What will it take to make you seriously consider an EV?

Are Electric Vehicles About To Sweep The Country?

https://www.manhattancontrarian.com/blog/2023-2-23-are-electric-vehicles-about-to-sweep-the-country

excerpt:

It seems like all the smart people have made up their minds that the future of automobiles belongs to electric vehicles. In August 2022, California, by regulation, adopted a ban on gasoline-powered cars by 2035; and in September 2022, New York promptly followed with its own ban, also by regulation, and also set for 2035. And at the federal level, in 2021 the Biden Administration ordered that all agencies move toward 100% procurement of electric vehicles, also by 2035. Meanwhile, by means of a thicket of regulations — from vehicle mileage standards to pollution caps and more — the administration overtly seeks to force manufacturers to convert their lineups to EVs as fast as possible.

So, are electric vehicles about to sweep the country and become the dominant form of transportation? I bet against it. This is just a specific instance of the general principle that it is always wise to bet against central planning of the economy. EVs may be a successful niche product for a small number of wealthy consumers, but the idea that they will fully replace gasoline powered cars in short order is the dream of central planners, who think they can implement their dream by coercion. Central planning never works, and won’t work this time either. The reason is that the would-be central planners don't know enough, and can’t ever know enough, to put together all the elements to make a fully functioning economic sector.
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more at the link

 

VW is making progress in Europe with the ID series. BYD is dare I say more competitive in China than Tesla. Hyundai is at least making an effort with the ioniq series compared to other big Asian oems still foolishly trying to go hydrogen.

 

I agree with the sentiment that free markets will beat central planning. That’s why there has been hardly any other EVs sold at scale besides Tesla, because most EVs are built to satisfy central planning, milk tax credits or avoid emissions fines, these fail in the market place. That’s why the belief that there has been an EV revolution is fantasy, there has only been a Tesla revolution, and despite the narrative Tesla has been made a success by the free market, not central planning. Tesla’s best selling vehicles, the model 3 and y, did not qualify for tax credits because Tesla already ran through the limit by the time they were launched, they were sold at full price and achieved success on the market by their own merit. This competitive pressure is what has pushed others like VW to go all in on EV and offer real attempts at making an EV instead of compliance cars. Central planning today will only accelerate the free market direction that Tesla established. Closing in on 30% of the new car market share in Europe and China, EV is already reaching the tipping point of no return, so the author here is wrong.

 

The new Kia EV9 is rumored to be something like 56k-75k with a max of 290 miles and the top end at 240 miles.


If true, that's too expensive for not enough. More range needed, and they better bring it for the interior. Cool looking car, but I expected those numbers to be 10-15k less.


While I realize that pricing is "competitive" (especially compared to the EV6 and Ioniq5) this thread is about what it will take for people to convert to electric. The masses aren't converting until prices get cheaper. Unless they do, gas cars will be around for 20-30 years easy. Especially with interest rates and inflation.


I'm of the opinion that electric vehicles are the car manufacturers trying to reset their market and cash flow. I think it's going to be a big failure with the current pricing.

I think corporate greed and capitalism, which this is an example of, is a large part of what's ruining this country. Look at the F150 lightning As a prime example.

As much as I dislike Elon Musk, we need someone coming in that's really willing to disrupt the market, from a pricing perspective, in order to continue adaption progress. I don't think it's Elon. Maybe it's Fisker. Maybe it's Canoo. Right now, I don't see it being anyone.

And I don't want to see that Tesla sales are up. They are, but without variety, things are going to grow stagnant. I'm encouraged by the variety I see starting to come out, but I don't see them on the streets (besides Tesla). Why? Prices.

 

$56-75k for a Kia lol?

No, the high prices for EVs is not due to capitalist greed and desire for cash flow, every single oem loses money on their EVs besides Tesla. That’s because this is still a new tech (battery and drivetrain) that’s still riding the cost curve down, think flat screen TVs over the years. Tesla is the only EV manufacturer at scale, and the only one vertically integrated, so that’s why today they can sell their cars at a significant profit, and on March 1 they can announce their next platform, the $25-30k Model 2 which should answer your concerns over price.

No one is paying 50-100% premium to buy an EV Kia when they can get a gas Kia for half off. That’s why you only see Teslas around, they are the only EVs worth their price.

 

EVs just don't seem viable in the near future to over take gas poweredvehicles, too many things stacked against them. I guess time will tell.

 

Like what?

 

Anyone else doing the 30% solar tax benefit thing? Thank you, inflation "reduction" act (lololol). With the tax benefit, I'm looking at low $20k range (battery included) to try to get as close to 0 as possible on my monthly power bill. Anyone do it yet? What company did y'all go with? How is it working out? Still thinking about pulling the trigger on an EV, but this seems like the better long-term purchase. The 30% tax incentive moves up the date that a solar system pays for itself by several years.

 

I was in Europe recently (not Kiev) and had a business partner driving us around. It was a pain to find charging stations... and when we did find one, often they were either in use, or blocked by gasoline fueled cars. I think the US has superior EV charging installations, but only in metro areas. After that experience, I'm at least 3 years out from considering an EV.

 

We just charge in our garage overnight.

 

It was a situation where he had driven about 4 hours from his home and ran the battery down by the time I was picked up. This guy was in full panic mode when we got down to 15% charged and we were in a rural area. He almost got fired that day!

 

The ability to be something other than a commuter vehicle

 

Let me guess, wasn’t a Tesla.

 

Commuter is a vast majority of vehicles on the road on the road.

Petrol fueled vehicles will be around for decades. Just look at the idiots who buy diesel commuters for the 'power' advantage. These same idiots buy trucks and run the beds/trailer capacity empty 80% of the time.

There are plenty of solutions for me if I need a truck to transport my cargo ... which is maybe 2x a year. I dont need to continuously fill a vehicle that gets me ~18 mpg to carry my 5lbs of groceries.

 

Subway plans to start building charging "oases" this year. It will include "multiple spots, picnic tables, Wi-Fi, restrooms, green space, and playgrounds." The charging spaces will also be covered. Other stores will get "small-format, fast EV charging stations."

https://electrek.co/2023/02/21/subw...asis-so-you-can-recharge-while-you-eat-fresh/

 

Starbucks and Volvo also entering a partnership to put chargers at Starbucks locations in parts of the Western US.

 

I asked this exact question today, and then got laughed in my face by about 20 people.

 

Charge your car while you wait an hour in the drive through line. Brilliant

 

Good on you.