I'm just thinking folks are really downplaying a 1st year coaching ability to take his team to the final dance on his first try. More experienced means jack sht especially if they haven't done much since their glory days. I prefer nurse over Vogel bc his championship was a mickey mouse one, but I'm not that impressed with Nurse either who has done nothing since kawahi left and it wasn't like he had no players to work with. I personally dont think that ime is a fluke coach.
I enjoy reading the opinions of almost all of the members who have posted in this thread, including the OP, but traditionally we go with whoever posted about a topic first (based on the thread’s headline). Often @Clutch will merge a couple of threads if they’re close together based on the timeline, maybe lock one, or just let it “peter out.” So maybe we should move this convo to ATW’s thingy? Just a suggestion.
So I have two problems with the "so what if he cheated" narrative. I agree with people saying personal matters generally shouldn't matter, and somebody having an affair should not disqualify them from a job, however... He cheated with a subordinate who worked under him for the Celtics. This is a problem on two levels. One, it's creating potential problems in the workplace. People aren't bringing his personal affairs into his work, he did that. He wasn't just cheating with some random woman he met in a bar, he was cheating with somebody who worked under him. Two, there are questions about consent anytime a boss, or somebody higher in the organizational hierarchy, has an affair with a subordinate, or somebody lower in the organizational hierarchy (regardless of the genders involved). There's a power differential involved and the potential for the subordinate to face career consequences if they say no, assuming he was the one who made sexual advances, as she claims. After the fact, the woman involved claimed he made unwanted comments to her, i.e. sexual harassment, and some unconfirmed reports stated the relationship was not, in fact, consensual. I do not know if this is true, but it's definitely a warning flag, especially in light of their work relationship as I explained above. I won't outright say the Rockets shouldn't hire Udoka because of the whole scandal. I don't know all the details or what the whole story is. But I don't think it's wrong to say this is a bad look and definitely at least a yellow flag that the Rockets need to seriously investigate.
What worries me about Vogel, he is a good defensive coach with the right personnel, but bombed in Orlando when he didn't have a rim protector. He gimped Vucevic and tried to bench him for Bismarck Biyombo, who was horrible but fit the coach's archetype more (sound familiar?). After failing for two years and getting fired, Orlando immediately improved significant the year after by...playing through Vuc. Eventually they were able to build enough value and flipped Vuc for a great draft pick. Vogel seems to only coach one style and incapable of adjusting to his personnel.
I could really care less about two people having consensual sex. Affairs happen every day and though it shows poor personal judgement it doesn't necessarily translate to his decisions as a head coach. https://www.clnsmedia.com/josh-richardson-says-celtics-training-camp-reminds-him-of-heat/ "Celtics players described an intense environment filled with trash talk and accountability... ...Robert Williams III watched Smart and Grant Williams feud verbally following an accused flop by Williams a week later, a chippy moment common throughout this camp, Rob noted. Players at the bottom of the bench feel entitled to call out ones at the top of the rotation. The communication is clear, which Udoka made a top priority, along with accountability, which came into play when the team levied a suspension this week" This is the type of coach I want for the Rockets and I'm willing to give this guy the benefit of the doubt. Other's less deserving of that have been given a chance... hell if infidelity was such a big deal and a disqualifier as a character issue we wouldn't have had the joy that was our 45th President
This isn't trigonometry we don't need 8 chapters of the science of cheating. The man(and woman) made a mistake that's not illegal. Yall going Jeffrey Dalmer on him in here are the real psychos.
People are just paranoid about everything. Who cares about his consensual relationships that has violated the Celtics' stupid team rules? If he has sexually harassed a woman, that's no way the woman will keep quiet and the NBA doesn't do anything, just look at Robert Sarver. The only reservation I have about him is that this year Celtics won 57 games with higher offensive ratings and lower defensive ratings; the net ratings this year is similar to the last year. Credit is where credit is due. Ime posted better numbers than Brad. Is the Celtics that good? or Brad that bad? I don't know. The sample size is too small to make a solid conclusion. Based on what other players commented on Ime, he seems to be a good coach for the young players. In the NBA, talents and results are always over moral standards. Irving has been a headcase on and off the court for years, teams are still willing to trade for him over and over again. If moral standard is the utmost important, Stephen Silas will not have to serve for an assistant coach for more than a decade and he would be still our coach. Just look at how much the Knicks did behind the scene to acquire Brunson. I'm dumbfounded by people would think hiring Ime have a bad influence on those young players. Do people really think our young players are angels? Give me a break.
Yeah, I want nothing to do with corporate culture. The want, is to win basketball games. The Astros have never given a F*** about that and were highly successful. The Warriors and Draymond Green also the same. Last year's 49'ers played Omenihu on domestic violence charges the same week in the playoffs. Its about winning. Everyone can go F off with the clean nose stuff. A dude was horny and did inappropriate things... ok, but can he coach a basketball team effectively?
First, he didn't just **** a colleagues wife - he ****** his bosses wife, AFTER he had been told by the Celtics management to stop sleeping with other women associated with the organization. Why is he so highly rated? well a lot of it is pedigree. He played in the USA and at a high level overseas where he saw how they play the game in Europe. He was a favorite player of Popovich and was an assistant for the Spurs for 7 years and widely viewed as very bright, charismatic and was the go between Popovich and the players. He was considered the top reason LaMarcus Aldridge choose the Spurs over the Suns. He then was a top assistant at a couple spots. He took over a Celtics team that some felt were close to being broken up and had clearly given up on their prior coach.... they were under .500% at the break and appeared to be falling apart... he met with the team, told them they were going to do things his way and they finished the second half on like a 33-9 run, blew through the playoffs and lost in the Finals. So is there a risk because his head coaching experience in 1 season? Yeah there is, but all of his players thought he was great. As far as his problems and poor personal life choices... I don't like them - but he has paid a huge cost - and I am personally willing to give him a second chance when the alternatives are Frank Vogel. Also - personality wise he isn't like Silas.... he is charismatic, he is no nonsense and he is demanding and holds his players accountable (just not himself apparently).
This is such a no brainer lol. He checks every box. Let's forgive this man and gain back some respectability. Jalen and Jabari want and need this type accountability from the HC. If KPJ is going to be Rocket, he will maximize his talent and make him a better player and potentially a real on court leader. We have had 3 years of watching a coach who has the complete opposite approach to basketball accountability. The team and the fans deserve better. Hire Ime and don't mess this up Tillman.
Does Udoka deserve a second--er, third--chance to be a head coach? Probably. Is he, after just one season as a head coach and some personal failings, the right fit for today's Houston Rockets? I don't think so. Putting aside the personal stuff, I agree with the others that one season with a good team at 51-31 does not necessarily make a good head coach. Factoring in the personal stuff, Udoka could do well and he could crash spectacularly. If it's the latter, it will be hard for the org to recover after the previous 3 years of ineptitude. I'd like more of a track record and ideally, one with an emphasis on innovation. The other major candidates have a higher floor and this organization needs stability.
Here is a better picture of her. Udoka has long been talked about as a guy that sleeps with a lot of ladies and has never had a problem juggling multiple at the same time. If you believe some of the players that are his contemporaries, this isn't surprising and Nia Long (who wouldn't marry Udoka) knew he loved to play, but that he always came home to her.... her issue is with the Celtics going public and that Ime wasn't smart who he porked. People can say what they want, but the fact is that the issue was primarily WHO he slept with... and how it was found out. It shows REALLY bad decision making by a man in a job that doesn't lend it's self to poor decision making...... However, he did lose his long term fiancee, he did lose his job, he did have to deal with all of the public scorn and everyone will always relate him to what he did, he cannot hide from it. So, he has paid a price, and it isn't like Phil Jackson and Red Auerbach and others were all perfect.
Lol I've seen everyone on this roster do it including Green multiple times. It's a lack of accountability issue.
It’s happening right now. I can feel it. They just asked him if he’d commit to not banging anyone in the Rockets organization. He said yes. Let’s get this signed on the dotted line.
