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Forcing children to wear a mask is child abuse. The Left failed children.

Discussion in 'BBS Hangout: Debate & Discussion' started by AroundTheWorld, Jan 31, 2022.

  1. bobrek

    bobrek Politics belong in the D & D

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    I have a real life example... at our church and club, the unvaccinated are required to wear masks and the vaccinated are not. Applies to children and adults. I have been to other places - hotels, stores, etc. with the same requirements
     
  2. bobrek

    bobrek Politics belong in the D & D

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    Glad that is not the case with the required vaccines kids have been required to take for decades.
     
  3. AroundTheWorld

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    I understand that example. The rule makes little sense, though, since the vaccination does not provide sterile immunity.

     
  4. bobrek

    bobrek Politics belong in the D & D

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    Does it show how many of those 86 deaths were vaccinated? I did a very quick skim of the tweet string and didn't see the numbers.
     
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  5. AroundTheWorld

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    You would have hoped that the country with the most advanced vaccination progress would not have a peak like this in incidence and deaths.

    The unvaccinated are disproportionately represented, as one would assume. But still...

    https://www.haaretz.com/israel-news...cinated-die-in-much-higher-numbers-1.10586137
     
  6. PeppermintCandy

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    Just my opinion, but I think if there weren't such opposition to masking from a large portion of the public, the government would make masking requirement encompass both the vaccinated and unvaccinated. This would give the maximum (but still imperfect) protection.
     
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  7. AroundTheWorld

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    Other source says vaccination makes no difference:

    https://www.israelnationalnews.com/news/321674

    '80% of serious COVID cases are fully vaccinated' says Ichilov hospital director
    Vaccine has "no significance regarding severe illness," says Prof. Yaakov Jerris.
     
  8. Os Trigonum

    Os Trigonum Member
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  9. AroundTheWorld

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    Remember that Fauci and others initially recommended AGAINST masks.
     
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  10. NewRoxFan

    NewRoxFan Member

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    As usual, a cherrypicked article, from an obscure site, quoting someone with unsubstantiated info, that directly contradicts data from other studies... including this one from the same news site, citing an government health agency:

    Health Ministry: Vast majority of ECMO patients are unvaccinated
    Of 252 COVID-19 patients who required treatment with ECMO machines, 216 were unvaccinated, Health Ministry says.
    https://www.israelnationalnews.com/news/321859
     
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  11. NewRoxFan

    NewRoxFan Member

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    Not accurate since it avoids the context and timing of Fauci's statement... he was suggesting people not rush out and buy up supplies of N95 masks at a time when the masks were needed more by medical professionals and emergency response personnel.

    But you continue to spout misinformation in support of your political anti-mask, anti-vax reasons...

    Fauci said US government held off promoting face masks because it knew shortages were so bad that even doctors couldn't get enough
    https://www.businessinsider.com/fau...cause-doctors-shortages-from-the-start-2020-6
     
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  12. FranchiseBlade

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    Children are being hospitalized at an increasing rate due to Covid19. Better to use the medically recommended process of wearing masks since it is an increase in effectiveness over not wearing them. Our school mandates surgical masks at the minimum for students and KN-95 minimum for staff and faculty.

    Surgeons wear masks for a reason. And it isn't because Democrats or liberals make them.
     
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  13. IBTL

    IBTL Member

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    Lol after 20 years it seems op has decided to move on from any credibility.

    strange hill to flame and die on..
    You hate to see it but kinda amusing
     
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  14. bobrek

    bobrek Politics belong in the D & D

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    In his own words he says that defining a serious case is "problematic". He then goes on to explain why. So... my question is how many of these serious, vaccinated patients have underlying conditions?

    “Defining a serious patient is problematic. For example, a patient with a chronic lung disease always had a low level of oxygen, but now he has a positive coronavirus test result which technically makes him a ‘serious coronavirus patient,’ but that’s not accurate. The patient is only in a difficult condition because he has a serious underlying illness.”

    My other question is, what has gotten you so motivated to to post all this recently?
     
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  15. Amiga

    Amiga Member

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    Israel started fast but has fallen behind. 66% fully vaccinated and 72% if you count partially vaccinated. Lowest among list below.

    Israel - 72% (66% fully vax)
    US - 75% (64% fully vax))
    Germany - 75% (74% fully vax)
    Sweden - 77%
    UK - 77%
    Netherland - 78%
    France - 80%
    Japan - 80%
    Spain - 82%
    Singapore - 90%
     
  16. bobrek

    bobrek Politics belong in the D & D

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    This article seems to contradict your article

    https://www.timesofisrael.com/israe...ak-new-record-even-as-transmission-rate-ebbs/

    The ministry said serious cases were much more common among the unvaccinated: Among unvaccinated patients aged 60 and up, there were 415.6 serious cases per 100,000 people compared with 35.9 for their vaccinated counterparts.
     
  17. Amiga

    Amiga Member

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    Yick, that's just wrong. Maybe one of these days with a new variant, but so far with every known variant, covid vaccines have been very protective against severe illness.

    This article fact check this particular claim. Also remember this - when 100% of the population is vaccinated, 100% of severe illness is among vaccinated (base rate fallacy at work).

    https://www.techarp.com/science/severe-covid-19-israel-vaccinated/
     
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  18. AroundTheWorld

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    As usual, you just repeat your opinion and state it as fact, ignoring the actual science and medical experts who were quoted in this thread. I realize there are differing opinions among medical experts about this, but there is definitely not a unanimous consensus that masks in schools make sense.

    Let me ask you again: Do you want children to wear masks forever? Covid will not go away - that is just a fact. If you don't want them to be worn forever, then at what point do you think they can be made optional? I am genuinely interested in your take on this. Most proponents of school mask mandates do not have any exit strategy whatsoever, from what I can see.

    Maybe this explains why you think this is "normal". Let me tell you - it is not.

    There is a good argument to be made that Omicron is actually a blessing (because it is much milder than previous variants), and that natural immunity is vastly superior to the effect of vaccines (different experts have different opinions on this).

    https://www.newscientist.com/articl...ere-in-kids-despite-rise-in-hospitalisations/

    So why is it ok for a surgeon to do open heart surgery on you with "just" a surgical mask, but if you want to go to the museum in California, you now must wear an N95 mask? Do you realize how absurd that is?

    Yes, surgeons wear masks for a reason. But even they usually do not wear N95.
     
  19. AroundTheWorld

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    Yes, I agree - I am not anti-vaccination in general (although I think the risk-benefit analysis looks different when it comes to children, as their risk is lower by a factor of 1,000+ as compared to older people).
     
  20. AroundTheWorld

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    You need to be careful reading these statistics as the definition of what is "fully vaxed" is a moving target in many of these countries, including Germany (used to be 2, now 3, soon 4...and so on).
     

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