Just saying if u have a sht take or a knee jerk reactions. People will clown u for it and it's up to u on how u handle it. It's a sport forum, u can't always b right. Some folks eat crow gracefully others like booby double down on sht takes. Flip flopping is fine once u admit u were wrong. It's the one that does it and tries to spin fake stories/gas light to avoid admiting they were wrong that is triggering. That's just me.
Zac Lowe's latest podcast he and Pelton have Green as...2nd team all rookie. They're very complimentary of Green but it's kind of bullshit, they have Herb Jones and Franz Wagner ahead of him, citing advanced stats efficiency, slow start etc. I think advanced stats are dumb for rookies on tanking teams - they're not really designed to measure impact the same way it's designed to measure Jokic's on/off rating Rookie of the year/all rookie is a weird award - would you rather have the rookie who started slow but had the last month averaging 30 and being unguardable or the guy who gave you a steady 13 ppg in November. They go for the latter but IMO its a different kind of award than all NBA and it's perfectly fine to discount early season struggles
Its tribalism. Jalen Green was "the worst player in the NBA" for so long among the casuals that those opinions linger among a popularity contest. Doesnt matter - just titles and BS. Let Jalen keep adding fuel to the fire. Kid is going to come out next year and take heads.
The advanced stats measure impact (though a lot of times indirectly). I'd say what that impact means about the player while a team is tanking can be problematic. Though, I would say Green's RAPTOR WAR tracks well with how he's played. If Green had played the whole season like he has the last 25, he easily has the most RAPTOR WAR among rookies. Granted, I don't care too much about voted on awards (initial outrage calms quickly). If the voters value early and midseason performance equally with the end of the season performance, it is hard to make a case for Green. If the vote was purely on which rookie played the best at the end of the season, I'd expect a different result. I expect Green will make All-Rookie Team as enough voters will care more about end of the season performance than those that treat the season equally. I do think it will be hypocritical if Mobley wins ROY as he's been solely living off of his first 40-50 games while Barnes has definitely been better over the entire season and Cade (when he isn't held out) and Green have been the best at the end.
harden who? just imagine how pissed off we'd be had harden signed that 50 million dollar extension for two more years. we'd be stuck. now we got jalen green and picks! i wouldn't even trade jalen for harden straight up! its a good time to be rocket fans fellas, lets enjoy the ride. how lucky did we get? lucky, real lucky. it was a blessing in disguise at the time, we just didn't know it. sold high on harden. i always thought that once he lost a step he wouldn't be the same player. looks like daryl is stuck, you guys got what you wanted. tilman is soooo lucky. manages bad, cheap, and yet still somehow gets rewarded. weird. next year the good times are coming.
Spot on. Again, this is where i think advanced stats and all that get you no where. How do you judge a player on how much he helped his team winning when his team had no intention of winning anything. That just doesn't make sense. But this is why i stopped caring as much about individual awards. We all know Harden should have like 3 MVPs and at the time it pissed me off. Now i just care about the team playing well and progress.
Their argument for Herb was stronger than their one for Franz - namely that Herb has been a regular contributor on a team playing meaningful games for most of the year. I'm ok with that. Still, Lowe did say that he has no problem with Green being on anyone's Rookie 1st Team, and Pelton compared Green's production to Edwards' last year, who he had as the 3rd best rookie, noting that this year's class is just really strong and that's why he has Green on the second team.
They actually didn't even discuss Franz case if i recall- just assumed he was a no brainer first team. Weird bc a lot of the same criticism would theoretically apply to him as Green and he's even a higher usage player. Wagner been steadier than green but obv not nearly the ceiling/anything like Jalen last few weeks
Green could use a really tough game today against Raptors. He's going up against a disciplined team with a top notch coach. Hoping to see him get double teamed with a variety of looks. He is going to face a lot of schemes next year and it'll be helpful for him to go into the offseason with some film to work on. Might help him avoid a rough start next year
I think you're right - Green's RAPTOR is directionally correct but even though these measures try to normalize for teammates - they just don't really account for the cumulative effect of being on a team that is intentionally playing 3-5 low RAPTOR/low WAR players at all times when players go from good to bad teams and vice versa, you see their WAR/BPM etc adjust accordingly.
I think Green needs like a 50 spot or something super special to get them to wake up to how good he has been in the 2nd half this year, and how his YEARLY stats now eclipse most every other player taken in the draft. Something that makes them take another look. DD
Was at the game, knew it was gonna be a rough night with Trent on Green. Green really struggles when the defender can get up to his face, his ball handling is too high, Trent just pokes it every time.
Thanks, I wanted to watch the game to see how he would handle the Raptors defense but I just couldn't break free. Saw the box score and noticed an "off" game for him.
Not exactly, KPJ showed the Raptors had a bad start and you could drop 30 on them early on this game. They picked up in the 2nd Q and the second half.
I am sure it was all Raps broadcast and highlights.. Couldn't find much footage. If you think they let off KPJ off easy, Siakam is their best man, just too slow.
