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Psaki Says "Gender Affirming Care" for Kids Is 'Best Practice'

Discussion in 'BBS Hangout: Debate & Discussion' started by AroundTheWorld, Apr 8, 2022.

  1. rocketsjudoka

    rocketsjudoka Member

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    From what I've seen I don't see anything actually encouraging children to become gay or trans. I've seen things saying it is OK if you are gay or trans but nothing saying you should become gay or trans.

    On the pronouns I agree it can be frustrating and irritating to have to go around asking people what they want to be called. I admit to frequently rolling my eyes at a meeting or public gathering when they start out saying "My name is x and my pronouns are.." and then we go around telling people our names and how we want to be referred to. That said if someone wants to be referred to a certain way out of common courtesy I will refer to them that way.

    I consider it like this. Let's say your name is "Juan" and someone insisted on calling you "John". I would find that offensive if after I told him what my name was and how to pronounce it they continued to do so.

    And yes, there are far more important things to worry about. We have crumbling infrastructure, people unable to get good healthcare, high inflation, and weather disasters. We have an actual war going on that has the potential to escalate into something that could end civilization as we know it. Instead we have politicians basing reelection campaigns on the threat of homosexuality and transgendered people who are still a very small part of the population.
     
    #101 rocketsjudoka, Apr 9, 2022
    Last edited: Apr 9, 2022
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  2. AroundTheWorld

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    So I re-watched it.

    She says "gender-affirming care for transgender kids is a best practice".

    https://www.webmd.com/sex/gender-affirming-care#:~:text=Gender-affirmation care refers to,they were assigned at birth.

    If that's what it means, then how is the thread title wrong?

    I continue to think that children should not make a decision to have sex change surgery, and nobody else should make that decision for a child.
     
  3. bobrek

    bobrek Politics belong in the D & D

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    Because the thread title doesn't say gender affirming care. GAC includes things like psychiatric help.

    Sex reassignment surgery is clearly more drastic than things like therapy sessions and passive treatment.
     
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  4. AroundTheWorld

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    According to the definition, it also includes surgery.

    And I will post some more about medication, etc. in a moment.
     
  5. AroundTheWorld

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  6. AroundTheWorld

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    I would agree with the tweet below:

     
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  7. JayGoogle

    JayGoogle Member

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    I'll ask you this. Can you find cases where kids, I'll even define the definition of kids as pre-18, having Sex Reassignment surgery?

    Good luck on your search.
     
  8. bobrek

    bobrek Politics belong in the D & D

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    Of course it does, but that's clearly not ALL it includes.

    For example, assume a 14 year old kid has serious concerns about their sexual identity.

    Wouldn't you consider it 'best practice' to seek more information and speak with a therapist about their concerns?
     
  9. AroundTheWorld

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    https://nypost.com/2021/06/30/inside-the-rush-to-reassign-the-genders-of-kids/

    Parents speak out about the ‘rush’ to reassign the gender of their kids
    By
    Jane Ridley
    June 30, 2021 5:46pm
    Updated
    [​IMG]
    Dad Brenton Netz holds up a photograph of his son, Miles, who he claims is being fast-tracked into gender reassignment.Mike Roemer
    TRANSGENDER[/paste:font]
    Single mom Bri was visiting the pediatrician’s office with her 15-year-old, a child struggling with anxiety, when the doctor said: “If you don’t affirm your daughter’s gender identity, or get her the help she needs, and she kills herself, you’re going to feel awfully guilty.”

    Bri, who asked The Post to publish only her nickname for fear of being branded a bigot and doxxed by transgender-rights activists, was horrified — not only by the insinuation her teen would commit suicide if she didn’t transition, but also the fact that the general practitioner issued the warning in front of them both.

    Activists are increasingly pushing for laws that allow children to make their own decisions to transition without parental approval, insisting that going through puberty is traumatic for those who feel misgendered.

    But some experts now question the threat that they say is commonly used by medical professionals. They believe many doctors are so scared of the label “transphobe” that they automatically present skeptical parents with a doomsday scenario: “Would you rather have a dead son or a living daughter?” or vice versa.

    Critics of the blunt proposition include pediatric endocrinologist Dr. Paul Hruz, of the Washington University School of Medicine in St Louis. He told The Post: “In these circumstances, I would advise parents to ask, ‘On what evidence are you making this claim?'”

    His concerns focus on the widely accepted belief that sex-reassignment treatment prevents emotionally damaged kids from ending their lives. He questions the theory, pointing out that its supporting studies are variously limited or skewed. According to the physician, fundamental problems with the research include large numbers of self-selected subjects, a lack of control groups and inadequate reviews by peers.

    By contrast, a 2011 study spanning three decades by the respected Karolinska Institute in Sweden found that people who underwent sex reassignment were 19 times more likely to die by suicide than the general population. In the US, a yearlong survey by the National Center for Transgender Equality concluded that those who had transitioned were more likely to have attempted suicide than trans people who had not had medical or surgical treatments.

    [​IMG]
    Bri, who asked The Post to use only her nickname in case of backlash, does not support her daughter’s desire to change gender.
    @ Jennifer Chase for the NY Post
    Hruz’s views are also backed by a study published in 2019 in the American Journal of Psychiatry, which concludes that when it comes to the mental health of those diagnosed with gender dysphoria, there is “no advantage of [reassignment] surgery.”

    His take on the issue is explored in the newly released film “Trans Mission: What’s the Rush To Reassign Gender?” Produced by the Center for Bioethics and Culture Network, the documentary is streaming on YouTube and Vimeo, and arrived a month after a similar investigation by “60 Minutes.

    Lesley Stahl’s exposé highlighted the surge in unregulated, money-spinning transgender clinics serving kids and young adults in the US. The Human Rights Campaign currently lists more than 40 “clinical care programs for transgender and gender-expansive youth” on its Web site.

    Only one such institution existed in America in 2007.

    In the “60 Minutes” segment, chronically depressed young woman Grace Lidinsky-Smith describes how, in her early 20s, she believed transitioning would make her feel “free.” She tells Stahl that a gender therapist she found on the Internet “didn’t go into what my gender dysphoria might have been stemming from.”

    She was hastily prescribed testosterone and, just four months later, was approved for so-called top surgery, trans speak for a double mastectomy. But, instead of experiencing relief after the drastic operation, she felt traumatized. “I started to have a disturbing sense that a part of my life was missing — almost a ghost-limb feeling,” Lidinsky-Smith, now 27, reveals on camera. She de-transitioned by coming off testosterone, and says she complained to the unnamed clinic about its agenda-driven methods.

    [​IMG]
    The hard-hitting film “Trans Mission: What’s the Rush To Reassign Gender?” is currently streaming on YouTube and Vimeo.
    Courtesy of the Center for Bioethics and Culture Network
    Meanwhile, according to 39-year-old Bri, her daughter, who aims to become a boy, has comorbid psychological issues because of a traumatic childhood, partly caused by the difficult divorce of her parents. The Baltimore-based mom remains convinced her child has been duped by peer pressure, social media — which seems to champion transgenderism among young people without question — and the “grass is greener” trope that men have an “easier” lot in life.

    “It has to be a safe and careful process for both parents and kids to move forward wherever their gender exploration goes. It doesn’t work that a child says, ‘I’m trans, give me hormones,’ and then gets a shot.”

    Dr. Michelle Forcier, a professor of pediatrics who supports early “gender care” that “helps kids express their authentic identity”
    “There was no indication between her birth and the age of 13 that she felt she was in the wrong body,” said Bri, who sadly believes the catalyst was her girl being lusted after and shamed by boys. “As they started taking an interest in her — she told me how a classmate had repeatedly touched her inappropriately — she began to bind her breasts and became introverted and round-shouldered, as if she was trying to disguise the fact she was a woman.”

    Following several rounds of counseling — which, Bri claims, only accelerated her desire to transition — she contemplated top surgery at only 14. This operation is frequently followed by bottom surgery, a k a an elective hysterectomy.

    Bri said, “I felt the need to safeguard my daughter before she allowed her body to be harmed.” By then, without the mom’s knowledge or consent, teachers at the eighth-grader’s school were exclusively calling their student by her boy name.

    “I felt completely marginalized — like the odd one out,” said Bri, whose state does not require parental permission for anyone 16 and older to either take cross-sex hormones or fully transition.

    Hruz has become increasingly worried about the way kids are allowed to make these life-changing decisions on their own. In the state of Washington, for example, a child as young as 13 can defy the wishes of their parents by transitioning via medical treatments. Moreover, that same seventh-grader is legally entitled to use their family’s health insurance to cover gender-affirming procedures such as tracheal shaves, or Adam’s apple reductions.

    “There’s well-established literature on the inherent tendency of adolescents to be impulsive and not fully able to appreciate long-term consequences,” Hruz said. “It’s the whole basis for society limiting their autonomy on things like drinking alcohol, purchasing cigarettes and even voting until a certain age.
     
  10. AroundTheWorld

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    “The concept that gender reassignment is an exception needs to be challenged.”

    Concerned about enduring health effects of medical and surgical interventions such as puberty blockers, sustained hormone therapy and the removal of intimate body parts, he added: “These issues are so under researched. We don’t have the long-term data on the relative risks and benefits of this approach.”

    Californian Abigail Shrier, who wrote the 2020 book “Irreversible Damage: The Transgender Craze Seducing Our Daughters,” is horrified by the way children — particularly girls — have easier access to hormones and surgeries.

    “Most of these girls seeking interventions don’t have typical gender dysphoria at all, and there is no evidence they will be helped by any of the treatments they are getting with almost no medical oversight,” Shrier told The Post. “It’s a crisis in the making.”

    She’s argued that “peer contagion” may play a part, an idea that’s supported by a 2019 study from Brown University that found that parents of children experiencing gender dysphoria observed their teens feeling pressure to fit in with their friend group.

    Brenton Netz, 49, of Marquette, Mich., feels his parental concerns over the medical treatment of his child, Miles Gewirtz, have been ignored. Appearing in “Trans Mission,” he expresses his opposition to his 11-year-old, who has autism, taking puberty blockers. He fears the boy will be considered for gender-reassignment surgery when he reaches his mid to late teens.

    [​IMG]
    Concerned father Brenton Netz is deeply unhappy that his son, Miles, whose picture he is holding, is being encouraged to transition.
    Mike Roemer
    “Miles is very impressionable,” Netz told The Post. Netz has joint custody with Miles’ mother, Sarah Gewirtz, and feels the tween has been unduly influenced by “overzealous” clinicians who diagnosed him with gender dysphoria at age 8.

    “My son has said he’s going to drink a magic potion to keep him young forever,” he said. “It demonstrates his limited capacity to understand his feelings about something as important as gender.”

    [​IMG]

    Virginia girl slams school board for transgender locker room policy


    Netz, who launched an online campaign called Save Miles to generate publicity for his cause, recently won a significant victory in a lengthy legal battle. The judge’s ruling prevents Miles’ mother from pursuing medical interventions at a gender and sexuality clinic in St. Cloud, Minn.

    “Miles’ autism makes him particularly vulnerable,” said Netz, explaining that the disorder has already made his son feel lonely and isolated, leaving him with an overwhelming “need to please and fit in.”

    Not everyone is so distrusting. Dr. Michelle Forcier, professor of pediatrics at Brown’s Warren Alpert Medical School, who is featured in “Trans Mission” as a supporter of early “gender care,” describes the practice of gender intervention at a young age as “beautiful and inclusive,” since it “helps kids express their authentic identity.”

    She says in the film, “We’re telling parents to love your child, no matter their gender trajectory, because every kid is better if they are loved for who they are and feels safe, respected and valued at home.”

    Forcier insists that the process is not rushed; consideration and balance are employed before puberty blockers and other hormone treatments are administered to children.

    “It has to be a safe and careful process for both parents and kids to move forward wherever their gender exploration goes,” adds the doctor. “It doesn’t work that a child says, ‘I’m trans, give me hormones,’ and then gets a shot of testosterone.”

    However, she stressed that the practice of “watchful waiting” — where parents and clinicians resolve to delay intervention until the child gets older — can be harmful, since they may miss the “window” when treatments are most effective.

    Addressing the prevalence of autistic children such as Miles who are diagnosed with gender dysphoria — the Tavistock Centre, the only gender identity clinic in the UK for under-18s, has reported some 35 percent of its referrals are kids on the spectrum — Forcier offers a controversial explanation.

    [​IMG]

    Father arrested for discussing child’s gender transition in defiance of court order


    “They are neuro diverse, and might also be gender diverse,” she says. “With their wiring and their hormones, they are not necessarily going to fit in this square hole. They’re going to need a different fit.”

    She adds: “If you are not super attentive to social cues — and you’re not, ‘Oh, God, what will people think of me?’ — you may be more willing to think, ‘My gender isn’t this clear cut.’ ”

    As for Bri, the staunch feminist hopes to persuade her daughter to first tackle her mental-health issues before making an informed choice about a possible transition. As she says in the documentary: “It’s because I love her so much [that] I’m willing to take on this whole ideology just to protect her.”

    Nonetheless, she told The Post she would never turn her back on her child, whichever road she eventually chooses.

    The mom concluded: “I’ve said that — even though I don’t agree with it — if you feel lousy after hormonal treatments or surgical interventions, I will still make chicken soup for you.”
     
  11. AroundTheWorld

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    https://mynorthwest.com/3296653/ran...gender-reassignment-surgery-parental-consent/

    Washington state now appears to allow minors to undergo life-changing gender reassignment surgery without parental consent.

    Under a new law, health insurers must cover “gender-affirming” care, including surgical treatments that were previously denied coverage. Democrats rejected a proposal to apply the new law to patients over 18 years old.

    It’s one in a series of new laws that, taken together, allow children as young as 13 years old to make serious health care decisions. The consequences are immense.

    Last year, via SB 5889, Washington Democrats forced insurers to cover gender dysmorphia treatment and gender-affirming care for minors between 13 and 17, without parental consent. It mandates that insurers deal directly with the patient without requiring the policyholder’s authorization.

    It builds on SB 5904, which provides outpatient mental health treatment without parental consent for the same age group.

    All communication must go directly to the patient. The insurer may not disclose the patient’s medical information to outside parties, like the policyholder, unless given permission. The policyholder, in this case, is the parent.

    The standard of care for gender dysphoria in youth is outlined by the World Professional Association for Transgender Health (WPATH). It includes everything from puberty-blocking hormones and speech therapy, to laser hair removal and counseling on binding. But it also asks doctors to affirm the choice of some to undergo surgical procedures to help them match their gender identity.



    For some transgender patients, WPATH says, “relief from gender dysphoria cannot be achieved without modification of their primary and/or secondary sex characteristics to establish greater congruence with their gender identity.”

    “Mental health professionals should not impose a binary view of gender. They should give ample room for clients to explore different options for gender expression. Hormonal or surgical interventions are appropriate for some adolescents, but not for others,” WPATH notes.

    Technical update on language downplays the seriousness of law
    The new law is just a minor update to technical terminology on the surface. But it’s much more than that.

    SB 5313 bans an insurance provider from categorically rejecting cosmetic, gender-affirming treatments when deemed medically necessary by a health care provider and when prescribed to a patient, consistent with their gender identity.



    Up until this law, gender reassignment surgery and other procedures like facial reconstruction or laser hair removal were considered cosmetic by health insurance companies. Due to its classification as cosmetic, health insurers did not usually cover the procedures, even when doctors medically recommended them.

    The bill was signed into law by Governor Jay Inslee in 2021 and went into effect on Jan. 1, 2022.

    Is this about bigotry?
    The bill’s sponsor, State Senator Marko Liias (D-Lynnwood), argued at the time of its passage that it was in response to other states banning treatment for minors. He labeled the bans as “transphobic.”

    “I am proud that our state is sort of standing up to this hysteria sweeping the country of intolerance and hatred of trans people,” Liias told Crosscut. “We are going the opposite direction saying that, here, people are welcome and we support them.”



    But the direction that Liias is going means cutting parents out of the decision-making process, allowing a child to alter their body permanently.

    It’s also a curious move since Washington law bans minors from using tanning beds. Lawmakers, including Liias, voted for that ban to protect children from the harmful effects of UV rays. Now Democrats allow your child to go through feminizing hormone therapy and some surgical procedures independently.

    One Senate Republican supported the bill, and all House Republicans rejected it.
     
  12. AroundTheWorld

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    If it includes that and she was aware of that, then the thread title is not incorrect.
     
  13. AroundTheWorld

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    https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/ar...ildren-given-gender-reassignment-surgery.html

    Two leading transgender medics warn children should not be given puberty blockers, that too many are being given gender reassignment surgery and reveal NYT turned down their op-ed on the subject
    • Dr Marci Bowers and Dr Erica Anderson spoke out in Bari Weiss''s Substack letter
    • The pair said they were concerned by some trends for transgender youngsters
    • Both warned that puberty blockers could be given too young, causing irreversible consequences for a person perhaps not ready
    • They also said that the policy of 'affirmative care' - which has replaced 'watchful waiting' - was not necessarily benefiting people in the long run
    • Anderson also said she was concerned about the 'sloppy' approach to the mental health side of transitioning, and feared many would regret it
    By HARRIET ALEXANDER FOR DAILYMAIL.COM

    PUBLISHED: 01:21 BST, 5 October 2021 | UPDATED: 04:31 BST, 5 October 2021

    Two of the world's top medics for gender reassignment procedures - both of them transgender women - have expressed concern about the number of children being given puberty blockers and undergoing surgery, describing the rise in procedures are deeply worrying.

    Dr Marci Bowers, a world-renowned vaginoplasty specialist who operated on reality-television star Jazz Jennings, and Erica Anderson, a clinical psychologist at the University of California San Francisco's Child and Adolescent Gender Clinic, both spoke out for Bari Weiss's Substack newsletter, Common Sense.

    Bowers said she was 'not a fan' of putting children in the early stages of puberty on blockers - a technique that doctors increasingly use when young people say they are questioning their gender, and which can maintain more feminine looks for growing boys.

    [​IMG]
    Dr Marci Bowers, one of the world's leading surgeons for transgender people, said that she was troubled by some of the trends in the field, including intolerance of differing views

    [​IMG]
    Dr Erica Anderson, a clinical psychologist at the University of California San Francisco's Child and Adolescent Gender Clinic, said she was concerned about 'sloppy' medical practices for the mental health of the young people undergoing gender reassignment

    'This is typical of medicine,' she said, asked about the prevailing orthodoxy.

    'We zig and then we zag, and I think maybe we zigged a little too far to the left in some cases.

    'I think there was naivete on the part of pediatric endocrinologists who were proponents of early [puberty] blockage thinking that just this magic can happen, that surgeons can do anything.'

    She said that the World Professional Association for Transgender Health (WPATH) could be intolerant of dissenting opinions.

    'There are definitely people who are trying to keep out anyone who doesn't absolutely buy the party line that everything should be affirming, and that there's no room for dissent,' Bowers said.

    'I think that's a mistake.'

    Anderson said that she had submitted an op ed to The New York Times warning about the risks of treatments, and the paper turned it down because the story was 'outside our coverage priorities right now.'

    Bowers operated on reality star Jazz Jennings, in June 2018 - a series of steps she shared on Instagram with her 1.2 million followers.

    [​IMG]
    Jazz Jennings in June 2018 underwent gender reassignment surgery, at the age of 17. She is pictured in February 2019

    [​IMG]
    Jennings is one of the most famous transgender people in the world, with 1.2 million followers on Instagram and her own reality tv show

    Jennings had been on puberty blockers since the age of 11, meaning that when the time came for her surgery, aged 17, her penis was not fully formed and the operation was significantly more complicated than if she had not been on the blockers.

    Gender dysphoria overwhelmingly affects boys and men, and often begins in early childhood, from the age of two.

    It affects .01 per cent of males, or one in 10,000, according to the latest analysis.

    Nearly seven in 10 children initially diagnosed with gender dysphoria eventually outgrew it, many becoming gay adults, and so the traditional view was 'watchful waiting'.

    That has now been replaced by 'affirmative care' - a much more proactive position.

    Bowers also said that the surgery they opt for can leave people sexually dysfunctional - something she said was not discussed enough.

    'The idea all sounded good in the very beginning,' she said.

    [​IMG]
    Bowers and Anderson were both interviewed for the Substack newsletter run by Bari Weiss (above)

    'Believe me, we're doing some magnificent surgeries on these kids, and they're so determined, and I'm so proud of so many of them and their parents. They've been great.

    'But honestly, I can't sit here and tell you that they have better — or even as good — results. They're not as functional. I worry about their reproductive rights later. I worry about their sexual health later and ability to find intimacy.'

    Anderson said she feared many young people would regret their decisions.

    'It is my considered opinion that due to some of the - let's see, how to say it? what word to choose? - due to some of the, I'll call it just 'sloppy,' sloppy healthcare work, that we're going to have more young adults who will regret having gone through this process,' she told the site.

    'And that is going to earn me a lot of criticism from some colleagues, but given what I see - and I'm sorry, but it's my actual experience as a psychologist treating gender variant youth - I'm worried that decisions will be made that will later be regretted by those making them.'

    She said she was concerned about 'rushing people through the medicalization', and warned of the 'abject failure to evaluate the mental health of someone historically in current time, and to prepare them for making such a life-changing decision.'
     
  14. JumpMan

    JumpMan Member
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    Children also aren't good at critical thinking and they're highly impressionable. A combination that makes them very vulnerable and in need of protection, no? Also makes them easy and important targets.

    I asked that question to get people in support of all of this to state what actual grooming would look like or at least to think about it.

    To do that and not come to the conclusion that what we're seeing is what it would look like would take some denial. You wouldn't go at this with an axe, you would be delicate and surgical. Pedophiles don't do it that way, LGBT+ groomers wouldn't either.
     
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  15. JayGoogle

    JayGoogle Member

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    That isn't a case of it actually happening and the website again assumes 'Gender Affirming Care' is SRS or Puberty Blockers. It's just another scare tactic that you've eaten up by another conservative nwes site.

    What they are ignoring is that most...yes MOST trans people NEVER have SRS. Knowing this fact alone means that it is EXCEPTIONALLY rare that anyone under 18 even considers it, patient or doctor.
     
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  16. bobrek

    bobrek Politics belong in the D & D

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    The title is incorrect because it is mislesding and it focus on the most drastic piece of GAC and only focuses on it.

    Why didn't the title and, by extension you, simply use GAC in the title which is what she said?

    She did not say the words the title said she did, therefore it is incorrect.
     
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  17. bobrek

    bobrek Politics belong in the D & D

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    @AroundTheWorld

    Here is an example...i assume (and please correct me if I'm wrong) that you support counseling for 15 year olds who question their sexual identity.

    Is it accurate for me to create a thread titled "ATW supports GAC for children" and then go on to explain how GAC includes sex reassignment surgery and puberty blockers?

    Because if you do support counseling in the example I gave, everything I wrote is true.
     
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  18. AroundTheWorld

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    No, you are wrong. The definition includes surgery, so that would mean she also supports surgery.

    But if it helps make you sleep better at night - I will now change the thread title for you.
     
  19. AroundTheWorld

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    This is a very long article.

    https://www.theatlantic.com/magazine/archive/2018/07/when-a-child-says-shes-trans/561749/

    I understand this is an extremely complex and difficult issue, and I feel for those who are dealing with it, and for their parents.

    It should be a decision between the affected individual and his/her parents, advised by non-ideological doctors. And surgery should be excluded, in my opinion.

    What I see here is that the Left once again wants to take decisions away from parents and the Right is counteracting that. It's part of a larger ideological battlefield. In communism, the family as a social construct must be weakened. You can all read up about this. It happened A LOT in former communist East Germany.
     
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