal-balling takes. Production is the ultimate pudding-proof, yes, but in the absence of reliable data you make predictions. At the end, however, reality is always richer than what our models predict. We may argue here about Jalen vs Jabari vs Amen, but I wouldn't be surprised at all if our core ends up being Sengun/Eason/Whitmore... A lot of good points. However, Jalen is quite OK as an iso player: his footwork is very good, he can get separation, and the threat of a pull-up is there to mess with the defender’s head. If he gets doubled he makes the right decision. The handle is not tight, you’re right, I can’t stand his weaving expeditions into the defense. But is good enough for a quicker play off-the-bounce. He’s a good iso player, but not great. KPJ is in the same boat.
So if Jalen has a 16 year career we'll have 16 parts and 48 chapters all self-published to clutchfans.
