Going from 22-60 to maybe 29-53 by adding Collins and $26mil per for 3 more years and losing assets to get him
Who cares? The Rockets have cap space and the cap is going up anyway. If Jabari Smith somehow gets better to the point where Collins is obsolete (by no means a certain to happen event) you.... move on from John Collins. I know it's crazy but successful teams have overpaid guys on their squad.
It's substantially better than showing no improvement and going 22-60 and losing your #5 draft pick because it's a better way to keep your assets. If your scenario transpires and the Rockets win 20 games again with this same miserable group of players plus Amen Thompson and some new coach - that seems by far the worst possible scenario, but one you appear to prefer over small yet tangible improvement with better players than we currently have
not really. a temporary band-aid where you still suck isn't really improvement. it just means you're panicking and trying to do something as desperation to add a few wins. that is what the Tilman motto is along with LTS. If he loses it, he loses it. It's his fault in the first place. doesn't mean your team is any better in the long run. I couldn't careless about some short sighted fix.
Counter point to this That leaves only 96 more minutes at the guards . We all know their plan is to play kpj and Jalen Green a combined 70 something of those minutes. That's only 1 maaaybe 2 more rotation spots.and green and kpj suck and don't fit what we would be trying to do building around our frontcourt . Also what if Victor can only play the 4 ? Anyways, you only have a 20 percent chance at Victor anyways . If Collins is actually good defensively then I'd pull the trigger . Collins , sengun , Smith is good and can get reps in this year to try to build chemistry . Tate and one more player can come in and balance things out . I wanna see Tate test his shot once he gets his legs back . Can green play good team D and hit open shots and fill out that unit ? Can KPJ play off ball and stay engaged ?
As of right now, Jalen and Jabari are busts. We are going to need those picks in case they don't turn it around...
I think getting Collins would be a stupid at the moment. This summer, though... maybe. That gives us another 1/3 season to watch KM's growth and doesn't endanger the final "official" season of tanking. After we see who we're bringing on in the draft, then maybe make a deal like this (replacing free agent EG with other players who don't fit our future plans) Even giving up the picks won't be too horrid, as long as they're lottery protected.
Would rather overpay for him than to overpay for Collins. 2 firsts is definitely an overpay unless if it's the Mil pick and we involve a third team (ex: Gordon, Suns) where they throw in their first. We can compensate them with our 2nd to offset it some. Crowder, Saric, Gordon, Caruso all works. Not sure if PHX would add in a pick for essentially a Gordon/Crowder swap and not sure if Bulls would be willing to buy out Crowder. I have bounced back and forth on the pros and cons with Collins. I wouldn't be mad, but I wouldn't be excited. Chances are we'd end up overpaying, which would be disappointing...
Yes really, showing no improvement, being the worst team in the league (for the fourth straight year) and losing your draft pick is literally the worst possible outcome in both short and long term. In the short term, another utterly bereft season, marking 316 consecutive games of being the worst and having no hope. In the long term, no reward for your bereft season of future improvement. Like, it objectively can't really get any worse. Also, it's misleading to call it "panicking". If you're still the worst team after 3 or 4 years with no hope - changing how you're doing things is not "panicking" and overreacting to short term signals - it's rationally changing something that is quite obviously, not working .
I guess issue that I have with the rebuild is that it's leading to zero progress. I think the approach is misguided based on Stone running some experiment on playing a bunch of young guys hoping that they figure it out. If what John Wall stated is true regarding lack of accountability and allowing the players to do as they wish, then we are likely to go nowhere. John does not move the needle a whole lot, but it does lead to actual team building, versus just continuing to draft players until something clicks. I don't want to continue drafting indefinitely hoping we eventually hit. Yes, there is plenty of luck involved landing a generational talent, it doesn't mean we shouldn't continue trying to build a team. We aren't asking them to acquire some hasbeen that may make us marginally better. John Collins is a young veteran player with good talent that could be a decent fit in this team. Granted we need better coaching and better management, but you and I just have two different approaches. I guess I don't want to be the new Kings.
and? This is what happens when you get rid of a great player. You suck for a long time and when you fully rebuild you're going to suck. Folks want this quick turnaround taking shortcuts and all but that's not how it works. Losing your draft pick is the cost of having a dumb owner who decided to risk it in the first place. It isn't misleading. Panicking is what it is. Instead of staying the course like a full rebuild is supposed to be you panic and make a move for a non star who isn't good enough to make a team better and you just suck a tad bit less, but still in the tier of suck.
Why? Decent shooting percentage on tiny volume, 3.5 years older than Collins, never even averaged more than single digits in his career. Nice defensive player but, honestly, at least Collins is somebody you can feature as a secondary threat on offense.
You don't want to be the new Kings but nobody here has literally any say in that. In reality it's probably closer to the truth whether anyone likes it or not. That's what happens when you have a shitty owner coupled with a shitty FO. Ultimately, Tilman being as dumb as he is will again panic just to not be the new Kings, and be that team that still sucks but just signs non stars looking to cash but aren't good enough to win at the elite level.
So basically, it would be a bad idea to try to get better with John Collins BECAUSE there is no time machine that can allow you to go back and force Les Alexander to not sell the Rockets in 2018. And, we can't get Collins because he won't make us better, he'll just make us better, which is not better enough so the Rockets should stay not better and .......build through the draft (with picks they won't have)
You can't say it's not working though because they are achieving their goal which is to try and land the #1 pick. They aren't trying to win games in the first place.
you definition of being better with context being maybe a 29 win team isn't actually relevant enough for me to say it's better. Maybe that's your standards, definitely not mine. You're not actually better paying 25+ mil for 3 more years and giving up assets for that player to still be a sorry team
