Particularly enjoyed the second video that covered some of the world building in Octavia Butler's stories. She predicted the MAGA slogan back in the 90s for instance. If it weren't for educational channels sponsored by PBS like this, I probably wouldn't even know about this author or other black authors whose influence permeates genres like Sci-Fi. I heard once there's a big Sci-Fi boom in countries like India that plays off Indian and other South East Asian religions and cultural mores that are supposed to be pretty good. But a lot of the Western world is kind of left out knowing about these authors with millions of followers as their content isn't as relatable as your more American/European authors whose content is mostly inspired by their own upbringing. I appreciate hearing the voices of more authors and just people in general whose life experiences have been different from my own, if only to gain a better understanding and perspective.
Essentially the same behaviors have continued under Biden and the "concentration camps" were built under Obama. It really doesn't seem like Trump's intent had any effect on how the enforcement happened. I think criminals deserve very little respect. There are minimum humane conditions that should be met. Arpio failed to meet them and was sued. He was defeated for reelection. My issues with him were more related to his failure to provide proper medical care than having a harsh environment. Yes, all of those people are are safe from purges.
Squirrel. Neither Obama or Biden explicitly ran on a campaign to build walls with a "zero tolerance" immigration policy. When you have bad intent, you make comments like this: Jeff Sessions "We need to take away kids" What you "think" criminals deserve isn't important. The 6th, 7th, and 8th amendments all pertain to fair treatment of criminals. Clearly our founding fathers thought about it a lot more than you. Not being disrespectful, just sayin, it's important. Our judicial branch (the only branch Trump didn't control) was the only limiter down that slippery slope. Your assurance is not all that assuring especially since Trump made every effort to control the judicial branch as well. His intent was clear.
Any yet, they had essentially the same outcomes. The reason is because soundbites don't determine how law enforcement implements the laws passed by Congress on the ground. Largely the same Border Patrol agents are enforcing largely the same laws using largely the same facilities from the Obama presidency through the last 5 years. The only evidence of the effect of the rhetoric I have seen is the words of the people coming now that say they wouldn't have come when Trump was president. Yes, those would be the minimum humane conditions I was talking about. The 6th and the 7th are more about the process of adjudicating guilt. We actually have much more stringent protections now than the founders had. The right to counsel, for example, used to mean you cannot be prevented from hiring a defense lawyer. Now if you cannot afford one, a defense lawyer will be appointed to you. You couldn't be compelled to testify against yourself, but your prior confession after being beaten could be introduced. Now, the prosecution cannot use a confession obtained through custodial interrogation unless the defendant was properly informed of their rights to counsel and to remain silent, and coercive conduct can get a confession thrown out. I got a client off when the officer told him, "If you tell us the truth, we'll have the DA be lenient with you, but if you don't we'll have them through the book at you." The 8th amendment is really the one about treatment of prisoners and it merely requires punishments not be cruel and unusual. Staying in a tent in hot weather is not cruel and unusual punishment, per the court. At no point did the founders mention treating criminals with respect. In fact, they were far harsher on crime than we are today. Trump had a 6 vote majority in the Supreme Court and appointed more federal judges than anyone, if I recall correctly. I don't think there was any support for rounding up Asian American Women, black men with faulty vehicle equipment, immigrant women, people who were illegally brought to the United States as children but were now adults, and children separated from their parents at the border and either killing them or sending them to a camp to be worked to death. What dystopian alternate reality do you live in? Trump's big thing was build a wall and send them back on the immigration front. He passed criminal justice reform laws, so I don't know what you are talking about with the black guy and the tail light. Asian Americans walking to the store is totally out of left field to me, I can't even match it to a leftist take on a Trump policy, let alone reality. No. None of those people need to fear purges in America. None of them needed to under Trump.
Somehow the guy that "forgot" he voted for trump both election periods also conveniently forgot about trump's ineffective ICE raids... Trump vowed millions of immigration arrests in dramatic raids. ICE caught 18 family members. https://www.texastribune.org/2019/0...migration-raids-ice-caught-18-family-members/ President Trump Called This Weekend's ICE Raids 'Very Successful.' Here's What We Know So Far https://time.com/5625372/president-trump-ice-raids/ I know, as a trump supporter you must defend his every move. "Oh, but but Obama was known as the deporter in chief"... How ICE enforcement has changed under the Trump administration https://theconversation.com/how-ice-enforcement-has-changed-under-the-trump-administration-120322
I haven't been able to follow this thread that closely and see it's morphed into a discussion on border enforcement. While yes what Biden has done on the border so far is still similar to what was happening under Trump intent though does matter. Consider that Biden has been in office for less than 200 days and making major changes especially to things that the President has limited control over isn't something that can happen very fast. Regarding the issue of intents and motivations those due matter. As noted in the other thread regarding the atomic bombings of Hiroshima and Nagasaki. The US and the Allies killed many many people including civilians indiscriminately. The dropping of the A-Bombs came at the end of a war with things like the fire bombings of Dresden and Tokyo yet almost no one would say that the US was the same as Imperial Japan. How the war was fought by the Allies was morally ambiguous but the intentions of the Allies were certainly different than the Axis.
a helpful review "Critical race theory: What it is and what it isn’t": https://theconversation.com/critical-race-theory-what-it-is-and-what-it-isnt-162752
Disagree. Nobody ever stormed the capital building under Obama or Biden. Trumps rhetoric (and his actions) are in stark contrast. Well, the founders also condoned slavery. Our American aspirations are, ironically, far more grand in scope than even our framers imagined ...for the better. Treatment of criminal and prisoners is how we lead with our moral authority ...and they knew enough. Yes, we have evolved over time to improve and clarify how we implement those values. Nevertheless, the fact that they thought so much about treatment of prisoners should tell you their intent. How we codify those intents is a technicality. But implementing good laws with bad intent always steers you the wrong way. You are missing the point. You must protect the values that "All men are created equal" to the highest standard. Erosion of these ideals is a hard thing to stop once it begins. This has proven to be true countless times in history. Do you believe that Americans are somehow superior humans and not capable of the same mistakes mankind has suffered for thousands of years prior?
Thanks, very nice response. To bring it back, I firmly believe Trump led with a strong immigration platform because he was specifically targeting brown skin people. Hence the tie back to the topic about race. Trump set our country back decades by empowering our disenfranchised closet racists. Clearly it still persists because literally the ONLY people talking about Critical Race Theory are conservatives. 99.9% of liberals (and conservatives) didn't know anything about it ...and still don't. It wasn't a topic. Conservatives keep bringing it up yet can't even explain what it actually means. But the intent behind this conversation is very clear. It's an attempt to undermine one of our core values that "All men are created equal". The hatred spewed regarding immigration clearly illustrates that point.
We were speaking specifically of the border crisis, but okay. People did storm the Capitol under Obama. The police didn't fight with them, they were allowed in. Hundreds were arrested. It was during the Kavanaugh confirmation hearings. People got right up in Senators faces and yelled at them. You are the one that brought up the founders in support of your point. Now you are undercutting yourself. Their intent was that people should not be arbitrarily imprisoned for opposition. They just fought a war against a government that was oppressing them. They didn't want a king or a congress to target a political enemy and have him jailed or tortured or killed. That is why process was so important to them. Look at how much they focused on how people are arrested, accused, and their guilt adjudicated and how little they focused on what happened after a finding of guilt by comparison. No, respect for criminals was not their intent, it was protection of the innocent. I think you are missing the point. All men are created equal is protected by providing equal protection under the law. That means the law applies the same to everyone. It doesn't mean you have to respect criminals, it just means that you cannot break the law when punishing them. The tents in the desert didn't break the law. Deporting illegal immigrants doesn't break the law. Building a wall doesn't break the law. Criminals have made a wrong decision and are subject to consequences of their actions. They should be treated with humanity, because they are still people, but people need to earn respect, and being a criminal is not a good way to do it in my book.
LOL - teaching kids how the country was setup against black people - the white folks are up in arms about the truth. DD
Ya I don't get the hypocrisy from liberals. These are the Kavanugh protestors. They seem pretty violent. I'm sure you can find more of them doing these things at the Capitol.
Is that a joke? Those are the Trump insurrectionists. I am not aware of anybody violently smashing windows in the capital building protesting Kavanugh. If that happened, then I agree that's bad. REGARDLESS if liberals did it, does that condone the behavior in Jan 6? Not sure I understand that line of reasoning.
Do'h. Obviously that is not right. People stormed the Capitol for the Kavanaugh confirmation which was obviously during the Trump presidency but not Trump supporters. Total brain fart. They didn't violently smash windows because they were allowed in. They were arrested illegal occupying or something to that effect. No, nothing excuses the 1/6/21 rioters. They were criminals and should be prosecuted for their crimes (though I think some are exaggerating their crimes). It is a counterpoint to the idea that it is Trump and his supporters that are uniquely dangerous, or that this represents a danger of an imminent purge, which is preposterous.
Specifically, we are discussing "Critical Race Theory" and my point is that Trump's bad intentions regarding race manifested itself in immigration policies. The differences between Obama/Biden and Trump are a stark contrast. I'm not debating the specifics of the policies. I'm debating Trump's bad faith efforts led to an overall downward spiral with disproportionately increased pressures on people of color. ...and that CRT is a bogus issue used to rile up the base. I'm arguing that dealing with criminals is central that was even recognized as our country was founded. Since that time, we've grown as a country and we continue to emphasize it. Your dismissal that you don't care how criminal are treated speaks to poor intent and when power is misguided, attitudes such as your get misapplied ...resulting in behavior that contradicts our core values. All people are created equal ...even criminals. We already attempted the separate but equal thing ...and it didn't work out so well when the people in power have bad intent. ...but as we know from history, some laws are applied more equally than others. The result is that black and brown people are disproportionately imprisoned. So what happens in "your book" sounds all well and good in theory but the reality that all people don't have equal protection under the law. The reason being is bad intent even if the letter of the law text sounds neutral enough. In Trump's case, he clearly was not neutral.
I didn't say imminent. You did. What I said is that this mindset of such folks demonstrates an erosion of civil liberties. If left unchecked, history teaches us where that slippery slope ends and it's not pretty. Once that erosion begins, momentum and a heck of thing. As such, it's massively important to protect our core American value since our country's founding that "all men are created equal". To round it out, it's important to understand the intent of the people resisting CRT ...because I firmly believe the intent is not aligned with our core principles. The topic of CRT, in and of itself, is meaningless to most people but to understand why people are opposed to it is what is important.
