20-game and 15-game losing streaks in his first 2 years as a head coach isn't historical or big enough for you? I agree that if Silas is getting paid that much that Tilman might not want to eat the cost, however, it would take seismic leaps in growth from Green, Sengun, Porter (if he's still around), etc. next year for Silas to stay beyond the 2022-2023 season.
Down playing Luka doesn't help your case. The Mavs drafted Luka, and then and in his second season as a 20 year old led the team to the playoffs. He's a 1st team All NBA player at 21 that can run an entire offense, probably the best you can hope for. They ****ed up with the gamble on Porzingus, but this is not rebuilding, that is trying to assemble a contender. And yes their rebuild is over, just like the Rocket's rebuild was over as soon as they got Harden in 2012. And so what they got eliminated in the playoffs twice, how many times did Harden get eliminated in the first round with the Rockets while he was younger. Coaching is a funny for Milwaukee, people were calling for Budenholzer to get fired in the previous two seasons, in fact people were calling for his head when they were down 2-0 to the Nets last year. But now all of a sudden they get Jrue Holiday and win a championship Bud is a hero, it's hilarious. I think coaching and culture matters to an extentent, but on a percentage scale talent is 95%, coaching is like 5%. It's not a coincidence that almost every team that has won a championship in the past 20 years are just stacked to the brim with talent.
I'm separating on how I feel about Silas vs how Tilman and the Rockets org look at the situation. Other reasons: 1) We're a bad team, the pressure is relatively less than win-now teams. 2) Silas came with Stone, as the new post harden era. A gm can only cycle through so many coaches before he's in the hot seat. 3) Rocket's last head coach search was exhaustive, going through that again is time consuming. If they do make the move, I think Lucas as interim is fine, but going through that again + the next draft might be a lot to handle. 4) Main reason again is eating the cost, it's not our money, but we know Tilman don't like to part with it. If GM Stone shadow interviews Kenny Atkins, I suppose ¯\_(ツ)_/¯. Just stating how the fans feel vs how the org looks at the HC is different. The stunting the growth is a good reason if it can be proven, which is a hard thing to do. Green has shown good shooting. Christopher has improved his shooting from summer league. Sengun is good at passing. Now, do we attribute that to their innate talent before coming in? Or do we credit a Barbara Turner for helping Josh to shoot. A Diop on Tate/Sengun's flashy post moves. Or credit Lucas and team trainer: Jason Biles, if Sengun shows better stamina in future games. I'm not arguing either way, but the good stuff we like about our rookies, how do the fans who want the coaches gone prove the rookie improvements are not the result of the coaches' help? When a team loses, maybe 20%? could be on the coaches, but most is still the players since they're playing the game. I'm not a Silas fan, but I also think sometimes he gets undeserved flack. From a Rocket's org PoV, I think he's still pretty safe (for now). In the previous post, I added a list, so the coaches turnovers is still very high, it's possible that Silas won't finish his first contract here.
Do Tilman, Patrick, or Stone want to win games this season? Are they doing anything to help us win games this season? When those guys start doing things to help us win games in the short term, then we can look at the job Silas is doing. Right now the Rockets are doing what Tilman, Patrick, and stone want them to do. Lose games.
I dont have the time to pour over the history of the successful teams in the NBA atm. So I will address what I can and you can take it for what it is, an opinion. I am making the following assumptions 1) Jalen Green gets better and develops into a Zach Lavine level player (at a minimum) 2) Sengun gets better and develops into something similar to Domantas Sabonis 3) The 2022 draft provides a similar level building block 4) A new coach finds the proper role/use for Christopher/KPJ/Garuba/Martin 5) A max level player that the Rockets sign (or trade for) becomes the team's best player I feel like 1 & 2 lean as likely. 3-5 are totally unknowable but none is, by itself, improbable. As for my faith in the front office, other than the Oladipo move I have been content. They found Martin and Tate and KPJ was a gamble that may still pay off that cost nothing. And the move up for Sengun I think was a good one. I am not sure I would have pushed KPJ as a starting PG this season but I understand why they did. I am no a koolaid drinker but I do see the potential for things to go better than most rebuilds. Most rebuilds dont have the luxury of the assets (Harden et al) that the Rockets did to begin the rebuild, They spend seasons building that cache up. That sped things up in my mind. And picking in drafts that have potential star players also cannot be understated. Again, all of this is just my opinion and I encourage you to feel differently.
Making the playoffs in a league where over half the teams make the playoffs doesn't require a best case scenario. I know how a tear down works and I came into this season fully expecting the Rockets to be terrible. But two years from now them being a .500 team isn't some lofty pie in the sky scenario.
I'm not sure what your reply is getting at. If you agree we can be a playoff team in 2024 then we agree.
and with that said, we have teams that don't make the playoffs for years and years. considering where the rockets are and who is on this roster, it's very unlikely. there's actual levels to this. a 2 year back to playoff contention isn't reality. that does require a ton of best case scenarios
That depends on what you think very unlikely is. I think you overstating how hard it is to make the playoffs in the NBA.
I dont think so. I think you're underestimating or not understanding what a full rebuild is and how it works in reality
well we know the kings have been trying to rebuild for years and years. the pelicans are in full rebuild. minnesota has been trying to rebuild for years and made the playoffs once in the last 18 years where they got stomped by cp3/harden in the playoffs in 17-18
Fair enough, although if you google "worst contracts in the NBA" and the article is written before the 2020 season, the majority of articles have Chris Paul on the list. I guess the majority of NBA journalists "don't know any better". My point regarding Booker to 2017 is relevant. It's not like the Suns got a little better every year and took gradual steps to the NBA Finals. The went to the Finals just 1 season after drafting #1 overall. So 4th year Booker Suns are the worst team in the league, and 6th year Booker is in the Fianls. This proves that a rebuild can happen fast. Their picks of Bender and Jackson were flops, so it didn't give them any forward progress. There is still a chance that the Rockets could pick their Jacksons and Benders, but if they hit on Green and Holmgren, then sign a max player and have a decent supporting cast, it's not crazy to think we could go for HCA in 2025. It will take a lot "if's" in either of our arguments direction to prove either of our points, and even if the Rockets are contenders 2025, it doesn't mean you were wrong and vice versa, but I do think that the Suns over the last few years is a fair template.
i couldn't careless what nba journalists have to say. Are they of the above all experts? not even close. Most of which have no clue what it's like to even be a professional athlete. Yeah they don't know any better. It isn't relevant when the whole point is about a team not making the playoffs or being relevant for a decade. The players don't matter in this case when you're talking about the organization as a whole and them no being relevant Signing max players means nothing. Not every player is even a max player and you're merely overpaying a guy who doesn't impact the game to that level. what max player is going to choose the rockets and why would they even come here out of every other team in the league. And I'm not even going to mention the obvious destinations this belief that in just 3 years the rockets are in the playoffs with hca is just laughable. it isn't even close. Talking about whether or not the rockets can even be a .500 team by then is hard enough as it is. Or even win like 30 games
1. The Kings are an incredibly badly run organization. The owner and Vlade made terrible decision after terrible decision. Pointing to them to show that rebuilds are hard is just pointing to how bad management makes it hard to win. 2. Pelicans definitely are and Zion is killing them. When you miss like that you are going to struggle. 3. The Wolves traded Love and started their rebuild in the 14-15 season when they finished dead last. They made the playoffs 3 years later in 17-18. Your position that rebuilds leading to the playoffs in a few years is super hard just isn't supported by history. It happens all the time. It's not hard to make the playoffs in the NBA.
Yeah I totally agree on the Suns, but that is counting all the wrong moves as well. The suns went from the #1 Pick to the NBA Finals in 2 seasons. Chet and a max contract could do the same for the Rockets. Let's pretend I have 0 dollars in the bank and my goal is to be a millionaire. I finish 2022 with 0 dollars, I finish 2023 with 0 dollars, I finish 2024 as a millionaire. Did it take me 3 years or 1 year? It's open to interpretation, but it's not like the first 2 years put me in a better position. Phoenix whiffed on Bender and Jackson horribly, so I think it's fair to ignore those years.
The rockets are now an incredibly bad organization ran by the worst owner in the league it's plenty supported by history. The droughts of playoffs is seen by a ton of teams in the league. you think it's easy. I have no idea why. It isn't
I think Stone is a pretty good GM and I like what he's done. You won't find a much bigger Tilman hater than me but if he keeps letting Stone make the decisions this rebuild can go well imo.
Stone hasn't yet to do anything significant to say he's pretty good. I could even say he made dumb signings. Doesn't really matter when Tilman as owner you're organization will suffer
