Harden was an unquestionable talent and 6th man of the year type player already. Ariza put in work in the biggest games of a players career. Not quite in the same ballpark of a stretch.
Harden was always going to be worth the max extension off his rookie scale contract even if he didn’t reach the heights that he eventually did. Everyone including the Thunder knew that, they just had shortsighted tax concerns which lowered their offer. What wasn’t known was that he was going to greatly exceed the value of that contract and become a superstar franchise level guy.
we already knew Harden was very good, we just didn’t know he would be superstar good KPJr has not yet proven that he is even above average Ariza was a terrible decision…poison pills for the likes of Lin and Asik…chen also mentioned Kato…looks like the majority haven’t worked out
Morey already had a good idea of how good Harden was… Shocked. I actually can’t come up with any examples of a player of his caliber and age getting traded at the time he was traded – it really has never happened. So we were obviously very aggressive and we gave up a lot – Oklahoma City does a great job; we gave up some great players in Kevin (Martin) and Jeremy (Lamb) and some great draft picks – but a top player like James really never gets traded so we jumped at the chance. I actually didn’t think they’d trade him. I think he’s a great, great player. I think he’s already playing at an All-Star level and is going to be a perennial All-Star and those players are rarely traded so I thought, frankly, it was going to work out there. I’m very happy for the Houston Rockets that he’s here. that is why he offered him the rookie max extension with no hesitation…an All-Star level player, which is what he thought he already was, is worth that extension the surprise came when Harden ended becoming a superstar KPJr and his situation is in no way comparable
The point was we took a risk with little information - in hopes that they blew up in a bigger role. For even MORE context. James Harden's last full year in OKC https://www.google.com/search?q=James+Harden's+stats&rlz=1C1SQJL_enUS771US771&oq=James+Harden's+stats&aqs=chrome..69i57j0i13l9.2912j0j15&sourceid=chrome&ie=UTF-8 In 2011, Harden averaged 31.4mpg 16.8ppg, 49% FG, 39% 3pt, 3.7apg Kevin Porter last year at the age of 21/22 averaged 31.3mpg 15.6ppg 41.5% FG 37.5% 3pt 6.2 apg. I mean - that is some major context right there. Harden was a better scorer and more efficient, but KPJ the much better playmaker - those are comparible numbers....just saying... Without KPJ having a history of immaturity, I believe he would already have signed a 20m contract extension. DD
in no way was KPJr a much better playmaker than 2011-12 James Harden this is what happens when people just look at basic numbers… Limited info? Lol, a ton of people already though Harden was an All-Star level player before the trade, and Morey was one of them. He said so the day of the trade… KPJr fans really need to just stop with all these massive reaches to try and make a point
This is truly beyond lunacy man. Harden put up a 66% TS and played at a high end all star/all nba caliber player in his 3rd season. This would be like if houston traded for luka after his 3rd season, and extended him before he actually played for houston. There are literally hall of famers who never had as good a season as hardens 3rd season.
Harden was not close to being an all star - he was a very good 6th man off the bench for OKC. Let's not conflate what Harden did in Houston with what he was in OKC, he was an attacking scoring SG who could play make a little but had to be hid on defense because he was bad at it. Morey took a risk and it worked, he BLEW up, had much more in his bag than he had shown......the point was he was like 23 at that time, which is roughly the same age as KPJ. And KPJ has better playmaking stats......not the same TS% for sure, Harden was elite at drawing fouls and knocking down FTs.... Harden in 2012 is comparable to KPJ in 2022, they are not far off, especially when you consider KPJ is a much better defender at this age than Harden was. People seem to piss on KPJ when they should be thinking...hmmm, maybe we got something special here. DD
The myth of kpj being a good playmaker justified by comparing him to a shooting guard playing in a team whose pg already makes 8 assists a game. If kpj had ts% 10% less than harden’s, this thread would be full of posts about how efficient he is.
Can’t defend KPJ on that at all. I think some of their skills are comparable, but harden is just on another level. With that being said, if he can 75% of harden with better D, that’s an all star player. I truly believe he can be that.
He wasn't though when the Rockets picked him up in 2012......he was on a comparable level to KPJ....that is 100% the point. DD
Talent wise, yes! Harden was more efficient. I believe KPJ can do everything Harden could do when it comes to scoring, if you take away the FTs. The playmaking is where you lose me a lil. KPJ is miles ahead defensively imo though
I am not saying they are even, especially after Harden blew up and became a superstar, what I AM saying is that AT THAT POINT in both of their careers they are quite comparable. DD
Do you honestly believe for a second that KPJ was a better playmaker than OKC Harden or are you purely going by box score? If so, wow... just wow. Then again, you were full on the "AB over Lowry as PG" train. Also, Harden wasn't just more efficient, his scoring efficiency took LAPS around Harden. If KPJ was comparable to OKC Harden, he WOULD be signed already, issues and all.
I honestly think that KPJ and Harden on playmaking are VERY comparable - both have very good vision for what I would consider a SG - especially at that time of their careers.....22 years old, yes. Harden had quite a few Turnovers, their assist to turnovers is fairly close IIRC. And again, KPJ is better on defense. DD
i don't think KPJ's 98th percentile outcome puts him to be as good as 3rd season OKC harden. Saying he wasn't an allstar level player that season is utterly laughable and ridiculous. If you hate harden, that's fine, you do you, but just spouting garbage like this because you hate a guy is embarrassing.
