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Ukraine

Discussion in 'BBS Hangout: Debate & Discussion' started by NewRoxFan, Nov 25, 2018.

  1. Major

    Major Member

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    Yeah, sanctions in general are crap. Look at North Korea and Cuba and the decades of sanctions we've had there - their leaders live in luxury while the population suffers. Russia sanctions are unique in that they bleed his ability to conduct war, but they are also going to destroy the economy. At some point, Putin will be able to use it to try to convince his people the West wants to destroy Russia and invoke nationalistic feelings. No idea if it will work, but Putin personally is immune to sanctions because of the sheer wealth he has everywhere. The value comes primarily in crushing his actual ability to conduct war, but that will be too late to save Ukraine.
     
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  2. Sweet Lou 4 2

    Sweet Lou 4 2 Member

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    The NY Posts spins things to the right a lot - I doubt they were assassination "attempts" probably closer more akin to "plots" that they discovered - then the post spins it to calling it an attempt.

    The NY Post gets a bit close to propaganda because of that spin but I wouldn't go that far as what @Commodore is saying.
     
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  3. Andre0087

    Andre0087 Member

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    I can hear them now..."Hitler was taken out of context!"..."Mainstream media is twisting his words, he never said he wanted to exterminate anyone!"..."He's a nationalist what does race have to do with anything? He wants what's best for Germany!"
     
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  4. Sweet Lou 4 2

    Sweet Lou 4 2 Member

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    Putin calculated that he'd be hit with sanctions before he invaded, and he did it anyway, so of course sanctions aren't going to stop him. But the combination of sanctions and other things such as low troop morale and failure to take ukraine may shift him in some areas.

    I doubt he stop until he has some kind of victory. He has to have that. And any plan that doesn't consider that - he'll never agree to and will keep fighting. But we can do is make this victory as painful as possible for him and make it as difficult as possible to continue his aggression. And in that regard sanctions can have an impact by weakening Russia militarily. Even after Russia installs its puppet gov't in Ukraine, the pain won't stop, and the west needs to keep Russia a pariah state for a very long time.

    They will get Ukraine. The key is to make them regret it.
     
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  5. Xerobull

    Xerobull ...and I'm all out of bubblegum
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    [​IMG]
     
    #3865 Xerobull, Mar 4, 2022
    Last edited: Mar 4, 2022
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  6. Sweet Lou 4 2

    Sweet Lou 4 2 Member

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    It's a fair point. The Ukrainian gov't tolerates them because they need them obviously. But it doesn't justify Russia's invasion nor does it label the Ukrainian state as a racist state.

    I would never want to live there though war or no war.
     
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  7. Andre0087

    Andre0087 Member

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  8. DaDakota

    DaDakota Balance wins
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    I think ultimately we are going to need to send troops and get in a war directly with Russia.......

    Putin doesn't care about his people our people or their people, he is a narcissist to the highest degree - and he needs to be dealt with in the harshest manner.

    Nothing wrong with trying sanctions and HOPING it works, but IMHO, it won't work until we go in with NATO and take him out.....ala Hitler.

    DD
     
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  9. Major

    Major Member

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    Unless the end result is Putin is no longer in power, one way or another. It's possible to save Ukraine and this end with us not having to constantly worry about what Putin will do next.
     
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  10. Sweet Lou 4 2

    Sweet Lou 4 2 Member

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    Does Putinism end with Putin? I'm not so confident about that.
     
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  11. NewRoxFan

    NewRoxFan Member

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    I suspect him communicating they don't bother him is a tell that they do bother him. He can shift things around? Great, keep apply more sanctions, and keep enforcing them. Make him move more projects.
     
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  12. Exiled

    Exiled Member

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    the US and the West could not stop :
    Israel
    Iran
    MBS
    North Korea
    Burma
    Assad
    China etc ,

    there is no hope in stopping Russia.Putin has many leverages and can create further catastrophes , he will easily outlast his (elected) counterparts .

    the focus should shift into increasing oil/agricultural productions output , sadly the public outrage will shift into economy and interest in Ukraine will diminish with time
     
  13. MadMax

    MadMax Member

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    This is exactly what happened. He called any journalist who dared to question him the "lugenpresse" meaning the lying press.

    "History doesn't repeat itself, but it rhymes." - Mark Twain
     
  14. deb4rockets

    deb4rockets Member
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  15. DaDakota

    DaDakota Balance wins
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    I think it does......very rarely does the man in 2nd place have the same persona and following, especially when the West is crushing their economy.

    Tell ya what, let's hope we find out soon.

    DD
     
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  16. Bandwagoner

    Bandwagoner Member

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    In the USA it isn't government sanctioned. In Ukraine it is.

    [​IMG]
     
    #3876 Bandwagoner, Mar 4, 2022
    Last edited: Mar 4, 2022
  17. basso

    basso Member
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  18. T_Man

    T_Man Member

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    But what is Putin End Game here???

    It feels like there is more or something none of us see..

    What did Trump give or tell Putin???

    The it look snow, this is not going to enter pretty

    T_Man
     
  19. Ubiquitin

    Ubiquitin Member
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    Rebuild Russian Empire before he dies.
     
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  20. DaDakota

    DaDakota Balance wins
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    It is my belief that Putin wants a land bridge to the Crimea and all the other crap is just a diversion.

    If I am right that will come up sooner or later in the talks, and the Ukraine may have to cede the bottom of itself to make it happen.

    I don't think he cares the Ukraine other than that......now the Ukraine needs access to the sea as well, so not sure this can happen.

    And, I don't think Russia stands a chance against NATO - and would be destroyed.....their only hope is threatening Nukes, so if you can neutralize that, they are toast.

    DD
     

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