who do you see as a better long term prospect between green and ivey? and would you pair them together as a starting backcourt?
I’ll defer to Nook on this one because I want to hear what he has to say first too, but I have an opinion on this as well. I just don’t think they’re the same guy. As explosive and as physically gifted as they both are, they have some pretty clear advantages over each other in different areas and how I think they project down the road.
Right now Green is the better prospect. Green and Ivey are almost the identical age and Green is starting to produce at the NBA level, so that gives him the advantage. Ivey has a higher defensive ceiling, he is really long and stronger than Green, so he can defend better. Green is the better shooter and is faster in a straight line. Ivey is awesome at turning the corner. Yes, I believe that Green and Ivey could actually work really well together. Green could cover point guards and Ivey is long enough to guard shooting guards. That would maximize the defensive potential of both players. The only concern with a back court of Green and Ivey is that Ivey would need to continue to develop as a playmaker. He has improved a lot from high school and his freshman season, but he needs to get better. While I would like Holmgren or Smith on the Rockets, I would be excited about the long term potential of Ivey individually and as a partner with Green. I have Ivey as the clear cut third best prospect in this draft, with Sharpe as the 4th and Banchero as the 5th.
I'm going to go against the grain and say Scottie Barnes. I've been extremely impressed in every game I've watched him play. IMO, he has no weakness. He has an amazing attitude and appears to be a great teammate. In the last ten games he's averaged 19p/9r/4a/2s/1b on 53.6 FG% and 34.8% from deep. I don't know why he doesn't get much love for ROY. The frontrunners are Mobley/Cade but Barnes is contributing across the board without having many plays called for him. People might think he has a low ceiling, but I have no idea why.
Hard not to root for the Rocket. Of the non-Rockets to remove bias, I like Cade 1st, Barnes 2nd, and Mobley third. I like Cade's upside if he can learn to score more efficiently. Barnes and Mobley are essentially a toss up, IMO.
Great way to have bobby disappear is to call him out on his hypocrisy and remind him of the dumbass statements that he has made. It's better than the ignore button.
If the Rockets got Ivey, I think they need to look for a PG that can cross switch defensively. I've not seen his games (G League hard to watch), but Dyson Daniels sounds like the type of PG that would fit with Green and Ivey.
Disagree with your reasoning Green is a better prospect than Mobley in a vacuum. Without even considering how selecting each one affects future drafts
The only change I'd make is put Giddey at 3 and Mobley at 4. Cade, Green, Giddey, Mobley. Then Barnes, Suggs, Sengun, Kuminga.
Mobley and Barnes are both pretty unique prospects because they are already great NBA defenders at age 19-20. They also both have crazy height/length and can already hang physically with the best of the best. While Jalen has the upside due to his athleticism, Mobley and Barnes also have crazy upside due to their height and length. It's really hard to predict how Barnes and Mobley's offense will develop over the years, they might never get to the point where they can be the number 1-2 scoring options on a team. But if they could, they would be MVP level players.
If only Wood would make an outlet pass like every other center in the league instead of dribbling it up like a dumbass
Ok so first watch a few highlights below from one of Ivey’s last games and one from JG last night. Who is stopping these two in transition? They are the same age too. JG is only like 4 days older. Hoping for Jabari or Chet, but I obviously think they would be a devastating young backcourt. Two guys constantly threatening to get into your paint. Ivey isn’t a pure point guard, but he attacks the basket relentlessly, can make basic reads and he and JG can share facilitating responsibilities over time. Ivey already plays off the ball a lot at Purdue as does Green. Like @Nook stated, JG could guard the smaller quicker guard and Ivey the bigger ones. Right off, you notice that although they are similar height, Ivey’s physique stands out. His arms are way longer and his shoulders are broad. He doesn’t just look the part, he uses that strength to constantly attack the basket and if he can’t get around you, he will try to power through you. I would compare his attacking and finishing style mostly to a young Westbrook. Not a lot of fancy dribble moves, just a move or two and a burst to the basket. He’s not as fast as Jalen Green, but he’s faster than most. Not as agile, can’t contort his body like JG, and is stiffer in the hips, but he is still a freaky athlete and has the advantage in length and strength over Green. He wants to get a step on you, explode to the basket and tear the rim down. Jalen Green is one of the fastest and twitchiest players I’ve seen in a while. I struggle trying to find a comp I like because he’s a lot faster than most of his contemporaries, but doesn’t have the same kind of frame or length. His balance and agility isn’t talked about nearly enough. Nobody ever talks about his feet, but watch his footwork it’s really good. The sudden bursts, the ability to stop on a dime, and the change of direction. I think he’s way ahead of Ivey in that regard so he’s overall a more deadly all around scorer which goes back to all the predictions that he’d likely lead the NBA in scoring one day.
I actually think that Ivey will be a good enough passer as a combo guard to run the point. He plays on a Perdue team with terrible spacing. It may take him a year or two to get up to 6-7 assists a game but I think he will be good enough to win. Christopher would be able to back up both guard spots. I would target a really good facilitator off the bench to run the team from time to time. The backcourt long term would be set. It would also let the Rockets to target players that would fit with the style of play the Rockets would play. Tari Eason would fit really well on that Rockets team. I don’t think that Silas would be the ideal coach, but there are others out there that could get a lot out of an elite athletic team with Green/Ivey
I legitimately don’t understand the discounting of KPJ. Ivey may be a good enough passer to be a combo guard who averages 6-7 assists in a few years? KPJ is that now. Ivey is longer and stronger than Green and can guard the 2s? KPJ is that now too. I’m not against Ivey, but I don’t see where the clear upgrade is vs what we already have. The frontcourt is the disaster - we have one guy who shoots well but can’t (won’t) pass, one guy who passes well but can’t shoot, and a couple short guys who hustle well but can’t do either one. And not one of the four has length or strength to defend or can grab a tough rebound in traffic.
Ivey does remind me a lot of Westbrook..the good parts of Westbrook. Has a very physical way of attacking the rim. That said, I don’t know of any championship team that functions without a “director”. Doesn’t have to be a PG. It can be a SF (Lebron), Center (Jokic), combo guard (Harden), PF (Draymond) or true PG (CP3). But you need that guy, and I don’t see Ivey in that role. He’s really a shooting guard with a similar job as Green, just does it a slightly different way. Preference is still a 2 way big, but if Ivey is BPA at our pick, then you go with him.
Ivey is a vastly better prospect than Porter. Ivey is two years younger and is likely the better player right now. Porter doesn’t go to the line often, he is shooting abysmal from the line. He has an efg% of under .50%. He really hasn’t progressed as a basketball player since joining the team and he quit on the team once this year. I would rather have Holmgren or Smith - but Ivey is the third best player in this draft IMO and I personally wouldn’t let Porter stand in the way of drafting him if he is the best player on the board. Porter can always play the 3 or come off the bench as well. The Rockets can play a lot of 3 guard line ups. Adding a 4 or 5 would be great but drafting for need at the top of the draft isn’t smart when rebuilding.
Green has been the most impressive rookie so far, its not even close.... Mobley went to a team that is 3 years ahead of The Rockets with an actual point guard and a good rotation. They are better than The Rockets at every position. A good young rookie will thrive there, nothing impressive about that. Green on the other hand went to a team with the worst coach of all time, no point guard no center. Green has had to deal with a bunch of low iq players that ball hog and take a $hit ton of shots thinking they are up to be the franchise player. Considering Green went to the worst possible situation and has found a way to thrive and be successful speaks greatly about him. The man hustles and gets ignored, scores 17 pts in 3 qs and gets benched... If the other guys got through their thick heads and egos that they are rotational players at best and that Green is their best chance at looking good themselves passing the rock and getting it back then yeah finally we could see what Green could really do. With that said, despite everything in Houston holding him back he is still a top 5 rookie and will most likely end up number 2 behind the guy that has everything pushing him forward.
