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Ukraine

Discussion in 'BBS Hangout: Debate & Discussion' started by NewRoxFan, Nov 25, 2018.

  1. Commodore

    Commodore Member

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    Zelensky trying to bait everyone into WW3

     
  2. Xerobull

    Xerobull ...and I'm all out of bubblegum
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    Churchill worked Roosevelt and the US the same way. Was it wrong to get involved in that particular war?
     
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  3. ElPigto

    ElPigto Member
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    I'm sure it depends who was in power to @Commodore.
     
  4. dobro1229

    dobro1229 Member

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    What’s more likely.

    -Commodore in 1940 is a FDR supporter who trusted his response to support Churchill.
    -Commodore in 1940 recites Lindberg “America First” speeches in support of staying out of the war and Hitler talking points

    ???
     
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  5. dobro1229

    dobro1229 Member

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    The question really is though -

    -On December 8th, 1941, does someone like Commodore still recite Lindberg with Hitler talking points? That's the big question about where we are in terms of the American right, and where they will ultimately stand if America is attacked in the near future from the people they side with now from a propaganda standpoint, but are at their core enemies of the free world.

    In this case instead of Japan we'd probably be looking at Russia's ally in Iran attacking the US in some way. Would someone like Commodore change their tune if we were attacked by Putin's ally Iran, and that change his tune about supporting Ukraine? Iran, North Korea, and Russia are now looking like allies much like a poor mans' Axis powers. There's a domino affect here with who attacks who, and where. It's not a world war yet, but it does have the fundamental allies of one. The big question mark being China either quashing it from the Axis side, or joining in with the Axis powers to give them legitimacy.

    The Biden trip to Indo, and his meeting with Xi this week might very well be one of the more important meetings in modern history if even the slightest moves were made to keep China out of this alliance, and keep them on the sideline to not bail out Russia from it's disastrous invasion.
     
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  6. Xerobull

    Xerobull ...and I'm all out of bubblegum
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    I'm not talking about being ignorant in that situation. I'm talking about hindsight being 20/20, learning from history.
     
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  7. dobro1229

    dobro1229 Member

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    Or more likely willful ignorance. At least until today when schools are now trying to ban books, and distort history, up to this point, basically every American has been taught at some level the history of the 1930's and 40's. With German's invasion of Poland, there is stark contrast that is being willfully ignored by the American right for personal political reasons. Mostly, I think, because they think Putin is helpful to them winning elections.

    But my question is mostly about how Americans on the right will react when they cannot hide from the fact that Russia, Iran, and North Korea actually... yeah... kind of hate ALL OF US, and would bomb even the most Republican leaning city in America if they could. Even if that happens (and God forbid it ever does come to that) would the MAGA right still recite Putin propaganda, or would we see the American backbone stand us all up straight again?

    Who knows.... BUT in terms of historical significance, we are certainly at a place where it's easy to see where they would be in terms of Lindberg vs FDR. They would almost ALL be Lindberg followers I'm almost certain.

    I haven't yet listened to Maddows new podcast series which I think is all about the 1939 to 41 phenomenon on the American right. I hear it's very enlightening, and shocking.
     
  8. Commodore

    Commodore Member

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    prior to Pearl Harbor? probably

    nukes change the calculation immensely though

    turning a localized war over land that has been fought over for centuries into a global conflict between nuclear powers is insanely stupid

    the great thing about Trump is he made every effort to deescalate tensions and avoid conflict, with measurable success
     
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  9. Xerobull

    Xerobull ...and I'm all out of bubblegum
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    [​IMG]
     
  10. rocketsjudoka

    rocketsjudoka Member

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    Wasn't the line yesterday that Zelensky wanted peace because FTX went under and Ukraine couldn't launder money through it?
     
  11. basso

    basso Member
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  12. Invisible Fan

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    As for Taiwan, there does seem to be a risk for an all out assault to stress the US. That would likely coincide with a definite breakdown in globalization (another "covid-like" seizing of the supply chain, global dollar crunch and liquidation, and/or random financial/humanitarian "black swans") that would make it worth more to attack than to rely on the current world order.

    But OTOH, our defense budget is "officially" reaching a Trillion (maybe 2 if you add up everything like DOE, Vet aid and benefits, USAID, etc), so it's not like we're deluded into the world loving Pax Americana.

    Appeasement is a strong accusation. Most of the NATO alliance would have gone along with doubling down Ukraine until the very last moment Putin did the unthinkable.

    Sure, one might think a gambler like Trump would be better. Donny might've even won the last bet, but the house always wins and a gambler will always doubles down till the end.

    So yeah, I'd still choose the coalition route 9 out of 10 times, but those are my odds.
     
    #10312 Invisible Fan, Nov 16, 2022
    Last edited: Nov 17, 2022
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  13. dmoneybangbang

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    Nook and rocketsjudoka like this.
  14. larsv8

    larsv8 Member

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    Hmmm, no, that’s not accurate.

    Gotta escape your bubble my guy, you end in really dumb places.
     
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  15. rocketsjudoka

    rocketsjudoka Member

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    Saying that the US will defend Taiwan if the PRC invades is pretty odd appeasement
     
  16. DaDakota

    DaDakota Balance wins
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    The equipment we are sending them primarily would be replaced and destroyed anyway, even though it shows a massive amount it really is already spent money.....and we would be destroying it anyway.
    This is great use of our weapons and tax dollars IMHO.

    DD
     
  17. Nook

    Nook Member

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    You attack a country unprovoked and you have to accept that other nations may finance or intercede. Not to mention that Russia attacked a nation bordering many of these nations.

    So no, I don’t really understand why Russia is so mad. Then again I didn’t really understand why Nazi Germany or Imperial Japan was either.

    I have ZERO empathy for Russia when it comes to the invasion of Ukraine.
     
  18. Nook

    Nook Member

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    Russians are like REALLY REALLY bad American or UK white trash… the kind you find in the foot hills of West Virginia “growin” meth and stealing anything of value.
     
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  19. Invisible Fan

    Invisible Fan Member

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    Maybe it's just me, but wearing a bathrobe for an interview on geopolitics is deeply distracting.

    "It's good to uhh, uhh see you"
     
  20. cdastros

    cdastros Member

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