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Ukraine

Discussion in 'BBS Hangout: Debate & Discussion' started by NewRoxFan, Nov 25, 2018.

  1. astros123

    astros123 Member

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    Whats bullshit? Did you forget when a ukraine surface to air defense system accidently went off and hit polish land? Zelensky quickly ran on tv to declare NATO file article 5 and declare war with Russia. This was before any investigation was done. I love zelensky but hes not the american president. He has the interests of the UKR as he should. War isnt black and white. People do ****ed up things in the heat of the moment. Ukraine WANTS USA to join the war and you cant blame them. It would make their job much easier.

    Biden job is to make sure that doesnt happen. You can hate on him all you want but hes elected to be POTUS
     
    #12381 astros123, May 14, 2023
    Last edited: May 14, 2023
  2. Deckard

    Deckard Blade Runner
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    Show me where I "hated on him."
     
  3. rocketsjudoka

    rocketsjudoka Member

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    I wouldn’t trust Prigozhin either.
     
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  4. basso

    basso Member
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  5. basso

    basso Member
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  6. No Worries

    No Worries Member

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    An absolutely banger psyop ...

     
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  7. MadMax

    MadMax Member

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    WTaF is going on? The whole Russian military / Wagner dichotomy is crazy
     
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  8. DaDakota

    DaDakota Balance wins
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    Maybe this dude wants to take over for Putin.

    DD
     
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  9. Ubiquitin

    Ubiquitin Member
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    Game of thrones type story telling.
     
  10. larsv8

    larsv8 Member

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    Can someone summarize this, I can't follow the acronyms and broken english.
     
  11. Invisible Fan

    Invisible Fan Member

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    Something like: Putin has a cadre of "independent contractors" because a strong or unified military threatens his power. Wagner is among them. There's another group of crack ex-soldiers that competes with Wagner for the top spot. Wagner's approach is different and uses convicts with very short leashes to do cheap and dirty work with an eye for churn. Keeping these groups separate diffuses their potential power and Putin does everything to keep them competitive and distrustful of each other. This means you'll see gaffes where Russians will repeat the same mistakes over and over again (like sending tanks to the same kill zone or not communicating to a nearby group of an ambush).

    Apparently it's at a point where one group will sabotage others even if it means conferring with the enemy.

    All Putin wants is results, and if you don't have results then make your competitor fail.

    The article suspects Kremlin knows of Prigozhin's communications with Ukraine, which is cliffhanger to stay tuned for next episode of Moose and Squirrel.
     
  12. Ottomaton

    Ottomaton Member
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    The system is set up where commanders literally compete with each other for the spoils of war. Zero sum game. The better Wagner does the less Ukranian plunder Shoigu gets to take home, and vice-versa.
     
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  13. basso

    basso Member
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  14. rocketsjudoka

    rocketsjudoka Member

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    I respect your knowledge of military history. Do you know if there was anything like this in the Soviet military? From what I recall was that the Soviet military did have a parallel political officer corps to the actual military corps but so they also have rival militaries that operated independently of central military command structure?
     
  15. basso

    basso Member
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  16. basso

    basso Member
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  17. Ottomaton

    Ottomaton Member
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    I dont know much. I do know it was a feature carried over from the Tsarist Army and I know the Communists tried to supress it, but werent very successful.

    I believe what was an underground, frowned-upon practice has basically become wink-wink, nudge-nudge OK in post-Soviet Russia.
     
  18. Ottomaton

    Ottomaton Member
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    Buck Turgidson and Ubiquitin like this.
  19. tinman

    tinman 999999999
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    This Wagner group is not a bad idea .

    We should put our thugs to work too , they can fight the cartel or fight the other gangs in Los Angeles or Chicago

    we can call them Ja Wagner
    @AroundTheWorld @J.R.
     
  20. Ubiquitin

    Ubiquitin Member
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    [​IMG]
     
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