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Ukraine

Discussion in 'BBS Hangout: Debate & Discussion' started by NewRoxFan, Nov 25, 2018.

  1. Agent94

    Agent94 Member

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    After the war, give them an invitation to NATO with conditions for increased Democracy. Then if the **** hits the fan again all of Europe can roll in to defend them. No need to keep supplying them with advanced weapons for eternity.
     
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  2. jiggyfly

    jiggyfly Member

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    You been saying a lot of ignorant stuff since the war has begun.

    If this happens Russia would think they have cause for nuclear or biological weapons.

    What does going into Russia just a little accomplish?

    Have you not seen what Russians do when they feel besieged?
     
  3. DaDakota

    DaDakota Balance wins
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    I am not afraid of Russia - they have serious issues right now, and they are weak - Patton was right we should have gone in after WW2.....

    DD
     
  4. jiggyfly

    jiggyfly Member

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    You don't have to be afraid of Russia, you are not in Ukraine.


    You really are delusional.
     
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  5. basso

    basso Member
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    Patton did not want to invade Russia- he wanted to push the Russians out of Eastern Europe.
     
  6. Ubiquitin

    Ubiquitin Member
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    We kicked the Germans out of the rest of Europe too. It’s a surprisingly effective strategy.
     
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  7. No Worries

    No Worries Member

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    Russian considers their 2014 Ukraine territorial gains now part of the motherland, more or less, when it suits Putin's needs. Enough may have already been done by Ukraine, for Putin to justify WMD usage.

    Ukraine has also already had limited combat strikes in Russia proper. I suspect that Ukraine will consider Russian military assets pointed at them within Russia to be fair game.

    Putin may launch tactical nukes to save face/his ass ... in the name of de-nazi-fying Ukraine or some such.
     
  8. basso

    basso Member
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    you might want to look at the relative size of Soviet and Allied ground forces in Europe in May 1945.
     
  9. Ubiquitin

    Ubiquitin Member
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    4.5 million US/UK vs 6.5 million Soviet?
     
  10. Ubiquitin

    Ubiquitin Member
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    Also is this what getting older means? Staying up late and reading about war?
     
  11. Ottomaton

    Ottomaton Member
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    ...
     
    #8751 Ottomaton, Sep 13, 2022
    Last edited: Sep 13, 2022
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  12. basso

    basso Member
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    did the US have 4.5m in the European theater? honestly asking; my impression us that the soviets have many more men/arms available in Europe at the time; and a 2 million man advantage is not insignificant.

    the red army, and the US Navy were unstoppable machines by the end of WW2, but the latter would have had little impact in a land war in mitteleuropa, and Patton =/=Zhukov/Rokossovsky
     
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  13. DaDakota

    DaDakota Balance wins
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    You might want to see where the Soviets got their equipment and steel during WW2.

    The Russians hated Stalin many of them cheered the Germans on as they invaded until they found the Germans to be worse....and flipped back to their own country.

    I want Russia to break over this, completely.....we need a world without a powerful or semi-powerful Russia.

    DD
     
  14. No Worries

    No Worries Member

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    Well, the Allies broke Germany after WW1 and that did not end well.
     
  15. Ubiquitin

    Ubiquitin Member
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  16. rocketsjudoka

    rocketsjudoka Member

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    This is bad but fighting has been going on off and on between Azerbaijan and Armenia since the Soviet Union ended. It was pretty serious the past year. Russia has been tacitly backing Armenia while Turkey backing Azerbaijan.
     
  17. rocketsjudoka

    rocketsjudoka Member

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    It’s very uncertain whether Putin will use nukes over Ukraine but it is stated doctrine that Russia will use them if there is an existential threat to the country.
     
  18. Ubiquitin

    Ubiquitin Member
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    This is brazen. Russia is powerless. If some foreign adversarial troops shelled Americans we would not flee (although maybe we would we seem to ignore provocations from Iran all the time).
     
  19. rocketsjudoka

    rocketsjudoka Member

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    This isn’t the first time that Russian troops have been shelled or even killed in this region.
     
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  20. Ottomaton

    Ottomaton Member
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    [Reuters]Russian council faces dissolution after call for Putin's removal


    (Reuters) - A group of St Petersburg local politicians who called for President Vladimir Putin to be sacked over the war in Ukraine faces the likely dissolution of their district council following a judge's ruling on Tuesday, one of the deputies said.

    Nikita Yuferev said the judge decided that a series of past council meetings had been invalid, paving the way for it to be broken up by the regional governor.

    Another council member, Dmitry Palyuga, said the same court then fined him 47,000 roubles ($780) for "discrediting" the authorities by calling for Putin's removal. Court officials could not be reached by telephone for comment.

    Four more members of the Smolninskoye local council are due to appear in court in the next two days.

    Last week, a group of deputies from the council appealed to the State Duma to bring charges of state treason against Putin and strip him of power, citing a series of reasons including Russia's military losses in Ukraine and the damage to its economy from Western sanctions.

    Another local deputy said 65 municipal representatives from St Petersburg, Moscow and several other regions had signed a petition she published on Monday calling for Putin's resignation.

    While posing no current threat to Putin's grip on power, the moves mark rare expressions of dissent by elected representatives at a time when Russians risk heavy prison sentences for "discrediting" the armed forces or spreading "deliberately false information" about them.

    Palyuga told Reuters before Tuesday's hearing that the group's appeals were aimed not only at liberal Russians but also at "people loyal to the authorities who are starting to have doubts when they see the lack of success of the Russian army".


    He said he expected the numbers of such people to increase after last week's lightning counter-offensive in which Ukraine drove Russian forces out of dozens of towns and recaptured a large swathe of territory in its northeast Kharkiv region.

    "Of course, what is happening now has successfully coincided with our agenda. Many people who liked Putin are starting to feel betrayed. I think the more successfully the Ukrainian army operates, the more such people will become," he said.

    'VERY, VERY THIN' LINE

    Russian political analyst Tatiana Stanovaya said the greater risk to the Kremlin lay not in the councillors' protest itself but in the danger of responding too harshly to it.

    "The reaction, or overreaction, may cause more political damage to the regime than this petition. But I have no doubts that all those who signed the petition will (come) under political pressure," said Stanovaya, founder of the independent analysis project R.Politik.

    Thousands of legal cases have been launched against people accused of discrediting the army, usually leading to fines for first-time offences, but a Moscow district councillor was jailed for seven years in July after being convicted of spreading false information. Several other journalists and opposition figures have been charged and face potential prison terms.

    Kremlin spokesman Dmitry Peskov said on Tuesday that critical points of view were tolerated, within the limits of the law. "As long as they remain within the law, this is pluralism, but the line is very, very thin, one must be very careful here," he said.

    Ksenia Thorstrom, a St Petersburg local councillor who published Monday's petition calling for Putin's resignation, said it was too early to say how the campaign would turn out.

    "To call for a politician to resign is absolutely normal. There can be nothing criminal about it," she told Reuters.

    "Of course there is a certain risk, but to show solidarity with our colleagues - independent politicians who still remain in Russia - is much more important."
     

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