Oh I agree. This will keep occurring unless there is fundamental change. I was just talking about how Memphis handled this after Tyre was killed. PDs need to prevent this from happening so cities don't have to "handle" this
Yes this absolutely is a problem with many PDs and the training and hiring needs to change. That’s not going to happen quickly and given the strength of Police Unions that sort of change will be slow. In the meantime swift transparency and accountability is needed and Memphis leadership did that.
Meet the Press just showed some clips the beating again and it doesn’t get easier seeing it multiple times. I still believe that the swift action by Memphis authorities to prosecute these LEO is what has kept the situation in the country from blowing up like following George Floyd. As said LE reform is going to be slow and we’re going to get another situation like this again. The public needs to know that there will be accountability in these situations.
That is very interesting and read some of the piece you posted. From what I can see it does show the experiment was conducted poorly but I don’t think it overthrows completely the findings of the experiment. That the “guards” were still Willing to hold the “prisoners” even after they demanded to be freed shows that ordinary people are willing to do unpleasant things to others in the name of authority. Even if the prisoners were exaggerating their discomfort the guards didn’t know that yet were still willing to hold them.
This is what I mean, you’ve gone off the deep end and everything is a dichotomy. I don’t bother addressing your points similar to how a couple of weeks ago, despite an education you can’t discern that an article regarding “biden forgetting spooky sauce on his ghost burger” was largely satire. Your analytical thinking is at best superficial, with the remainder resulting from emotional responses. “BuT tHe YoUtUbEZ”. It’s poster-boying for Dunning-kruger at this point. what ever helps you sleep at night; I hope you can put your feelings aside and go back to being a man. But if you really want to justify calling someone on this forum a pedophile without anything to back it up I don’t think there’s much to save or time for me that waste on this any further . God bless.
Seems like a lot of premises but with no meat on why those premises are real or not. I attempt to explain my positions. You just make matter of fact statements. Anyways I don't feel bad for calling someone a pedophile to teach him about unfounded assumptions of posters they never met when they have literally told eveey female poster here that they are losers for not having babies or that I'm a loser for not having a family. How does he know this ? I don't know. Why does he care about women posters not having babies? I don't know. But you ain't going to gilt trip me in throwing out accusation s of pedophilia to a poster like that. Seems like you are the only one who doesn't read the room
This is an outrageous lack of skills requirements for such an important job. Even those who are usually deferential to police officers should recognize that we have to expect more out of public servants. Lowering the hiring bar to such a degree does a disservice to the community and wearing a badge doesn't automatically make someone above reproach. I wonder if Memphis did this for lack of quality candidates? It's not exactly a thriving town.
More black cops should do the crimes therefore more conservatives will buy into the notion that law enforcement recruitment has low standards. If we just show a bunch of mugshots of black officers they'll start agreeing.
Goodness, you are a very pessimistic person. The bar has always been low. Not many argue that but you think conservatives have to have polar opposite views than what you have.
Ya being born and raised in Gulf Coast Texas and then spending 5 years in right wing circles like Marine Infantry makes me have a solid understanding of the conservative base and their mindset. And no, conservatives as a whole have thought our law enforcement is the best there is in terms of professionalism. I'm not referring to the ultra right wing rural folks who want no law enforcement at all for all the wrong reasons, but the average suburban white conservative family has this view about law enforcement. They are heroes, nearly above reproach. Show them a continuous stream of Black officer mugshots they will be more receptive to articles and news stories about low standards without knee jerk reactions like "how dare you disrespect people who protect you!?".
Exactly. If these murderers were white, we would not see such a quick decision to pursue justice. This just gives ****heads a chance to make the “case” that it’s not a culture of abuse against POC.
Yup. It really seems from the police union. Most police unions are pretty overtly right wing fascist organizations. The fact they won't go up in arms about a group of black officers being immediately charged this quickly makes perfect sense to me knowing the make up of most police unions.
if they were white, they’d be given paid time off while they do an “investigation”…then we’d get some flimsy article about his death filled with lies from the cops and then that would be that…Tyre would be just another statistic if we did get footage of the beating, it would be in 2025 heavily edited
And the fault here lies with the police unions. It isn't that the higher ups are racist. It's that they know there is going to be aggressive push back if they did the same actions towards a group of white cops. They don't want to deal with that noise by unions.
I encourage you to read the whole thing. The guards didn't choose what to do, they were instructed what to do (and everyone knew no one was actually suffering any abuse). Even then, they were not behaving how the people running the experiment wanted them to, so they had to be corrected to be tougher on the "prisoners". The "worst" of the guards was hamming it up to try to get benefits from the Professor, putting on a fake southern accent that he copied from Cool Hand Luke. He said he thought of it as an improv exercise (he was a theater kid). There was a former San Quentin inmate that told them all of the things the guards are supposed to do. When people have tried to replicate it, the guards end up being nice to the prisoners and negotiating extra benefits for them. The "prisoners" were encouraged before and AFTER the experiment to play along. The most famous example from the experiment kept being offered referrals by Zimbardo to do media interviews. Ultimately, they were trying to prove that giving people authority leads to abuse. Instead, they proved that giving people authority and actually instructing them repeatedly to abuse people resulted in less abuse than they expected and were hoping for. Whatever validity the experiment had (and it isn't much), the purported findings are not what actually happened.
I agree. However, I don't think it is fixable because who the hell wants to be a cop in a major metropolitan area right now? If you are having to lower standards just to fill the openings then training isn't going to matter when you are starting with garbage people.
The standards that are "lowered" aren't even the standards people are looking for in reforming law enforcement culture. If you come in knowing that law enforcement career as a privilege rather than a right then you won't find my suggest that's coming up offensive to "human rights and free speech". Every marginalized community should have a group of trusted people maybe elders who have the final say in hiring with access to recruits' social media profiles seeing if there is troubling content such as making fun of black culture, or repasting "all lives matter" or having aggressive support for Trump and believing the election was stolen. You know the type of people who frown upon poor communities and think they'll crack skills to solve crime. There are signs especially in social media post history that indicates of a potential recruit is hard type of potential officer. In You can believe this is a violation of privacy but you don't have to join law enforcement. You aren't given a right to be a cop.
It’s interesting and will take a look at the rest of the piece. That said the basic premise still seems they’re given that they didn’t release the prisoner even though they were supposed to. That they weren’t as cruel as has been portrayed does appear to be an exaggeration and a big problem with how the experiment has been considered. Also even if the Stanford experiment is flawed there are many examples of otherwise ordinary even good people committing horrible acts when presented with authority. Obviously the Holocaust, the Killing fields, the Cultural Revolution and many other examples. I read the whole piece and agree that it does appear there were many flaws in the experiment and its position as being so definitive should be questioned. That piece though still doesn’t overthrow the primary premise that people can act bad to other people when in the name of authority. That Zimbardo told the guards to be crueler and they did shows that. Perhaps they weren’t inherently cruel but they were willing to go along with the voice of authority. In the piece it stated that some felt remorse over what they did. Also while Korpi did say he faked his “breakdown” he did feel mistreated that he wasn’t released when he asked and that he had grounds to sue Zimbardo. The piece also notes there are other experiments that support the main premise so while the Stanford experiment might be flawed to the point of being unscientific other experiments can still support the idea.
That the LEO were black might’ve played a role in the quick action but I’m not so sure. In the George Floyd case the LEO were fired quickly and Chauvin was arrested faster than I’ve seen in other cases including the Justine Damon’s case where a black LEO shot a white woman. It also took weeks after Chauvin was arrested for the other three LEO to be arrested and two of them were POC.
