McGrady: If traded from Orlando, Rockets are first choice

Undeniable. Stevie may be a flawed talent, but he is a certified talent.

 

Yep. The Magic are in quite a bind. It's a small market team, and McGrady is a great draw. Once the team started losing that great draw began to lose some steam.

I posted once, and still believe, that our best bet for McGrady would be to check whether Boston wants to swap Steve and Paul Pierce, and then send Pierce for McGrady.

Although Steve might be the bigger draw.

 

Geez Rox225! Will you please calm down and try to look at this in a detached manner? Simply mention of T-Mac's name and everyone here loses all sense of reason and starts having basketball orgasms. I suggest that you read my post again because a lot of what you attributed to me I did not say.

First, so T-Mac wants "out" of Orlando because he's "tired" of losing. Well boo-hoo-hoo. He should have read his contract because the last time I looked he can't trade himself to a contender - that's left up to the Magic front office. Also he's obligated to play in Orlando THIS YEAR so that's that. He may well be traded but it will be on the Magic's terms and not his.

Orlando IS at a critical juncture in their existence. They have sucked for years and whether you want to admit it or not, they actually KNOW this. They fully realize that with the no. 1 pick and a possible T-Mac trade, they have the means at hand to radically transform their franchise for better or worse for years to come. That, sir, is the crossroads of which I wrote. These guys are not as stupid as you believe or want them to be. They are also not as desperate to move T-Mac as you seem to think, YET. That time may indeed come but they are not quite there YET. For some reason, you and everyone else are convinced (or have convinced yourselves) that your proposed deal is the ONLY attractive deal out there for the Magic. Wanting does not make it so.

I maintain that is simply not the case here and my contention is based on history. These things virtually NEVER are as cut-and-dried as you may want them to be. If the Lakers or the Knicks or any of the so-called "glamour" teams decided to enter the "T-Mac Sweepstakes", then it would be anybody's guess what would happen. That's why I said that NOTHING would surprise me at all here and that T-Mac could very well wind up just about anywhere (Indiana, Chicago, Memphis) even Dallas if Mark Cuban decides to play. The best thing to do is to just wait and see what transpires this week when McGrady and the Magic have their little "come to Jesus meeting" and then we'll have a better idea of where the Magic stand and what they may or may not do.

On another note, exactly where in my post did I say that:

Kobe was going to be traded to Orlando
AI was going to be traded to Orlando
SF was junk and I hate him

I do agree with your assessment of the Knicks as "compost" however but I would be very wary of Isiah Thomas. He's demonstrated that he will make any and all moves necessary to revive that franchise and that makes him unpredictable...and dangerous.

 

Maybe, maybe. But would it be enough? Only the Magic and their fans would be able to answer that question. I'm with you on the smear campaign. That's standard operating procedure AFAIK. They have to be careful as they have one shot at getting this thing right and if they blow this deal, they'll be in living in Clipperland for rest of the decade.

 

Ok, I'm calm, but I still don't agree. Above is a quote from one of your posts about Kobe going to Orlando, no way in hell that is happening for the reasons I mentioned before. Now, if you mention that T-Mac could possibly go to Philly then there is only one other player Philly could offer, and that is AI (just thinking in trade terms here).

Now, about this whole debate of who actually has control in this situation at the moment. I still believe that the Orlando Management is in the bind here, and I think they are there NOW. First, T-Mac is obligated to play in Orlando next year, but why would the Orlando Management be so eager to get his answer as to whether he is opting out or not? They are pushing for an answer because they rather trade him before next season starts so that they can actually have a team around their rookie. I really do think that T-Mac has undercut many of Weisbrod's options as far as trading him goes. Yes T-Mac is not the GM, but for some reason all-star caliber players do have a say in where they go next. I'm sure Gary Payton had a say when he rejoined George Karl in Milwaukee and the same for Stephon Marbuy going home to NYC. The bottom line is that Orlando will be screwed over in any T-Mac trade, because there is no player other than Kobe who would make up for his loss. But, potentially trading for Francis would be one of the better deals that they have on the table. I ask you to give me other potential deals from any other team that would just blow Orlando away, and significantly make them a better team next year? I promise you that each deal will have its extremely visable flaws.

As for this crossroads you mention. Yes, the Magic are in a year where they have the #1 pick and could trade T-Mac. However, who ever they pick #1 will not make them an instant contender, and neither will the players they get from a T-Mac deal. Orlando will be in the lottery again next year, so anything they do this summer is not Franchise changing. You say they could get better or worse? WORSE???? Holy crap, they had the worst record in the NBA, I think anything they do can't make them any worse.

You never said "Francis was junk" but you did mention that Orlando would not want Francis and "our junk". I really don't consider Cuttino Mobley or Cato, hell even Maurice Taylor, to be junk. They are all players that could help a team immediately.

Another issue is that of Grant Hills contract. If T-Mac is traded Grant Hill will go as well. So I ask you to show me another team in the league that will be able to absorb Hills contract or who would want to?? At least the Rockets could use the Trade Exception to take some of that blow. This is a large consideration.

 

Where's Doc Rocket or Pops to confirm when you need them? I haven't been able to read this whole thread but what does everyone think the deal would be? SF3, Cat, & Taylor/Cato for McGrady & Hill?

We're still going to have needs at the 1 and 4... Is McDyess an option? Even more pressing, who's going to play point? Wilks? Childs? Hudson?

 

I would bet with Francis, Mobley, Taylor, and TE for McGrady/Hill, Orlando would be in the playoffs. You can't say that about any other trade they make. Not AI, not Kobe and not Marion/Johnson.

The problem is that Orlando probably doesn't have the same confidence I do that Francis and Mobley is the best trade they can do if the ultimate goal is the playoffs over the next few years.

As for winning a Championship. Even I think they are better off getting Kobe. All other deals are better left on the table.

 

Trade possibilities:

SF + Cato/Cat for T-Mac + Lue

SF + Cato/Cat + TE for T-Mac + Hill

SF + Cato + Cat + TE for T-Mac + Hill + Howard/Gooden + Lue

Last but not least:
SF + Cat + JJ + Cato + Yao for T-Mac + Lue + Hill + Howard + Gooden

 

You have got to keep an open mind with these things. While it's UNLIKELY T-Mac could wind up in Philly or Indiana or Memphis or NY or even Detroit, it's not IMPOSSIBLE. That's because you are assuming that a T-Mac trade will be solely between two teams. What if there's a MULTI-team deal like the one that landed Rasheed in Detroit? That's something that any team (NY and Isiah Thomas) could easily put together to get T-Mac. My point here is that anything can happen and most likely will. Remember, we are talking about trading a two-time NBA scoring leader. This guy would be a fit anywhere. He can just as easily go to Detroit as Houston (God forbid). If Kobe is STUPID enough to leave LA, he'd be a perfect fit beside Shaq and the Lakers have shown that they can make deals to get the players they want.

As for the situation (mess) in Orlando, we are in agreement: T-Mac wants out. He wants a ring. BUT, he wants to go somewhere where HE can get the credit for winning a title (he and Kobe must be drinking the same kool-aid). I just saw first hand the same situation play out up here with the Rangers and "Pay"Rod so I know how messy these things can get. Make a "bad" deal like the Rangers did and you end up cutting your own throat.

There are worse things that being a last place team or by being in the lottery (remember that's how we wound up with Yao). What must be considered is that Orlando has only one chance to get this right and if they blow it, they will alienate their fan base and end up like the Clippers for the rest of the decade - stuck in last place year after year after year. They may indeed be screwed but you can bet that they will do everything they can to minimize the extent of this screw job. They are not looking for instant elevation to contender status but they will want something that they can sell to their fans and community. While the Houston trade is a decent trade in basketball terms, it will absolutely suck to their fans. Flip the script: If it were us trading Yao for Mobley, Cato & Taylor plus a TE, there'd be hell to pay.

I don't know what's going to happen. All I know is that this situation is not as simple as folks here would like to believe. Anything is possible.

 

Anyone know if the trades are based off this year or next year salaries? I also read somewhere earlier in this post (?) that SF can’t be traded until August after his BYC status is gone. I’ll assume next year salaries for below.

SF(11.3M) + Cat(5.9) (total 17.2M) for T-Mac(14.5) + Lue(1.65) (total 16.15M) within 15%

SF(11.3) + Cato(8.0) + TE(6.9) (total 26.2M) for T-Mac(14.5) + Hill(14.5) (total 29M) within 15%

SF(11.3) + Cat(5.9) + Boki (1.5) + TE(6.9) (total 25.6M) for T-Mac(14.5) + Hill(14.5) (total 29M) within 15%

SF(11.3) + Mo(8.45) + TE(6.9) (total 26.65M) for T-Mac(14.5) + Hill(14.5) (total 29M) within 15%

SF(11.3) + Cato(8.0) + Cat(5.9) + TE(6.9) (total 32.1M) for T-Mac(14.5) + Hill(14.5) + Howard(5.4)/Gooden(3.2) (total 34.4M/32.2M) within 15%

SF(11.3) + Cato(8.0) + Cat(5.9) + TE(6.9) (total 32.1M) for T-Mac(14.5) + Hill(14.5) + DeClerk(2.8) + Lue(1.65) (total 33.45M) within 15%

 

Just a reminder that when using the TE, the 15% rule is out the window. It has to match $ for $. At least, I am pretty sure that's the case.

 

Interesting. Then how would they ever use it? Salaries rarely matchup $ for $. Maybe a capologist can comment.

 

You don't have to use all of the trade exception. For example:

Steve Francis (11.3MM) + TE (3.2MM) = Tracy McGrady (14.5MM)

 

http://www.indystar.com/articles/9/155214-4169-036.html

Bob Kravitz
Pacers need T-Mac for offensive attack

Go get him.

Tracy McGrady, that is.

Assuming he becomes available, which likely will be the case after the Orlando Magic's frustrated star meets with team owner Rich DeVos on Friday and shares his thoughts on his long-term commitment to that organization. McGrady, who has three years remaining on his deal, has an opt-out clause at the end of next season, and the Magic are not going to risk losing him the way they lost Shaquille O'Neal -- for absolutely no compensation.

So how about Indiana?

If the Pacers want to make it happen badly enough -- and they should want to make it happen pretty badly -- they will find a way.

Let me say it again:

Go get him.

"We could make it work, absolutely," Pacers CEO Donnie Walsh said Tuesday. "I have spoken to somebody in their organization, and I sensed there was interest there. What they're telling me is, there's a good chance he's going to be traded. So, yeah, a player like that out there, we're definitely going to be interested."

How to do it?

McGrady's salary cap number is around $14.5 million. The Pacers would have to send Orlando players whose combined salaries fall within 15 percent of that number. So it's like this: Start with Al Harrington ($6.3 million), who will get traded in the media no fewer than 50 times this summer. Then it's an issue of deciding who that second player might be.

Jonathan Bender ($6.5 million)? That would be my preference, but it might not be Orlando's choice.

Ron Artest ($6.2 million)? That would be hard to swallow, but for McGrady, it's a deal I'd make, however grudgingly.

It's a price worth paying to have the Shaq-and-Kobe of the East.

(And no, I don't think the Magic would happily take Austin Croshere and his big contract off Walsh's hands. If we're going to talk about trades, let's talk about ones that might work for both teams.)

"Once everybody agrees on the principals, our two guys for their one, you can make it work," Walsh said. "It wouldn't be that hard."

For his part, McGrady, who is friends with Jermaine O'Neal, has mentioned Indiana as one of the teams he'd be willing to join as part of a sign-and-trade deal. The only caveat for the Pacers: Making sure McGrady would be willing to sign a long-term deal to remain here. Indiana isn't going to mortgage its future for a one-year rental.

Now, keep in mind, you can throw just about anybody's name out there -- George Mikan, for instance -- and Walsh will say, "Sure, it's always worth following up with a phone call." And rumors, big ones, are born.

But this is not one of those.

The Pacers are interested in McGrady, and should be interested in McGrady. And Walsh made it clear Tuesday, he and Larry Bird are willing to move anybody except O'Neal if it means making a deal that catapults them past Detroit.

"Is anybody untouchable?" Walsh was asked.

"No," he said. "No one. Except Jermaine. He's our franchise player."

Not Artest?

"No," Walsh said.

Not Bender?

"No."

Last summer, the Pacers had a lot of base-year compensation players, making a blockbuster deal virtually impossible. That's not the case this season, at least not after July 1. If there was ever a time for the Pacers to cash in on their incredible depth, this is it.

McGrady is not the only huge name being floated out there. How about Kobe Bryant? If his legal troubles are resolved, he is going to be somewhere other than Los Angeles next season. And there aren't many teams who have more to offer than the Pacers.

(If this happens, please remember, you heard it here first. If it doesn't, well, never mind.)

We've also heard a lot about Golden State center Erick Dampier, although that talk has been cooling lately.

McGrady, though, is the one that makes the most sense. All he gives them is everything they need. An outside scorer, another option that takes pressure off O'Neal, a perimeter player who can create shots against the league's increasingly stingy defenses, and an obvious heir to Reggie Miller.

Yeah, he has some baggage. But it's more of the carry-on variety. Move him to a good situation where the team is winning and he's not required to score 40 a night, and he's reborn.

The Pacers know they are close now, closer than they originally thought after watching the Pistons defeat the Lakers. But they're not going to yield to the temptation to stand pat, to have a Colts-like offseason. Indiana did nothing at the trade deadline this season, and watched as Detroit made one of the most dramatic, season-altering deals ever made when they picked up Rasheed Wallace.

Now, it's the Pacers' turn.

The name is McGrady.

Go get him.

 

There is the key quote. People in the Orlando organization are saying there is a "good chance" that McGrady will be traded.

I feel that the Pacers CAN put a good package on the table for him especially if it is Harrington and Artest. But does the Magic want to trade McGrady to an Eastern Conference rival? I am not so sure yet. But Harrington and Artest is a pretty good deal. Add that to Okafor and the Magic have a brand new front line.

 

McGrady in Indiana, hunh?

They have the players to make it work, but Orlando is a small market team and I don't think Artest is going to put fans in the seats. Granted, I'd love Artest on the Rockets, but if it means giving up Steve....well, maybe, but seeing empty seats in the Rockets stadiums makes me ill.

I still think we would have the edge, even if it meant getting a third team involved.

 

xiki's post reiterates the point I've been making all along: Orlando will have a number of suitors for T-Mac. The proposed Houston deals bandied about here will not be the only deal that the Magic will be forced to "settle" for and that anything is possible.

 

The only problem with the Indiana trade proposal is that this leaves Orlando with Hill's huge contract. The only reason I feel that the Rocks' are the favorite is the trade exception which allows us to absorb his contract without sending junk back to Orlando. Orlando doesn't want junk, otherwise they would just keep Hill. If Orlando is trading Tracy, then they have to get rid of Hill, or their rebuilding willo take a few extra years. Remeber, even if they buy him out of his contract, he still counts against the cap.

Thos of you who keep arguing that Orlando will get much better offers from other teams, keep choosing to leave the Granct Hill problem out of the scenario. This is the key and is also the reason that we can make the deal if it's right for the team. I'm still on the fence, but We need to make some changes.

 

The Indy deal is for Tmac only - no Hill. However, there are rumors that other teams are interested in Hill if he will retire, for the cap room. What I'm reading, though, are those rumors involve Hill and the first pick, not just Hill.


We can take care of both TMac and Hill in one fell swoop. That's our advantage.

Also, TMAC has to approve any trade in principal - or else he might not resign at year end. So, no Tmac to the Clippers for Maggette and the picks, or Tmac to Utah for Kirilenko. If Tmac is smart, he'll want a big man to play with and enough media exposure to make some money. Yao = World Media Exposure - bigger than NY or LA. Jermaine O'Neal is nice and all, but,
Yao = $$. Don't ever forget that. Yao = Money.

 

While Indiana's deal is quite good, how is a team of Artest, A. Harrington, and Okafor better than a team of Steve, Cato, and Okafor? Would you rather build around Steve and Okafor or Artest and Okafor? Who is more marketable? Would you rather trade him to the East or West?

Too many questions for the Pacers. I still like Houston's chances better