1. Welcome! Please take a few seconds to create your free account to post threads, make some friends, remove a few ads while surfing and much more. ClutchFans has been bringing fans together to talk Houston Sports since 1996. Join us!

Breaking: FBI raiding Mar-a-Lago

Discussion in 'BBS Hangout: Debate & Discussion' started by larsv8, Aug 8, 2022.

  1. DonnyMost

    DonnyMost Member
    Supporting Member

    Joined:
    May 18, 2003
    Messages:
    48,945
    Likes Received:
    19,851
    They're basic to the point of being nonsense.

    He's starting from the conclusion of "The FBI broke the law and/or acted under partisan directives".

    It's typical Republican reflexive conspiracy thinking with a healthy dose of posturing/grandstanding for votes.
     
    AleksandarN, jiggyfly, Nook and 3 others like this.
  2. Os Trigonum

    Os Trigonum Member
    Supporting Member

    Joined:
    May 2, 2014
    Messages:
    81,372
    Likes Received:
    121,708
    I disagree. and the fact that Althouse as a constitutional law specialist thought it worthy of repeating is an indication that there's some there, there.
     
    basso and Astrodome like this.
  3. FranchiseBlade

    Supporting Member

    Joined:
    Jan 14, 2002
    Messages:
    51,782
    Likes Received:
    20,439
    Part of Mike Lee's problem is that he took Donald Trump's word that they broke into his safe.

    Maybe they did, but it is far from a certainty. Perhaps to Trump, he saw they used tools to remove it from where it was and made that statement. Maybe they actually did break in to the safe. Maybe they wanted to be selective in what they took so they opened the safe to only take what the warrant allowed.

    Either way making assumptions based on something Donald Trump said is always a bad move.
     
    AleksandarN, jiggyfly, Nook and 3 others like this.
  4. Os Trigonum

    Os Trigonum Member
    Supporting Member

    Joined:
    May 2, 2014
    Messages:
    81,372
    Likes Received:
    121,708
    it would be fun if Trump actually did this:

     
  5. dobro1229

    dobro1229 Member

    Joined:
    Feb 16, 2010
    Messages:
    25,675
    Likes Received:
    22,390
    About as basic as Dwight Howard saying that hitting your free throws is important. The fact that it’s Dwight Howard would be the laughable part of the story would it not?
     
  6. FranchiseBlade

    Supporting Member

    Joined:
    Jan 14, 2002
    Messages:
    51,782
    Likes Received:
    20,439
    Yes, that would be good if he made public the warrant and affidavit.
     
    AleksandarN, No Worries and Andre0087 like this.
  7. DaDakota

    DaDakota Balance wins
    Supporting Member

    Joined:
    Mar 14, 1999
    Messages:
    128,590
    Likes Received:
    38,810
    Can't wait until Trump is out of the picture so we don't have to deal with this cult of personality, and shitstain on our constitution.

    DD
     
    Ziggy and Andre0087 like this.
  8. adoo

    adoo Member

    Joined:
    Mar 1, 2003
    Messages:
    11,787
    Likes Received:
    7,924
    Byron York publicizing his willful ignorance



    the dizzying height of willful ignorance!​
     
    No Worries likes this.
  9. mtbrays

    mtbrays Member
    Supporting Member

    Joined:
    Jul 4, 2007
    Messages:
    8,599
    Likes Received:
    7,981
    This is the D&D: the poo flinging is the argument!
     
  10. Agent94

    Agent94 Member

    Joined:
    Jun 28, 2002
    Messages:
    3,565
    Likes Received:
    3,972
    He absolutely committed a felony and they are raiding his business, so he is obviously going to be charged. I have no clue what will happen after that. Probably years of this winding through the courts.
     
    Haymitch and DaDakota like this.
  11. Os Trigonum

    Os Trigonum Member
    Supporting Member

    Joined:
    May 2, 2014
    Messages:
    81,372
    Likes Received:
    121,708
    excellent point and I stand corrected
     
    AroundTheWorld likes this.
  12. DaDakota

    DaDakota Balance wins
    Supporting Member

    Joined:
    Mar 14, 1999
    Messages:
    128,590
    Likes Received:
    38,810
    Trump gets a copy of the warrant let him publish it so the world can see what they were going for....

    DD
     
    Andre0087 and FranchiseBlade like this.
  13. Amiga

    Amiga Member

    Joined:
    Sep 18, 2008
    Messages:
    25,039
    Likes Received:
    23,296
    Cult piss level reached max. Trump did a real number on these people.
     
  14. bobrek

    bobrek Politics belong in the D & D

    Joined:
    Sep 16, 1999
    Messages:
    36,288
    Likes Received:
    26,645
    He'll release it when he releases his tax returns and health care plan.
     
  15. DonnyMost

    DonnyMost Member
    Supporting Member

    Joined:
    May 18, 2003
    Messages:
    48,945
    Likes Received:
    19,851
  16. Phillyrocket

    Phillyrocket Member

    Joined:
    Jun 12, 2002
    Messages:
    14,440
    Likes Received:
    11,597
    And the check he still owes the City of El Paso.

    Mexico still paying for that wall right?
     
    jiggyfly, JeeberD and FranchiseBlade like this.
  17. basso

    basso Member
    Supporting Member

    Joined:
    May 20, 2002
    Messages:
    33,247
    Likes Received:
    9,221
    they used mishandled docs as the warrant pretext; they're on an Adam Schiff led fishing expedition for Jan 6 evidence.

    and this is the clown they got to give them the warrant:

     
    blue_eyed_devil likes this.
  18. FranchiseBlade

    Supporting Member

    Joined:
    Jan 14, 2002
    Messages:
    51,782
    Likes Received:
    20,439
    Are you serious? Bruce Reinhart didn't recuse himself since he had the connection to Jeff Epstein just like Trump did? I guess the fact that they both had a connection to Epstein and he still signed off on the warrant must mean the evidence presented was pretty strong.

    It looks worse for Trump than I imagined.

    Are you aware of the photographic evidence that there was an attempt to flush classified documents down the toilet and Trump lied about it?

    • Please show evidence the FBI and the justice department are doing work at the behest of Adam Schiff.
    • Please show evidence they aren't searching for illegal
    • Given that there is photographic evidence of documents that were flushed down the toilet, why is it more likely they were on a fishing expedition for Jan. 6th than the mishandling of classified materials?
     
  19. rimrocker

    rimrocker Member

    Joined:
    Dec 22, 1999
    Messages:
    23,033
    Likes Received:
    9,911
    OK, I'll take a stab.

    1. Probably. Republicans trying to develop a Catch-22 deal here: If he didn't sign off, he doesn't know what is going on in his own department and agents are running amuck. If he did sign off, it's evidence of corruption in pursuit of political gains. In reality, MG probably signed off because it is an awesome precedent to be setting and I'm sure he recognized the scope and scale of that warrant and how Republicans would use this precedent when they get back in power. Yeah, it sucks, but the only other option is to just completely punt on the idea of the rule of law. That an ex-president can be subject to the legal process is a feature of democracy, not a bug.

    2. If they had credible evidence that there were still presidential documents at MAL and those might be highly classified, you can bet the safe was included in the warrant. You really expect the FBI to be like, "Oh, look, no PDBs laying around on top of Trump's nightstand. Guess there's nothing here?"

    3. The National Archives had done exactly that and some records were returned from MAL. We don't know in this case if they went that route, but there could have been correspondence we don't know about that Trump either did not take seriously or ignored. Or maybe he was afraid if he complied he would be admitting guilt. We just don't have enough info at this point to build a case around the presence or absence of official letters to Trump.

    The fact there was no subpoena might have something to do with the classified nature of the documents or the timely harm Trump was doing with them. It could also reflect the knowledge that Trump has been a destroyer of documents in the past and giving him any amount of time to destroy or move these would not be wise.

    4. There is no fourth point. Not unusual for Mike Lee.

    5. Yes Senator, there is a lot we don't know. Still, we can expect more info soon as I'm sure it is Job #1 of the Washington Post, NYTimes, and others who not only have political reporters but national security ones too. Whether we get the entirety of the story given the possibility of highly classified docs remains a question. If it does involve national intelligence, perhaps the intelligence committees on The Hill will be briefed. In that case, we can look forward to some Repubs on those committees pooh-poohing the whole thing regardless of the evidence.

    (What I do know is that Trump didn't take docs to help jog his memory so he could write a memoir.)

    6. The classification authority is indeed the president's, but is delegated throughout the relevant agencies. There is no way a president could review every document produced by the government and determine the level of classification. Note though, that the classification and declassification authority rests with the president, not with an ex-president. Also, the National Archives does not have that delegation as nothing about the workings of the National Archives requires anything but the normal government protections like personnel info. For records transferred to them, they abide by the classifications given by the originating agency or department. Point 6 is just stupid.

    7. I think he's talking about IRS auditors that under language in the IRA cannot conduct audits on those making $400k or less. And really, after all the evidence of what Trump did and tried to do, he's going to whine about the FBI doing their job by the book? Where was this outrage from 2016-2020? Bad talking point thrown out there in the hopes of creating fear among the stupid or violence by the losers.

    8. Red meat that has to be spoiled by now. I'm not going to rehash the Clinton stuff. I'll just say this is a different case with what looks to be a wildly different fact pattern.

    9. Hey, did you know Hunter Biden lost a laptop? Yeah, that's about the same thing as an ex-president taking presidential records home with him, some of which may be highly classified. The pro-abortion extremists were so horrible they broke into Kavanaugh's house, raped his daughters, stole his clock, and burned his BMW. Oh wait, they did none of that. Neither have they shot up a shopping mall or a school, ransacked the nation's capitol, or tried to kidnap a governor.

    10. More outrage for the stupid. He's talking about bulletins on violent white nationalist extremists and how law enforcement can identify them. Perhaps if your party is frequently using these symbols, you should rethink things or maybe, I don't know, not welcome violent white nationalist extremists into your party and pursue different electoral strategies so you don't depend on them for winning margins in close races.

    11. There is no 11th point.

    12. Yes, but this was not that. It's good for Americans to be skeptical of all law enforcement and military authority and to work to ensure that those powers are not abused. When our elected class craps in the bed like they did after 9/11, it leads to bad laws. Bad laws are also made when one party can push through cover for executive branch misdeeds. Let's take another look at this one and the one that allows ICE to do warrantless searches within 100 miles of any border, including coastlines.
     
  20. dc rock

    dc rock Member

    Joined:
    Jan 10, 2001
    Messages:
    7,624
    Likes Received:
    13,394


    Just naming any bad guy he can think of… “This is like General Grievous, Count Dooku, Count Chocula, Grand Moff Tarkin, William Zabka, The Borg, The Cybermen, and The Daleks combined!!!!”
     

Share This Page

  • About ClutchFans

    Since 1996, ClutchFans has been loud and proud covering the Houston Rockets, helping set an industry standard for team fan sites. The forums have been a home for Houston sports fans as well as basketball fanatics around the globe.

  • Support ClutchFans!

    If you find that ClutchFans is a valuable resource for you, please consider becoming a Supporting Member. Supporting Members can upload photos and attachments directly to their posts, customize their user title and more. Gold Supporters see zero ads!


    Upgrade Now