1. Welcome! Please take a few seconds to create your free account to post threads, make some friends, remove a few ads while surfing and much more. ClutchFans has been bringing fans together to talk Houston Sports since 1996. Join us!

Biggest bust potential?

Discussion in 'Houston Rockets: Game Action & Roster Moves' started by groovemachine, Apr 26, 2022.

?

Five years from draft night, who is most likely to be considered a 'bust'?

  1. Paolo Banchero

    22 vote(s)
    11.5%
  2. Chet Holmgren

    89 vote(s)
    46.4%
  3. Jaden Ivey

    5 vote(s)
    2.6%
  4. Keegan Murray

    12 vote(s)
    6.3%
  5. Shaedon Sharpe

    57 vote(s)
    29.7%
  6. Jabari Smith

    7 vote(s)
    3.6%
  1. smoothie

    smoothie Jabari Jungle

    Joined:
    Mar 1, 2001
    Messages:
    20,716
    Likes Received:
    6,947
    Sharpe

    by the time he plays in summer league it would have been a year since he's played competitively at EYBL. he only played 12 games in EYBL.

    no one should expect him to go from playing 12 games against high schoolers, to taking a year off from competitive basketball, to turning an NBA franchise around.

    he has all the physical tools but he will likely need a year in the GL before being able to do anything in the NBA. Even then he'd probably be pretty raw as a sophomore. you're signing up for a 2-3 year project to get him to where Jalen got by the end of the year.
     
    Y2JT, KingSamJack, saleem and 2 others like this.
  2. roslolian

    roslolian Member

    Joined:
    Oct 30, 2008
    Messages:
    29,896
    Likes Received:
    20,043
    What makes you think he wants to play defense, or that he really is 6'6 with 7 ft wingspan?

    Nobody knows anytbing about Sharpe RN. People just dont want to admit it.
     
  3. groovemachine

    groovemachine Member

    Joined:
    Jun 29, 2006
    Messages:
    3,113
    Likes Received:
    4,864
    o_O

    So we should expect 2 or 3 of the top five to be at least a 'soft bust'? Or is this a particularly strong top 5? The historical data is worrisome.



     
    TimDuncanDonaut likes this.
  4. saleem

    saleem Member

    Joined:
    Jan 1, 2001
    Messages:
    30,225
    Likes Received:
    14,665
    He needs the most time to develop. His frame is strong and he's athletic. An organisation with good coaches can help him.
     
    groovemachine likes this.
  5. TimDuncanDonaut

    Joined:
    Feb 20, 2009
    Messages:
    15,234
    Likes Received:
    36,370
    As far as outlook yea it's dicey. This is why I don't like #4 or #5. It's Jabari/Chet/Banchero or bust. Some of the other guys will be very good, but we just don't know who. Choose among the three so Rockets Org is least likely to mess up.


    GM and scouts can only make educated guesses. My hope is they keep their biases in check; avoid bad guesses.

    Big/Injury biases - On that list, we have guards and bigs who bust. Markel and Marvin. If Marvin Bagley busts, it's because he's a big? But Markel had confidence issues plus ended up being injury prone. His injury history had little to do with his height 6'3". But if you're tall and injured... it somehow ends up being cause-and-effect.

    We saw KPJ being out for thigh issues this year, he had thigh injuries dating back to USC. Those are clues/signs a GM should watch out for. Chet has little to no, injury history in HS/College, yet people lists that as a con "worry", for some reason. For context, this year's rookies: Cade 6'6, Green 6'6", Mobley 7'0", Barnes 6'7", all missed around the same number of games this year.

    It's keeping our biases in check. Look at the person instead of his 'type'.

    Skinny biases. Mobley and Green were two of the skinniest dudes entered this draft, yet both guys more-or-less met their team's expectations for performance.

    Sometimes I wish people take a step back and think logically. It is not just easier to gain muscles, it's probable for a NBA athlete. Much harder to grow wing span and hand size.
     
    #25 TimDuncanDonaut, Apr 26, 2022
    Last edited: Apr 26, 2022
    groovemachine and D-rock like this.
  6. ApacheWarrior

    ApacheWarrior Member

    Joined:
    Aug 3, 2017
    Messages:
    10,350
    Likes Received:
    13,301
    That's what drafting BPA with no thought process gets you.

    You don't draft a running quarterback (who doesn't throw much) when you
    are a passing football team.

    BPA prolongs the rebuild
    __________
    Outside the rant...

    Sharpe is the secret prize inside the Crackerjack box when you have
    a bike with a bow just sitting there.

    Some people want the Crackerjack box to have a Rolex or something out of this
    world inside......but sadly find out it's just a 10 cent decoder ring.
     
    #26 ApacheWarrior, Apr 26, 2022
    Last edited: Apr 26, 2022
    Verbal Christ likes this.
  7. 9baller

    9baller Member

    Joined:
    Apr 17, 2013
    Messages:
    1,116
    Likes Received:
    1,605
    Fair point but the opposite can be true as well. Not drafting the BPA could be a mistake that sets the team back years. It could work either way.
     
    groovemachine and ApacheWarrior like this.
  8. TimDuncanDonaut

    Joined:
    Feb 20, 2009
    Messages:
    15,234
    Likes Received:
    36,370
    The 'b' in bpa is BEST player available. If a player fits limited schemes or is a one-way player. Is that person really a bpa?
     
    #28 TimDuncanDonaut, Apr 26, 2022
    Last edited: Apr 26, 2022
  9. ApacheWarrior

    ApacheWarrior Member

    Joined:
    Aug 3, 2017
    Messages:
    10,350
    Likes Received:
    13,301
    So you're saying it's a crap shoot either way.....I agree
     
  10. coachbadlee

    coachbadlee Member

    Joined:
    Feb 5, 2010
    Messages:
    29,648
    Likes Received:
    10,130
    Shaedon has yet to Sharpe-n his skills in college, so I pick him.
     
  11. sealclubber1016

    Supporting Member

    Joined:
    Mar 31, 2010
    Messages:
    21,335
    Likes Received:
    34,316
    The 3 bigs are virtual locks IMO to be at least good NBA players.

    Ivey and Sharpe have the potential to be outright scrubs.
     
  12. groovemachine

    groovemachine Member

    Joined:
    Jun 29, 2006
    Messages:
    3,113
    Likes Received:
    4,864
    Your pun does not go unnoticed sir :D
     
    coachbadlee likes this.
  13. groovemachine

    groovemachine Member

    Joined:
    Jun 29, 2006
    Messages:
    3,113
    Likes Received:
    4,864
    That’s an excellent point to consider, it’s easy for myself and others to project future injuries on Chet due to his ‘frail’ appearance. When in actuality it’s lean and flexible muscle that is less injury prone, and frankly more suitable to the rigors of the sport. Additionally there’s a Yao hangover given his injury history as the last franchise big.

    Pound for pound, Chet might be the strongest of the top five considering the limitations of his body type holding muscle mass. Like in boxing, in hoops lean muscle and dexterity are paramount. Chet is legit top 3, and injury concerns are speculative at this point.





     
  14. rimrocker

    rimrocker Member

    Joined:
    Dec 22, 1999
    Messages:
    23,037
    Likes Received:
    9,929
    Well, there's always at least one bust and several that don't reach career expectations. It's what makes the draft fun (or heartbreaking).

    I picked Sharpe in this poll, but like many drafts, you could make a bust argument for all the picks. The only #1 pick I've ever been absolutely sure of was Olajuwon--and that was only because I knew he could routinely hold his own against NBA MVP Moses Malone.
     
    groovemachine likes this.
  15. xaos

    xaos Member

    Joined:
    Jan 31, 2015
    Messages:
    6,609
    Likes Received:
    16,458
    Sharpe is the big unknown, but that doesn't mean bust potential to me. Chet could legit get bullied out of the league and become unplayable. He could also be a multiple time DPOY. the range is insane lol
     
    groovemachine likes this.
  16. Reeko

    Reeko Member

    Joined:
    Mar 1, 2017
    Messages:
    52,271
    Likes Received:
    143,793
    Bullied out of the league? Y’all are really overstating things now

    the same was said for Mobley

    KG as a rookie

    [​IMG]

    AD

    [​IMG]

    Giannis

    [​IMG]

    Why are people acting like they’re so much bigger than Chet coming into the league?

    at this point, Chet is talked about like he’s a literal living chopstick with legs
     
    RustyHarden, D-rock, Y2JT and 4 others like this.
  17. YOLO

    YOLO Member

    Joined:
    Apr 16, 2012
    Messages:
    46,688
    Likes Received:
    44,892
    [​IMG]

    [​IMG]
     
    #37 YOLO, Apr 27, 2022
    Last edited: Apr 27, 2022
  18. xaos

    xaos Member

    Joined:
    Jan 31, 2015
    Messages:
    6,609
    Likes Received:
    16,458
    It's entirely possible, that's why. If he doesnt add strength he can get bullied out of the league. My comment is regarding my perceived worst case vs my perceived best case. Chet has extremely high upside and that's why I say he could also work his way to being a DPOY player as well (seemed like that comment was conveniently ignored). He has length, mobility, seems like mental toughness, good shooting stroke. He also isn't stuck in as just playing center because of some of his gaurd skills.

    Some players have a harder time developing strength than others and Chet is on that extreme side. I'd say it will be harder for him to gain strength than it will be for Zion to lose weight, as a random example

    Also, I certainly didnt think any of your example players would get bullied out of the league as a draft prospect, in fact I thought rookie year Giannis was going to become MVP of the league and I was split about 60/40 or so on Jalen/Mobley as a prospect. KG I dont remember my draft opinion of him, but was a fan from game one i saw him in the NBA. Only example you used that i still dont like, but understand his defensive impact is Anthony Davis. So, I don't really care about what others say about other prospects, cause I certainly wasn't on that side of history

    If I had a gun to my head to predict Chets career I'd say he gets bullied a lot his first year or two, but shows enough shooting touch, help side rim protection, and good attitude/effort for the coaches to continue to develop him. He ends up coming into his own towards years 3&4, but more as a wing player/rim protector than anything else.

    It's worth noting, I've watched this guy play like 3 times my entire life and each time he just seemed meh to me. So, I'm not a draft expert or trying to act like one haha
     
    #38 xaos, Apr 27, 2022
    Last edited: Apr 27, 2022
  19. Reeko

    Reeko Member

    Joined:
    Mar 1, 2017
    Messages:
    52,271
    Likes Received:
    143,793
    I just don’t see why Chet’s body is viewed as skinnier in any significant way compared to Mobley, Giannis, KG, and AD. I don’t see how someone like KG or Giannis and their skinny, malnourished looking bodies had no chance of getting bullied out the league, but for some reason Chet does.
     
    YOLO and cmoak1982 like this.
  20. xaos

    xaos Member

    Joined:
    Jan 31, 2015
    Messages:
    6,609
    Likes Received:
    16,458
    I'm not comparing Chet to them though lol. This is just off watching him

    Even if I were and attempt to make the comp, KG was a tenacious rookie. You instantly knew KG wasn't just some skinny dude who was going to get bullied. I could see Giannis was pretty tenacious too. The way he guarded Harden full court his rookie year showed me a tenacity I thought he'd have to have to build up his frame. Another skinny dude was Durant, but he had elite elite skills even as a college kid.

    I also recognize Chet isn't plating in an era of "bangers"... but still NBA is a league of grown men. His skinny frame is less meaningful today than it would've been 20 years ago

    I'll try to be objective and look just at numbers using draftexpress and a generic metric to account for height/Weight. Please feel free to correct me on any of these.

    Chet:
    Age: 19
    Height: 7'0"
    Weight: 195 lbs
    BMI: 19.4

    KG:
    Age: 19
    Height: 6'11"
    Weight: 217 lbs
    BMI: 22.1

    Giannis:
    Age: 18
    Height: 6'9"
    Weight: 196 lbs
    BMI: 21

    Anthony Davis:
    Age: 19
    Height: 6'10"
    Weight: 222 lbs
    BMI: 23.2

    Evan Mobley:
    Age: 20
    Height: 7'0"
    Weight: 215 lbs
    BMI: 21.4

    Chet is 9 lbs away from being classified as Underweight (<18.5 on a BMI scale). Your average NBA athletes on a BMI scale are "overweight" (>25) because of their muscle weight isn't factored in correctly on a standard BMI scale. So, I'd expect even a "skinny" nba player to have an average BMI. To say he is 9 lbs away from being classified as underweight as an NBA prospect, that's actually objectively damn skinny.
     
    #40 xaos, Apr 27, 2022
    Last edited: Apr 27, 2022

Share This Page