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The state of the democratic party

Discussion in 'BBS Hangout: Debate & Discussion' started by Os Trigonum, Feb 27, 2021.

  1. Os Trigonum

    Os Trigonum Member
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    The 2 hard truths Democrats need to share with their voters

    https://theweek.com/talking-points/...ll-their-base-about-their-defeats-in-congress

    excerpt:

    The first truth is that, according to recent data from Gallup, only 25 percent of the country self-identifies as "liberal," with "moderate" and "conservative" pulling in more than a third each (37 percent for the former and 36 percent for the latter). That's more than in the past (thirty years ago, just 17 percent of the country described themselves as "liberal"), but it's nowhere near enough to ram through a progressive agenda in Congress.

    This gets obscured by the fact that within the Democratic Party, the left has made enormous strides over the past few decades. Back in 1994, just 25 percent of Democrats considered themselves liberal. Today that number is 50 percent. Over that same timespan, self-identified moderates have fallen from 48 percent of the party to 37 percent, while conservatives have gone from 25 percent to 12 percent. It's understandable that the left would want to translate its growing numbers into political power, but with the other half of the party less inclined to support a progressive agenda, the obstacles are greater than a couple of recalcitrant senators.

    If Democrats probably won't convey the first hard truth to their voters, they're even less likely to share the second truth, which is that their rhetoric on voting rights has been wildly exaggerated and even outrightly demagogic. Yes, Republican efforts to make it marginally more arduous to vote are morally vile. But they've been at it for many years, and there's no evidence that it has had a measurable effect on rates of voting.

    So by all means, hit the GOP for making voting somewhat more difficult. But calling such efforts "the end of American democracy" or "Jim Crow 2.0" are risible and civically irresponsible — roughly equivalent to conservatives accusing Barack Obama of being a socialist during debate over passage of the Affordable Care Act. Such shrieking hyperbole might be good for fundraising and keeping activists maximally engaged on social media, but both do serious damage to our politics by transforming the parties into conduits for transparent and corrosive BS.
    more
     
  2. Os Trigonum

    Os Trigonum Member
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  3. Os Trigonum

    Os Trigonum Member
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    sounds violent to me

     
  4. Os Trigonum

    Os Trigonum Member
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    good thing no one pays attention to CNN anymore

    Biden leaves Democrats hanging as midterms burst into full swing

    https://www.cnn.com/2022/01/19/politics/biden-democrats-midterm-election/index.html

    excerpt:

    Senior Democrats, including some White House aides, describe a West Wing lacking both a political strategy and the discipline to execute one. Focus groups are giving party operatives nightmares. Biden is coming across as old and absent, they say. Real and perceived fumbles play into deep fears that he's not up to the job and that Democrats are incompetent. Few Americans can say what was in the massive bills he's signed, though many have heard about Democratic infighting and failure in what he hasn't signed.

    "What is the plan to fix that?" asked one operative in touch with the White House. "They can't tell us what they're talking about next week." 

     Though most Democrats in power believe there's still ample time for a turnaround, several top operatives are already talking triage.They're fearful of discussing all of this publicly because they don't want to create more problems. But privately, they are petrified that a Republican majority would end Biden's agenda and swamp them with endless investigations and subpoenas, promise impeachment and potentially endanger fair certification of the next presidential election. All this comes as former President Donald Trump has begun assembling a stricter political operation from Mar-a-Lago, aiming to use a strong presence and win record in 2022 to potentially bulldoze his way through 2024.

    "It doesn't strike me as they're dealing with the politics with the urgency of what's currently at stake," said one high-level operative working on House campaigns.
    more at the link
     
  5. Os Trigonum

    Os Trigonum Member
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    Sinema to be censured by her own party in Arizona?

    https://hotair.com/jazz-shaw/2022/01/22/sinema-to-be-censured-by-her-own-party-in-arizona-n443341

    excerpt:

    The Democrats in Arizona may want to be careful what they wish for. It’s true that Arizona has drifted further into the purple shade of the political spectrum in recent years, but the state hasn’t suddenly turned into Portland, Oregon overnight. Sinema barely squeaked through in her 2018 Senate race by a little more than two points. The Democrats in Arizona knew precisely what they were getting when they backed her Senate bid and she was previously ranked as the 47th most conservative member of the upper chamber. If the state party expects her to turn into AOC or Elizabeth Warren, they won’t be holding onto that seat for another term.

    So why would all of that matter? Because Sinema is the kind of Democrat who can get elected in a state like Arizona these days. If you tried to run Bernie Sanders there this year he would be laughed off the stage at his first debate. Arizona’s Democratic Party may be on a path to split it’s members the same way that Democrats in the House have been in a state of civil war for the past year or more. Sure, they may manage to get rid of Sinema in 2024, but the price they pay for it may wind up being yet another Senate seat being handed back over to the GOP.

    I also wanted to just take a moment to point out the way that the AP reporter described the root cause of all of this angst. They accuse Sinema of “scuttling voting rights legislation that many Democrats consider essential to preserving democracy.” This is the image that Chuck Schumer and national Democratic leaders are trying to project as well, but it’s mostly malarkey, as the party’s current titular leader would say. Sinema has already said that she (mostly) supports the two voting bills. She’s just opposed to setting a precedent where the majority can mute the filibuster whenever they want to if there is no opposition support for one of its proposals. Unlike many of her colleagues, Sinema apparently has the prescience to realize that they would be handing a sledgehammer to the Republicans who will happily turn around and use it against the Democrats the next time they take over the Majority Leader’s office. (Which might be a lot sooner than many of them believe.)

    Then there’s the breathless claim among Democrats that a failure to pass those nationalized voting schemes will call the legitimacy of the next elections into question. Oh, really? Well, since we didn’t have these nationalized voting schemes in place before now, doesn’t that mean that the previous elections were illegitimate also? Including Joe Biden’s?
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  6. MojoMan

    MojoMan Member

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  7. TheresTheDagger

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    Sadly, this describes politics in general on ANY topic in 2022. Both sides are equal opportunity users of hyperbole meant to ratchet up outrage at the other side when in reality if most voters were given a balanced and honest assessment of any topic there would be quick and decisive compromise towards common sense solutions. But that doesn't pay off politically. A decision has been made that actual progress towards solving problems is less helpful towards increasing power than pointing fingers is. Because of this, moderates and compromise pay the price. And that's because we the masses like it that way.
     
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  8. rocketsjudoka

    rocketsjudoka Member

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    Sinema was censured by the AZ Democratic party today.
     
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  9. Os Trigonum

    Os Trigonum Member
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    https://theweek.com/democrats/10092...arizona-democrats-over-support-for-filibuster

    "The ADP warned last week that they planned to censure Sinema, who in 2019 became the first Democratic senator from Arizona since 1995, if she refused to support a Senate rule change to circumvent the filibuster and enable President Biden's voting rights bill to pass. "

    and I hope the ADP will pat themselves on the back when she loses her seat to a Republican in 2024
     
  10. leroy

    leroy Member
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    This was dumb when the state GOP groups were doing it to Liz Cheney and the other republicans who had the balls to stand up to trumpybear...and it's just as dumb for the ADP doing it now.
     
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  11. rocketsjudoka

    rocketsjudoka Member

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    I tend to agree. Censure should be saved for ethics and illegal behavior and not differences of political opinion.
     
  12. rocketsjudoka

    rocketsjudoka Member

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    They might. I've heard many including here say that could accept Sinema's and Manchin's seats just going to the GOP.

    I understand the frustration with them and I'm frustrated they won't even agree to going back to an actual talking filibuster. From the years with Mitch McConnell we should understand how much power Senate majority leader is. You can hold up indefinitely USSC appointments while rush other through. While individual senators have power stalling legislation and even killing it in a very close Senate as majority leader you can prevent it from getting to the floor.

    Sinema and Manchin are blocking the Democrats by not agreeing to change the filibuster or support BBB but if Schumer wasn't the majority leader it's doubtful if any of Biden's agenda get's passed.
     
  13. MojoMan

    MojoMan Member

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  14. Os Trigonum

    Os Trigonum Member
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  15. ROCKSS

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    The GOP playbook for the mid terms
    • Woke Agenda
    • Cancel Culture
    • CRT
    • 2nd amendment........the old, "there gonna take your guns"
    • Inflation
    Not anything of substance .....like say a BBB plan or a real health care fix.........just lie on top of lie. I also wont be shocked if Manchin is a guest speaker at the GOP convention :p
     
  16. StupidMoniker

    StupidMoniker I lost a bet

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    Do you understand that not everyone wants massive wealth redistribution and a government takeover of health care? You must be so shocked when Democrats don't get 100% of the vote every election.
     
  17. Andre0087

    Andre0087 Member

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    Almost every other 1st world country has healthcare for all but the US doesn’t because…well you know why.
     
  18. StupidMoniker

    StupidMoniker I lost a bet

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    I assume it is because America subsidizes the creation of new medicines and medical technologies through our healt care payments and because we want to have by far the best care available that people come from all over the world to use. Is that what you mean?
     
  19. Andre0087

    Andre0087 Member

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    I don't buy that, plenty of countries innovative and have universal healthcare. I hope that some form of it passes eventually...then people won't have to beg for lifesaving treatments on GoFundMe in the richest country in the world.
     
  20. StupidMoniker

    StupidMoniker I lost a bet

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    Do you hear about a bunch of wealthy Americans flying over to the UK to get their specialist treatment done in the public NHS hospital?
     

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