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No, you can't identify as 'transracial'. But you can affirm your gender

Discussion in 'BBS Hangout: Debate & Discussion' started by LosPollosHermanos, Apr 6, 2022.

  1. LosPollosHermanos

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    One is a social construct but apparently raises eyebrows as appropriation hmmmm

    Before the board police crucifies me—I actually have no problem with either so long as we offer consistency across the board. Nobody here that’s pro transitioning should have a problem with whites identifying as blacks. Blacks identifying as Koreans. With respect to the latter individuals growing up in a country and said culture have the most legitimate reason imo


    No, you can't identify as 'transracial'. But you can affirm your gender
    Braden Hill, Stevie Lane, Edith Cowan University
    Published: July 2, 2021 12.20pm AEST
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    Earlier this week, online influencer Oli London responded to criticism after saying they identify as Korean. Having undergone surgeries to change their appearance, they equated being “transracial” with the experiences of transgender people who affirm their gender.

    The same reasoning behind London’s Korean identity (they have asked to be called Jimin after a K-Pop star) can be compared to that of Rachel Dolezal, a white woman who identifies as Black and made headlines in 2015. Debates about “transracialism” followed. Unfortunately, it seems we haven’t learned much in this space.

    At their core, London’s words and actions are a prime example of racism, cultural appropriation, and transphobia, enacted from a perspective of considerable privilege. Trans and gender diverse experiences don’t equate with someone deciding to change their appearance to be part of a group whose experiences, community and struggles they can’t fully understand.

    Race and gender are not built the same
    Gender is our internal sense of self, whether that be man, woman, neither or both.

    Most people have an idea about their gender at two to three years old — this may not align with the sex assigned to them at birth.

    Unlike gender, race presents as categorised (often physical) traits that are socially constructed and understood. You can’t inherit your gender, this is internal and something individual to you — but you do inherit the social construct of race. There is also much more to one’s racial identity than physical appearance — it’s also about culture, community, connection and even trauma.

    [​IMG]
    In 2015, activist Rachel Dolezal faced questions about whether she lied about her racial identity, with her family saying she is white but has portrayed herself as Black. Colin Mulvany/The Spokesman-Review via AP
    While multicultural communities and LGBTQ+ experiences of discrimination are sometimes compared, it is important to understand these experiences are different and complex. This is particularly the case, for example, in considering trans people of colour and their experiences of both racism and transphobia.

    People who face discrimination based on their race or cultural background can usually go home to members of their family who understand them. This is often not the case for trans and gender diverse people.

    Race and gender have very different histories, understandings, experiences, and implications in the face of discrimination. The very idea of being able to transition to a difference race discredits trans and gender diverse people’s experiences of gender affirmation. It also undermines the importance of cultural connections for many communities.

    Picking and choosing
    London, who is non-binary and uses they/them pronouns, has actively chosen a “transracial” identity. But trans and gender diverse people’s decision to transition (whether that be social, medical and/or legal) is almost always involuntary and out of necessity to live their lives authentically.


    Almost 50% of trans young people in Australia have attempted suicide at least once in their lives. Trans and gender diverse young people experience higher levels of psychological distress than their cisgender peers.

    This is not because there is anything inherently wrong with trans people, but because of how trans people are treated by others. Conflating racial identity with gender identity implies that being trans is a choice, and therefore so is race. The reality is that transitioning as a trans person is a difficult and taxing process, one that can be dangerous but also lifesaving and celebrated.

    It is racist to think someone can pick and choose parts of a race or culture they like, then distance themselves from that culture when it suits them. They avoid the burden of discrimination while reaping the rewards of white privilege, taking the necessary resources and voices from the communities who need it.

    There is a difference between affirming your gender as a trans person, which doesn’t harm anyone else, and choosing to live and appropriate another culture.

    What’s more, the word “transracial” is already in use, usually referring to adoption practices in which white parents adopt children of colour. So it’s misleading when used to talk about someone changing their appearance.

    Gender understandings can also be different based on their cultural context.

    The gender binary we’ve come to think of as usual — male and female — has previously been enforced upon people, cultures and countries through colonisation. Rigid understandings of gender are imposed upon cultures where gender fluidity was previously more accepted.

    Trans and gender diverse experiences have existed in many Indigenous cultures around the world for thousands of years, including in Australia.
     
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  2. CCorn

    CCorn Member

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    I’m a transdoctor
     
  3. JayGoogle

    JayGoogle Member

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    I feel like the article you linked explains pretty sufficiently why this is though.

     
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  4. LosPollosHermanos

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    I address this in my OP
     
  5. JayGoogle

    JayGoogle Member

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    I feel like that's a pretty big difference though that needs much more of a counter?

    Also, how do you address 'transracialism' for people that might want to use it for example to cheat a system? What if a white coach decided he was black so that he could get more interviews, for instance, or just, in general, have access to benefit programs used to lift minority groups up? I think the article hits on that too, that they can take the benefits of something and none of the consequences all while hurting people that can't just be transracial. My black ass can't just decide to be white one day on the flip side but because of how America has constructed racism it's a lot easier for a non-black person to pretend they are black.

    Transgenderism is a completely different thing, it's something we've known for a long time now with tons of study and research behind it and as mentioned, it's not a choice, also, I think the article brings up a good point. It's not harming anyone externally, while transracialism can hurt the minority groups that have no choice but to always be that minority.
     
  6. rocketsjudoka

    rocketsjudoka Member

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    If someone who is not one race wants to identify as another race I have no problem inherently with it. I know many people who aren't Asian but love Asian culture and to the extent that they want to identify with it I think it's great. The only issue I would have with it is don't claim you are Korean just because you like K-Pop, or Japanese because of Anime but learn more about the culture and the language.

    In the case of Rachel Dolezal the issue wasn't just that she identified as black but was also seeking to get positions and claim history as a black person, such as that her and her family were racially discriminated. I think if she had just said she is a white person who identifies as a black person and while her family background history were different she has deep empathy for the struggles of black Americans I don't think that would've been much of an issue.

    To give a personal example as someone who plays Irish music who ethnically or racially isn't the same as most Irish people. I've been to Ireland but my family wasn't from there. I've been accused of cultural appropriation. I've also though not just played the music because I like The Dropkick Murphys (who aren't an actual Irish Band) but have also learned the history and culture of Ireland. It's not enough just to sing Foggy Dew because I heard Sinead O'Connor sing a cool version of it but to learn about the Easter Uprising. It's not enough to play at a bar called "Finn McCool" and think it's a fun place to party on St. Pat's but also learn who Fionn Mac Cumhail was.

    I'm not going to claim though that my family came from the hills of Kerry or that great great uncle Seamus came over on a Coffin Ship from Galway.
     
  7. tinman

    tinman 999999999
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    Should we let people wearing John Stockton jerseys identify as a ROCKETS FAN?
     
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  8. Os Trigonum

    Os Trigonum Member
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    or poo flingers identify as debaters
     
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  9. tinman

    tinman 999999999
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    if you retweet FoxNews over and over again non stop
    is that good for you? or FoxNews ?
     
  10. tinman

    tinman 999999999
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    Rachel Dolezal and that dude swimmer are the D&D people of the year

    is that Dobro poster Rachel Dolezal?

    @Os Trigonum
     
  11. Os Trigonum

    Os Trigonum Member
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    if you misgender someone you commit a hate crime . . . if you mis-race them, what have you done?
     
  12. Invisible Fan

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    Race and gender are social constructs. Race is a grouping of several similar biological phenotypes that could be further defined into localized populations (kenyan runners, aborigines, etc) while Biological Sex can be largely pigeonholed into chromosomes and sexual organs.

    It's harder to categorize Sexual Preference and Sexual Identity because they're both nature and nurture. Cultural definitions over what's feminine and masculine differ over regions and time periods. In periods of scarcity, morbidly obese fatties were considered sexy and upper status (a proto-Trump...). Things that showed zero manual labor such as being less tanned or having smooth hands were considered desirable and attractive. In the 1600s, women would rather marry and have kids with a skinny and weak looking noble over a Schwarzenegger type if Arnold was just a dumb farmer.

    None of these decisions are innate or instinctual.

    Humans are socially linked creatures and our capacity to bond drove us to make written and spoken languages across the world over different periods of time. You don't see other animals doing that, but we tend to pick and choose "what is natural" when itcomes to these debates that are steeply rooted in Judeo-Christian-centric morality.

    The question remains whether we allow the majority to feel comfortable with the previous status quo that drove a small minority to mass suicides or do we begin to open those bonds to that group and make their conflicted lives a little easier to bear (on the social front).

    The line between cultural appropriation vs appreciation is very thin and often blurred. I mean what is really blue eyed soul? Is that some kind of orange chicken white folk feel safe with because they originally didn't like the "exotic smells" and spices of Asian food?

    Irish culture is cool now, but it was deeply repressed up until the mid 1900s. Would playing its music be "safe" if it were still looked down across the world? I don't know anymore.

    Each debate over the person's intention reduces itself into a battle of perspectives over whether the glass is half full (we're becoming a melting pot in a merit driven society) or half empty (we're assimilating into a preexisting social hierarchy).
     
  13. Reeko

    Reeko Member

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    identifying as another race is stupid

    Is there a race change procedure I’m unaware of?
     
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  14. tinman

    tinman 999999999
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    @LosPollosHermanos
    If humans sent just dudes and trans people to mars
    The human colony would die cause no kids would be produced
     
  15. HTM

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    Whatever they did to Barry Bonds
     
  16. Andre0087

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    Transracial Couple Believes Their Baby Will Be Born Black

    Matrina Big and Michael Eurwen, a White German couple who receive melanin injections and identify as Black, appeared on the British television show This Morning to speak about being transracial, changing their skin color and starting a family.

    https://www.ebony.com/news/transracial-couple-believes-baby-black/

    [​IMG]

    :eek:

    Just waiting for the first transspecies next...
     
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  17. jiggyfly

    jiggyfly Member

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    This.
     
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  18. jiggyfly

    jiggyfly Member

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    WTF!

    Just when you think you have seen it all, Germany says hold my beer.
     
  19. Os Trigonum

    Os Trigonum Member
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    there are plenty of transracial cases to point to. Elizabeth Warren for one. :cool:
     
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  20. Reeko

    Reeko Member

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    that is some fckery of the highest order

    I think I’m gonna be white for a week…my new name is Jason
     

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