Maybe. But maybe the reason VY’s pro career didn’t go well was because Jeff Fisher actively tried to screw him and he’s a miserable b*stard to boot. Maybe.
Jeff Fisher is very mediocre but that didn’t stop McNair from being good and Young had an opportunity after Fisher. I love Vince Young. My dad worked with him in high school where he was a very hard worker, but he didn’t work as hard at UT and his personal problems really impacted him in the NFL. With a better work ethic, less personal problems and the right coach he could have been at least a Lamar Jackson type QB and possibly a Hall of Famer…. But the majority of the blame falls on Young. The hardest and most demanding job in sports is being a starting QB in the NFL, you can’t coast through it for very long.
I named my dog Vincey so nobody is a bigger fan than I am, and I’m not disagreeing with anything you say. But he showed such flashes, he had such a great record (31-17 while the same team without him was like 20-30 over a 5 year time period) that’s it’s criminal that the Titans would waste that asset without trying to get his head on straight and deal with him like a potential HOfer instead of shutting on him like Fisher did. Because there was a lot of good even in spite of it all with the organization doing him zero favors. But yeah, VY obviously has his own demons and struggles and owns a large part himself.
Yall are talking about Jeff Fisher and Vince Young. Again. Yall should know better. **** off both of you, and there's a better forum for this.
Vince def looked the part while playing @reliant early career. I'll never forget driving passed the parked cars around the stadium with countless VY jersey'd pedestrians. Those fools put one man over an entire city '05 Horns still remain a true personal championship to me though Where does that Trojan team rank in history prior to kickoff?
If that keeps him bout off the hall I will be so pissed off. The one dude that really had nothing to do with it and he has to wear that **** for life. So unfair.
Remember when ESPN was calling usc the greatest team ever before the rose bowl? That was the green light to take UT.
3x Batting Champ 4x Hits Leader .300 Career BA 2x Steals Leader 7x All-Star (in 10 seasons) 5x Silver Slugger MVP LCS MVP #2 All-time Postseason HRs Championship His case is already better than Dale Murphy easily
USC was 12-0 defending a 12-1 National Championship and then a 13-0 National Championship, with last year's Heisman Trophy Winner at QB and the current Heisman Trophy Winner at RB. No **** they were the favorites, and no **** they were being talked about as one of the best teams ever. USC and UT were #1 and #2 all season (first time that happened, iirc). We all learned who the best player and the best team in college football was.
There was a time that Houston Astros fans viewed season with a playoff appearances like World Series accomplishment. Even the 90’s Astros never did anything in the postseason until Roger Clemens and Andy Petite guided a World Series appearance in the mid 2000’s. Bagwell was amazing, but tended to flounder on the big stage. Biggio too, it wasn’t until Clemens and Petite brought the mojo with them. And then it all imploded after McLane went cheap and Andy returned back to the Yankees. Altuve wasn’t a beneficiary of any tradition, besides being asked to be the place holder for Delino DeShields. The team was being torn down. And Altuve somehow made himself relevant with little fanfare, or anyone thinking he would be a special player. The amazing thing is that the 2015 Astros with Altuve were the closest to beating the Royals out of the postseason. That team took down the mighty Yankees, in the Bronx too. And with all this successful period, there are two players from the 2015 who are key guys on the team today. Altuve and McCullers, yet MCCullers though extremely talented has missed long stretches of time. Altuve in the other hand had been the engine of this Astros era. Folks who say Bagwell or Biggio are confusing longevity for success and dominance. Altuve has kept steady on pace at an elite level, but even if he were to regress, he’d still lay a legit claim as the engine of the most successful era of Astros baseball. I’ll say it here and now, Altuve is already an all time great. And his demeanor separates him from Bagwell and Biggio who were always two very salty individuals who may have put too much pressure on themselves and their teammates. Altuve on the other hand seems to relax his teammates, and elevate the synergy of their talent.
You make a lot of great points, but this statement I don't quite agree with. There is no argument--none--that Bagwell and Biggio were anything other than dominant in the regular season. Your statement is accurate only within the context of the postseason, and I get it--for folks who hold your argument the postseason matters infinitely more than the regular season. I don't put the same elevated importance on the postseason, but it does matter to me. As Steve Sparks says so often, this is truly the golden era of Astros baseball. We're being spoiled rotten. I love it.
So was Berkman's and he didn't even make the threshhold to say on the ballot. Unfortunately, press clippings have too much influence on the voting. Altuve SHOULD BE a lock, but some won't even give him a chance. Now I won't rank the top 4, but he's in that group and I understand why some will consider him the Greatest Astro Ever. I chalk that up to recency bias verses legendary bias. My personal pick is Biggio, but I favor his doubles, HBP acumen and PA records over the traditional HRs and BA titles. But I know that is not the typical measure of greatness for most. I also want to note that those HOFers didn't have many playoff opportunities while in their prime like the recent batch have which accounts for some of the playoff success of our more recent stars.
HOF voting is a popularity contest. Manny Ramierez put up nearly 70 WAR over nearly two decades in the league, was the best player on multiple championship teams, owns the record for most postseason home runs by such a wide margin that it's questionable if even the great Jose Altuve can catch him as he enters his mid-30s, and was caught taking steroids. He's yet to eclipse 35% of the voters in year 4 of HOF elegibility. Meanwhile, David Ortiz put up 50 WAR, didn't quite match Manny's playoff numbers, and was also caught 'roiding, and he gets in on the first ballot. The same ballot that saw the end of the HOF hopes of Bonds, Clements, and Shilling, despite the fact that the former two already had HOF careers before 'roids (Clements put up 80 WAR in Boston alone), and the later because the BWAA doesn't like his political views. Cooperstown is a joke.
And most of the voters are biased toward NY, BOS, LA and CHI. If Rose and Bonds were from ANY of those teams, Gambling and Roids would disappear as HOF factors.
That east coast bias didn't help Rocket at all. 80 WAR with Boston? Great years with NYY? Dude should be first ballot if east coast bias is that strong.
