How do you feel about Americans representing China in the Olympics?

Chinese spy has no opinions on these Olympians jumping ship? Lol

 

I've said this before why I don't refer to the PRC (Peoples Republic of China) as "China". The CCP is pretty much the political entity of the PRC. So pretty much Eileen Gu is competing for the CCP. That is the nature of a one party authoritarian state.

China though as a historical entity and as an ethnic identity is more than the PRC. CCP likes to claim that they are "China" and speak for all Chinese and is one reason why they are so aggressive pushing ancient claims to territory that once belonged to the Ming Dynasty.

This is one reason why I find it ironic that many of those who claim to hate the CCP the most insist on calling the country "China" and even when making derogatory statements like "China Virus" to refer to COVID's origins in Wuhan are indirectly buying into the propaganda of the CCP.

 

$42 million. I mean, she's honestly doing the most American thing possible - cashing in on her talents as much as she can. Elon Musk would be proud.

 

So is Gu competing for the CCP/PRC or is she competing for China? That's my question. Maybe in her mind its China but in others it's the CCP. Do American athletes compete for the Democratic Party or for all Americans? I get that in China there is only one party rule, but to your point there is a distinction between the country and the governance.

 

Just further exposes the Olympics as a pointless scam. Hopefully it goes away.

 

By nature this sub forum is full of people who care a lot about things like politics and nationalism. For many athletes though those aren't primary concerns. To get to the Olympic level takes a lot of mental focus, time and effort. It also can be a very insular pursuit. YOu can see it in the Olympics in how the athletes associate themselves. While they march in as a country in many cases you can see there is far more camraderie with athletes in their own sport than it is with than athletes who are in different sports but happen to be from the same country.

Eileen Gu has shown she doesn't care about whether she betraying the US. Her answer to the "haters" was that they won't win a Gold Medal. And I'm pretty sure she's right for 99.99% of those calling her a traitor.

I will say again though the more interesting case for me is Zhu YI who went all in giving up her US citizenship. That many in the PRC have turned against her and she has had a disappointing Olympics I'm curious if she has any regrets about leaving the US.

 

Gu is smart and mouths the party line that she's competing for "China" and the people of China. I'm sure she knows it's a one party state and that party is the CCP. I don't think that is a big concern for her.

I think it's pretty obvious she's competing for herself.

 

In Beverly Yi’s case, I do feel sorry for her and I hope she will learn a great lesson out of this. Someone needs to open her eyes about all the atrocities that the CCP have done to the people she’s sharing the same heritage with as well as other non Chinese people. Ailling Gu on the hand is nothing but a mercenary without a shred of conscience, so whatever negative crap going her way, she’s totally deserved it.

 

I don't think immigrants who come to this country and become citizens here owe this country anything. If you were a refugee, I could understand that. But most immigrants who come here are treated like **** and aren't even wanted, they live tough lives in a foreign country, and work their asses off, while half the country wants them to leave. The romantic notion that America "provides" opportunity is BS, it's not some magical candy store that if you get here you become successful - it's the immigrants who are stars and through their hard work and ingenuity succeed despite the barriers and make this country better. America owes as much if not more to immigrants than the other way around and has a terrible record of showing appreciation for that. People come here mostly for money and success, you don't leave home homeland behind - your family, your culture, and everything you hold dear - because of "freedom". You do it because yes, you want a better life, one where you will be well to do. That's what its about - money.

That's what America is about - capitalism. Money. Why should Gu have to move back to China? because she wants to cash out to the tune of $42 million? They may be using her as a pawn, but she's getting something out of it too. And that's how business works baby. That's the free market at work. That's as American as apple pie.

 

I fully get that many out there hate the PRC. As someone with family in Hong Kong and Taiwan what happens in the PRC isn't some abstract thing far away but something that effects me personally. I've also been to the PRC many times, speak the language, and have even gotten to train with former PRC Olympians.

Yes the CCP government is terrible and is getting worse. Yes it is a one party state and if you compete for "China" you are competing for the CCP. That said I'm not going to begrudge Eileen Gu or those other athletes. They aren't soldiers, they aren't giving the CCP any national secrets. Yes they are being used as propaganda pieces but as we see with Zhu Yi can backfire. These are just people who are doing what they can to fulfill a lifelong dream and compete at the top of their sport.

Whether they are competing for the PRC, USA, Uzbekistan really doesn't change much. Obviously Eileen Gu winning the gold hasn't changed anyone's mind about the PRC.

 

I think nearly every athlete is competing for themselves in some form or fashion. You don't work that hard for some altruistic idea of patriotism - you are ultimately doing it for yourself. To be the best, and to get the benefits of the prestige it can bring.

You're right, she doesn't care a rat's ass about politics. She cares about getting the medals and the money.

But here's the thing. China's pawn isn't going to help them. It's putting lipstick on a pig so to speak. This kind of propaganda doesn't work. It's never worked to cover up the problems of a nation. What tangibly does it accomplish for the CCP? Does anyone's opinion change?

In fact, there is a lot of criticism right now in China about this - how the CCP is trying to cover up things through propaganda.

https://www.nytimes.com/2022/02/15/business/china-eileen-gu-peng-shuai-chained-woman.html

 

So would Michael Phelps

 

The CCP themselves believe in the power and prestige of the Olympics. They wouldn't have spent billions on it if they didn't. They're thinking is still the thinking of other self-aggrandizing regimes going back to Ancient Greece that success in athletics is vital to national identity.

We, the US, believe it too. The Miracle on Ice wouldn't be such a big deal if we thought otherwise.

Whether it works or not isn't something that is a big concern. They're smart enough to know that it's not going to change their geo political standing. They are hoping to get a big show that makes the people feel better about the country.

Also for Eileen Gu she's using them as much as they are using her.

Just to add for all of those getting upset and worked up about Eileen Gu, Zhu Yi, the US and Canadian Hockey players on Team PRC you're pretty much agreeing with the CCP that the Olympics are about national prestige and that this is black eye for America to have people from this country compete for them.

 

You are right for the most part but I disagree with the bolded. In her mind, she may not feel she is betraying the US vs honoring the country of her mother. Now a lot of people will say BS on that, and I can understand that. But the one thing I have learned on my time on this planet, 99% of people of full of BS and rationalize their thinking to justify their thinking. In other words, they fully believe in their own bullshit.

I know these topics are sensitive and passionate issues for many, particularly for those who put their lives at risk for their country such as @deb4rockets. And I just want to say that serving one's country is a huge act of sacrifice and patriotism that counts far more than anything an olympic athlete will ever do. And that's my whole issue with the Olympics, it's ALL propaganda from a nation-state perspective. It's athletes seeking glory and nations trying to capitalize on it.

If a foreign power invaded America, I'd be happy to take up arms in the fight against them with my middle aged body. That IS my duty as a citizen. But I don't give a rat's ass if an American wins or a German or a Russian. It's all symbolic and means nothing at the end of the day. Its flag waving patriotism and it's part of the world of what divides us as a global citizen living in a smaller world with common problems. I don't see a plus side to nationalism. I do see the dark side and where that leads to.

When America loses on the international stage, usually the other side feels really great. It makes their day. To us? We don't lose a wink and it's just a news blurb on a paper. When a country wins the world cup, the entire nation usually shuts down to celebrate. Could you imagine that happening here? Truth is we really don't all care that much. And to me, that's a good thing. We're one of the most powerful nation-states in the history of human kind, we really don't need to worry about patriotism. We really need to just fix the problems that might put our future generations from not enjoying that status.

 

And this can't be emphasized enough.

 

I'm not going to say none of this matters. Obviously the Miracle on Ice was important to many and if the US won the World Cup I'm sure there would be a lot of celebrating here.

Heck when the Rockets and Stros won I'm sure many of us felt great about Houston.

I agree with you that a lot of people believe their own BS. I think in this case a lot of people are projecting onto these athletes things that they themselves probably aren't thinking about much. Eileen Gu has shown that.

Besides it's not like they are competing for the Utah Jazz.. Now I would call that competing for an evil regime..

 

Elon owns the world and is saving the entire species

this chick is help selling clothes to teenage girls that don’t look like her or ski like her

 

First, America absolutely provides opportunity. If it didn’t, immigrants wouldn’t come to the USA. Opportunity doesn’t mean something is easy. There is no doubt that almost all immigrants that come to the USA work hard once they get to the USA.

The USA isn’t just about money, and while that is part of opportunity it isn’t the totality of it.

If Gu wants to be the poster child for the CCP in exchange for money, that’s her choice and she lives in a country (the USA) that lets her do just that. However she also can be roundly criticized for it and called a traitor or someone that doesn’t have strong values.

 

The whole land of opportunity thing is great branding & marketing, but the US doesn't offer immigrants anything more than the UK, France, Germany, Japan, etc. In fact, those countries actually offer a lot more support for immigrants. And yes, what makes the us so full of opportunity? It's that there is so much buying power here - it comes down to money.

And yes everyone has every right to criticize whomever they want, and call them a traitor. It just seems like a double standard when there are so many Americans who sacrifice their values for a buck and people call them patriots. You can be a lawyer who gets rich off frivolous lawsuits, or a predatory lender, or import American flags from China and sell them to patriots, you can close down factories and move jobs to mexico, but god forbid an 18 year old gets 42 million for being a paid symbol for a foreign gov't we don't like. Like how many Americans would turn that kind of money down?