If people want to waive around, "The U.S. government promised ____ and _____" - I think it is appropriate to closely examine those claims instead of letting vague generalities rule the argument.
Yes, racism and racial injustice have existed in the United States, just like they have in every place and society in human history. I think if you want to posit that racial injustice for african americans deserves financial compensation, we need to look at every form of injustice and enquire if that injustice means those effected group deserve financial compensation. I would say that many groups have faced many kinds of injustices throughout human history and that if the African-Americans deserve financial compensation for the injustices they faced, then so do any number of classes or groups of persons.
It isn't a vague generality. It certainly wasn't to those that believed the promise. There was a special order given like countless other special orders given that were carried out by the government. But this special order was rescinded when it was no longer convenient from the government. If you don't believe Sherman had authority to issue the order, then the problem would have been with Sherman, not the people who want what they were promised.
It is a "vague generality" the way you assert it. "The Federal government promised every former slave 40 acres and a mule" - Let's examine that claim. 1. It was a special order put out by a General in the U.S. Army. Is that a "promise" by the Federal government? What if it was a Colonel who put out that order? What about a lieutenant? If my mail man "promises" me something does that constitute a "promise" by the federal government? 2. It contemplated 40 acres for 18,000 families - not every freed person. 3. It didn't promise a "mule" Pretty quickly, things are looking fairly different.
I will agree that it was those freed people. I already mentioned the mule issue long ago. Yes. It is a promise by the Federal government. The army, especially during a time of war in the field of war is representative of the government. I have no idea if it was a LT. Or Colonel that issued the order. It was the commanding general who issued the order.
Racism will never end cause humans are tribal It can be decreased through technology and human space exploration and colonization @rocketsjudoka
This is pretty much the slipperiest a slope could possibly get. I need to read up on it, but do taxpayers pay for this? Why not address the ways that corporate America is bleeding these communities dry RIGHT NOW? How about tackling the desperately needed police/criminal justice/prison/education reform RIGHT NOW?
Reparations is a stupid idea this many generations from slavery. Are we going to give all the land back to the natives?
I’m coming late to this thread and apologize as haven’t read through it but saw the story in the news about it. I’m personally ambivalent about reparations. While yes we need to acknowledge that slavery happened and legal discrimination happened reparations is a difficult subject. For one given that many descendants of slaves are mixed race are we going to genetically test people and / or require them to provide how much documentation to show how much they are descended from slaves? Will they then get reparations in proportion to that? Also considering California was a “free” state why is SF paying reparations instead of Atlanta, Richmond or other cities that not only were in slave states but also had legal segregation? While California wasn’t a slave state it did have legal segregation against Chinese and other Asians. Chinatown in SF didn’t just exist because Chinese liked hanging out but because they legally weren’t allowed to live anywhere else in the city. Also out in SF Bay is Angel Island where Chinese who tried to enter the US during the Exclusion Acts were held sometimes for decades. Given the legacy of legal discrimination then shouldn’t Chinese Americans get reparations from SF? Next presumably these reparations will be paid by taxpayers and SF has a large immigrant community whose families weren’t even here when slavery or legal segregation existed. They are then being asked to pay for something their ancestors weren’t even part of. Also the descendants of slaves are also current taxpayers so that would mean they are also paying even though their ancestors were the ones enslaved. While we need to acknowledge the history I think at this point SF and the country would be better off addressing things like long-standing poverty, income inequality, homelessness than reparations. I think those would do more for society while reparations risk dividing society more.
Yes those tax payers are on the hook for 600k per non black family https://thepostmillennial.com/san-f...ng-every-black-adult-5-million-in-reparations According to the Associated Press, an estimate from Stanford University’s Hoover Institute revealed that the draft reparations plan could cost non-black families in the city at least $600,000 each.
This particular bill in a city that wasn't a slave state is just virtue signaling. I think investing in lower income communities, even the poor white ones, is the way to make amends. Unfortunately, conservatives usually have an excuse not to.
@rocketsjudoka Isn’t this the wrong minority group that was ‘wronged’ in the city of San Francisco? California was never a slave state Apparently they don’t teach the civil war in California @Salvy
It is true. The difference between the United States and those European participants in the transatlantic slave trade is that in the United States emancipated slaves were emancipated into American society while Caribbean European slaves were, relatively, comfortably emancipated half a world away. European powers have done hardly a damn thing for former slaves or the descendants of former slaves. I’m sure they’d tell you that themselves.
The Euros did it from the 1500s to the 1880s (when Brazil finally outlawed it) So, yeah, they didn't just "pull up and then sail away"
The big issue here though isn't income. The income gap between Black and white families isn't massively different like the wealth difference. The issue is that the Black race was denied property ownership during one of the most affordable eras. That era literally created the suburban white middle class. Black people want that economic redistribution of wealth also that white families experienced right after WW2. You will have social divide also until this is addressed.
Yes all of that is true and shouldn’t be denied. As noted though there was a lot of other bad things that happened legally in history and my this country. Also as noted there are a lot of people who came to this country after slavery and after segregation. So then should those peoples’ wealth also be redistributed for something that their ancestors had nothing to do with? Yes black Americans were wronged. I think reparations though are the most problematic way of addressing that.
The "other people have been victims" line was something I thought I would only hear from a right winger. Anyways I've already addressed this specific point with the right wing posters in this thread if you want to read them.
