LOL Slinking away already? It doesnt matter what YOU think his position is, the Bucks and NBA designate Giannis a PF. https://www.lineups.com/nba/lineups/milwaukee-bucks
A - If you are one of the top 3 'core' players on a championship team ... by definition that team was built around you Are you saying the Bucks were not 'built around' Middleton or Holiday? As if Giannis ever sniffed the Finals before this core 3 came together? Each and every one of those I listed was clearly top 3, if not second or the alpha dog Not a single guy was just a role player ... all were/are multiple All-Stars, MVPs, DPoYs, All-NBA, Max-contract type of players B - Please define your personal definition of what a modern NBA frachise 'Big' does while on the court Would you perhaps include any of the following: - Lead your team every night in boards by a wide margin - Lead your team in blocks as you are the primary rim protector for your team - Score the most points for your team, and do so almost exclusively within 5ft of the rim, or from FTs resulting in fouls trying to do so I cannot begin to comprehend a better 3-pronged jump-start in defining what a franchise 'Big' does for his team in the modern NBA Giannis just did all of those things throughout the playoffs en route to a championship In short, he won a ring by dominating the paint on both ends of the court How does that describe a 'wing' more accurately than a 'big'???
Giannis played some PG in Greece pre-draft and was clearly a perimeter player. Here he is at 18 years old, 6'9" at the time, and you'd think he was Tracy McGrady based on his style of play and how he moves. Every possession starts behind the three point line and is face up, no post plays at all. The only reason people consider Giannis a big man is because of his height. That's as silly as considering Barkley a guard because he's 6'5".
Good lord is Mobley allowing his dad to dress him too??? (im kidding Mobley Mob -- put down your pitchforks!)
Last few seasons, Giannis clearly identified as PF. Giannis has also been FRONTCOURT starter on NBA All Star since 2017.
I do not consider him a Big because of his height It's because of how he plays NOW (not 10 years ago as a teenager) He dominates the boards, protects the rim, and the VAST majority of his points come inside Those scores start in a variety of ways: - isolations (his least efficient way to score inside) - ball man in PnR - roll man in PnR - putpacks from O boards - cuts to the rim for pass - transition The common factor in all those scores for Giannis is what makes him a Big - The Finish Inevitably nearly all his points come within 5ft of the rim from 1 of 3 shots: 1 - layups 2 - dunks 3 - FTs resulting from a foul attempting one of the first 2 Giannis' value as an NBA player falls off dramatically every foot further he plays from the rim on both ends of the court The worst aspect of his game now is his complete lack of ability to threaten the other team's DEF from outside or midrange Jrue and Middleton handle the ball and initiate the OFF from the perimeter as much or more than Giannis now What is 'silly' about any of that?
@Milos @D-rock @MrButtocks Milos, I don't think where you start or where you finish is the be all, end all to whether someone is a big or not. Frankly, these days, even the term big is dumb. I've said this before, and I'll say it again, but to me, its outside-in players, and inside-out or inside only players. If you're outside-in, you have some "guard" skills. If your inside, or inside-out, you might be able to hit the 3, occasionally take your man, who if you're a big is also likely a big on a drive, but for the most part you play inside, post-up, and your outside game is just hitting a three. Giannis is an outside-in player even if he scores most of his points inside. AD is an inside-out player even if he can score from the outside at a decent % on threes. Same as an Embiid. Gobert, or Ayton are inside only players. For that matter, there's lots of guards that also score a ****-ton of paint points. That doesn't make them bigs, for example. My concern about Mobley SOLELY relative to the numerous descriptions of him being more of a wing, and having guard like (much less advanced guard like) skills, has been just this. Look at Giannis pre-NBA. That's a wing. That's a guy that's super fast, and has a tight handle, relatively speaking. It's a dude that looks more like KD, then Embiid. Of course, there's nothing wrong with being AD... inside-out. And, of course... there ARE the occasional REAL unicorns. And in the NBA... that's Jokic. LIke wtf... where'd this dude come from lol. Jokic could seriously be your starting PG, but at the same time you could just post him up all game. However, not to stick folks in groups, but Jokic, like Luka and other successful euro's, has a supremely advanced bball IQ when it comes to angles, misdirection, court awareness, spacing, etc. I'm interested to see where Mobley ends up offensively, whether on the Rockets or another team, because I think offensively he's the hardest of the top 4 guys to scout and predict.
I like your analysis of position less BB but until your definition becomes the norm, NBA players are still described as guards, wings, bigs. And Giannis is a big.
Wrong again. Where on the wing does he make his living? He lives in the paint and at the free throws like a big should.
Good joke. Jason Kidd didn't know what he was doing. Not only as a big can Giannis not shoot he can't dribble either so I dont know where on the wing this guy won his championship.
Giannis can’t dribble yet he brings the ball up all the time in the halfcourt and in transition, and drives from the 3 point line doing spin moves and Euro steps all game move along casual
I definitely appreciate the time and effort you put into clicking through and reading the full content of the articles I posted. One of the things that is so tough for me is that even as publicly available advanced stats, scouting, and player tracking has become better, I have increasingly felt like the mental game and the way that these elite athletes deal with pressure and injury has become far more important in separating the great from those that don't fulfill their potential. And frustratingly, being able to glean which players are wired right for superstar success, which might end up just being a solid contributor, or which will be the dreaded bust is something that still seems to elude us, scouts, executives, and people who are paid millions to do this as their job. I'm happy with either guy. Gun to my head, if I'm going to be wrong, I'm going to probably go with the guy who I perceive plays harder on the court and who seemingly has the right mentality to be a superstar off of it, and that's Green over Mobley for me. But I freely acknowledge that when it comes to their actual play, there's a very good chance that Mobley's current mental shortcomings are wildly overblown and completely irrelevant to how he develops as a player, like a certain someone was coming out of college.
If that's what you need to tell yourself, go ahead. I am just choosing not to engage in discussion with someone who immediately jumps to attacking me. Simply put, the moment you did that I no longer consider you worth my time or words. I already did that earlier. Scroll up and read. As for how I determine who a team is built around, it's simple. If the team had to lose all their players except one and rebuild, who would they keep? If they are choosing role players to bring on, who do they make sure they will mesh well with first? On the Lakers, that is LBJ not AD. On the Heat right now, that is probably Butler. On the Suns, that is Booker. So on and so on. Taking AD for example, is he part of their core? Sure, but in the same way CP3 or Ego were part of the Rockets core with Harden.
You are confusing where he ends up and where he starts. Let's try to simplify things for you. When you give Giannis the ball on offense, where is he typically? Is he in the post like a big man is or is he at or fairly close to the wing looking to penetrate and collapse the D? The reason he ends up in the paint or shooting FTs is because he drives to a hoop. Now look at actual bigs, let's say Embiid or Davis or Jovic. When the offense initiates, where are they usually? They are primarily at the high or low post, unless they set a pick at the perimeter or are camping out as a stretch 4.
Defining a Big Alright ... let me just say this about Giannis If he is a Wing and not a Big ... Then Mobley is absolutely also a Wing and not a Big (according to your definition as I understand it) Right now Mobley has fewer limitations on the perimeter OFF & DEF than Giannis ever has, much less as a skinny teenager Building a Championship Core What I gather is that for you, it is impossible for an NBA champion to have multiple franchise players, whom near-evenly share/deserve credit for any rings won together As in ... Shaq won all of the first 3 rings in LA, while Kobe didn't win his first until he beat the Magic Magic won all 5 ... sorry Kareem Curry only won the first, because Durant won the second and third Same for Wade, since then next 2 were all LeBron's I disagree It is quite possible, and in fact necessary, to win a ring with multiple franchise, HoF level players Other than Dream in 94 and Dirk in 11, basically every championship team for the past 4 decades has had multiple All-Stars as core players Sometimes, like with 2008 Celtics or 2005 Pistons, it is damn near impossible to determine which is the 'most indispensable' single player from among 3 or 4 very close stars that all contribute near-equally in different facets of the game that lead to the ring
