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Breaking: FBI raiding Mar-a-Lago

Discussion in 'BBS Hangout: Debate & Discussion' started by larsv8, Aug 8, 2022.

  1. MojoMan

    MojoMan Member

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    FBI Raid of Trump's Home a Double Standard of Justice

    by Alan M. Dershowitz

    The decision by the Justice Department to conduct a full-scale morning raid on former President Trump’s Mar-a-Lago home does not seem justified, based on what we know as of now. If it is true that the basis of the raid was the former president’s alleged removal of classified material from the White House, that would constitute a double standard of justice.

    There were no raids, for example, on the homes of Hillary Clinton or former Clinton administration national security adviser Sandy Berger for comparable allegations of mishandling official records in the recent past. Previous violations of the Presidential Records Act typically have been punished by administrative fines, not criminal prosecution. Perhaps there are legitimate reasons for applying a different standard to Trump’s conduct, but those are not readily obvious at this stage.

    The more appropriate action would have been for a grand jury to issue a subpoena for any boxes of material that were seized and for Trump’s private safe that was opened. That would have given Trump’s lawyers the opportunity to challenge the subpoena on various grounds — that some of the material was not classified; that previous classified material was declassified by Trump; that other documents may be covered by various privileges, such as executive or lawyer-client.

    Instead, the FBI apparently seized everything in view and will sort the documents and other material without a court deciding which ones are appropriately subject to Justice Department seizure.

    Searches and seizures should only be used when subpoenas are inappropriate because of the risk of evidence destruction. It is important to note that Trump himself was 1,000 miles away when the FBI’s search and seizure occurred. It would have been impossible, therefore, for him to destroy subpoenaed evidence, especially if the subpoena demanded immediate production. If he or anyone else destroyed evidence that was subject to a subpoena, that would be a far more serious crime than what the search warrant seems to have alleged. It is unlikely that there is a basis for believing that the search warrant was sought because of a legitimate fear that subpoenaed evidence would be destroyed.

    Defenders of the raid argue that the search warrant was issued by a judge. Yet every criminal defense lawyer knows that search warrants are issued routinely and less critically than candy is distributed on Halloween; judges rarely exercise real discretion or real supervision. It may be different when a president’s home is the object of the search, but only time will tell whether that was the case here.

    Neutral, objective justice must not only be done: it must be seen to be done.

    For zealous Trump haters, anything done to Trump is justified. For zealous Trump lovers, nothing done to him is ever justified. For the majority of moderate, thoughtful Americans, however, the Justice Department’s raid likely seems — at least at this point in time — to be unjust or needlessly confrontational.

    Thus, it is now up to the Justice Department and the FBI to justify their actions to the American public. They must explain why a different standard appears to have been applied to Democrats such as Clinton and Berger than to Republicans such as Trump and many of his associates.

    Critics of this demand for a single standard of justice insultingly call it “whataboutism.” A more appropriate term would be “the shoe on the other foot test.” No government act should ever be accepted unless it would be equally applied if the shoe were on the other foot — in other words, if it were applied equally to political friends and foes. This is the essence of our constitutional requirement of the equal protection of the law.

    For now, let’s not rush to judgment. Let’s give the attorney general, Merrick Garland, and the director of the FBI, Christopher Wray, the opportunity to explain their actions. If they decline to do so, on the basis of confidentiality, a special master should be appointed by the relevant court to assess the evidence seized from Trump’s home on a confidential basis. In the alternative, a true congressional committee comprised of both Democrats and Republicans should be appointed to investigate this raid.

    Older Americans need action on mental health and behavioral health crises Florida’s war on public education looks a lot like Russia’s
    It is true that a president or former president is not above the law — but neither should he or she be below the law. Precedents established in relation to Democrats must be equally applied to Republicans. On the face of it, this standard has not been met here.

    The burden of proof is now on the Justice Department and the FBI to justify what appears to be unequal justice.

    Alan Dershowitz, professor emeritus for Harvard Law School
     
  2. bobrek

    bobrek Politics belong in the D & D

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    The irony of a lawyer representing a wealthy man like OJ, writing about double standards.
     
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  3. marky :)

    marky :) Member

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    Hilary clinton really living rent free in your heads.
     
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  4. rimrocker

    rimrocker Member

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    This passage in a CNN story relates to early June of this year. It seems... odd.

    However, if this is true it does appear there were documents with classified markings on site, even after the return of 15 boxes months earlier.

    The Bobb mentioned is attorney Christina Bobb who still believes the 2020 election can be decertified and Trump installed immediately. She's a nut case.
     
  5. rimrocker

    rimrocker Member

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    Jon Tester?
    [​IMG]
     
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  6. dobro1229

    dobro1229 Member

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    What Yang is saying here pretty clearly is that the DOJ and FBI SHOULD HAVE made a political decision, and not a decision to follow the law and the facts.

    Because Trump voters will believe lies that it's a deep state conspiracy, laws shouldn't actually be followed.

    ....

    Yang knows better but he jumped on what he thought could get him press coverage on the right, and get him attention. He is smart enough to know that if he wants to be a viable third party, he has to do what Tulsi Gabbard and Joe Rogan have done, but at the same time not go as far as they did and walk that fine line in order to still pull some independent and liberal voters, and not just be another Republican.

    The fact is Yang has no idea what he's in for. This isn't some sort of business venture you can float around and play nice with both sides on like a restaurant in Texas that wants to both have Texas style BBQ and infuse them with traditional Vietnamese dishes.
     
  7. DonnyMost

    DonnyMost Member
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    Yeah. I love Andrew. But his Twitter is somewhere between pointless and terrible. He, like most people, need to shut up and wait for the story to be told about what happened and why.
     
  8. Blatz

    Blatz Member

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    Agree and I don't think anyone is surprised by trump and the likes playing victim every time they get questioned or busted.
     
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  9. FranchiseBlade

    Supporting Member

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    You are, of course, talking about Super-Attorney Steven Castor. Lawyer-Supreme.

    [​IMG]
     
    #289 FranchiseBlade, Aug 9, 2022
    Last edited: Aug 9, 2022
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  10. nacho bidness

    nacho bidness Member

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    Is that meatloaf?
     
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  11. Rashmon

    Rashmon Member

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    But weren't you swayed by mojomein's use of increased font size for more impact?
     
  12. bobrek

    bobrek Politics belong in the D & D

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    I wouldn't give him that much credit. Pretty sure the cut and paste automatically did that for him.
     
  13. Xerobull

    Xerobull ...and I'm all out of bubblegum
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    [​IMG]
     
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  14. Xerobull

    Xerobull ...and I'm all out of bubblegum
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    [​IMG]
     
  15. Rocket River

    Rocket River Member

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    I suspect he will Flee to Russia

    Rocket River
     
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  16. Salvy

    Salvy Member

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    Yes he is so screwed! Wont run for president 2024!!!
     
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  17. Salvy

    Salvy Member

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    He said call an ambulance thou, not amber lamps...
     
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  18. basso

    basso Member
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    Judge who OK’d Mar-a-Lago raid Obama donor once linked to Jeffrey Epstein

    The Florida federal magistrate judge who signed off on a search warrant authorizing the FBI raid of former President Donald Trump’s Mar-a-Lago resort donated to Barack Obama’s 2008 presidential campaign — months after he left the local US Attorney’s office to rep employees of convicted pedophile Jeffrey Epstein who had received immunity in the long-running sex-trafficking investigation of the financier...the Miami Herald reported that he had represented several of Epstein’s employees — including, by Reinhart’s own admission to the outlet, Epstein’s pilots; his scheduler, Sarah Kellen; and Nadia Marcinkova, who Epstein once reportedly described as his “Yugoslavian sex slave.”

    Kellen and Marcinkova were among Epstein’s lieutenants who were granted immunity as part of a controversial 2007 deal with federal prosecutors that allowed the pervert to plead guilty to state charges rather than federal crimes. Epstein wound up serving just 13 months in county jail and was granted work release...Reinhart was later named in a civil lawsuit by two of Epstein’s victims that accused him of violating Justice Department policies by switching sides in the middle of the Epstein investigation, suggesting he had spilled inside information about the probe to build favor with the notorious defendant, the Herald reported in 2018.
    https://nypost.com/2022/08/09/judge...on-mar-a-lago-once-linked-to-jeffrey-epstein/
     
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  19. Xerobull

    Xerobull ...and I'm all out of bubblegum
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    [​IMG]
     
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  20. DaDakota

    DaDakota Balance wins
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    Can he not do that from jail?

    DD
     

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