Tensions over Palestinian evictions in East Jerusalem boil over

Middle East = Middle Ages

there’s a reason Asia and the West are light years ahead in science and technology

plus South America
At least they eat pork like the rest of the modern civilizations

 

Why can’t we give the Seminoles Florida.

 

we should give Texas back to Mexico

 

Should the Spaniards give the land back to the Aztecs ?

 

Should Americans give back land to the natives?

Question is in your version whose who in israel palestine? Israel is sort of like the native americans saying this was our original land, says so in bible so on. Palestenians lived there fro a few generatiosn and says this is our immediate and direct home where do we go

 

This crap has always been about land .
Notice nobody said Antarctica was proclaimed as holy land .

did these holy people have god give them heaters ?

 

Should the humans give back the earth to the dinosaurs?

 

Dinosaurs should give it back to the microscopic cells.
Eggs should give the shell back to the chicken.
Now we're getting somewhere.

 

Go way back. Quarks and stuff.

 

quarks back to god. Clean start.

 

It’s 2021 and you can’t eat bacon in the Middle East because some dudes back in the day got sick eating it cause they don’t know how to cook then proclaimed it unholy

Now people do weird stuff there like thinking some buildings or rocks are sacred

that’s like the Knicks fans thinking MSG is sacred

it’s not

It’s just a building made by humans

plus in Houston
You can’t tell what ethnicity anyone is in the hooka bar or at halal guys

 

Give it back to Egypt.

 

Give Egypt back to RA

 

Considering how dumb and backwards the Middle East is now
There’s now way they built the pyramids without help from superior intelligent beings
Plus why were they worshipping people with animal heads ?
Maybe because it was real

 

Israel blows up Gaza and we fund the rebuild? Thanks, Israel!

 

When my toddlers fight over a toy, I take it away.

RAsheed Wallace

 

Kind of a weird cycle, we give israel billions in aids, they in turn purchase fire arms with that cash and it goes to american private arms companies. then the damage thats ruled as war crimes by much of the international community in relations to gaza and the settlements, we give aid to gaza to clean up the and we lose clout internationally as some purveyor of justice.

On one hand israel is an incredible coutnry, the contributions and populace for such a small place do some incredible contributions to the world, they are a democracy at the same time just like any foreign governtemnt we've caught them undermining our elections we've more importantly caught them spying on us, if canada does that we call it out. I think theres strong poitns all around in this argument, i think hamas is also a terrible actor, its scary when american policy makers are almost goto israel trips from aipac and even come around to abusing americans constitutional rights of protest by deeming a boy cot like done in south africa illegal(coinicidentally at first we supported south africa's apartheid and officially titled mandela a terrorist)

 

I'm posting here to move the debate we're having in the Ilhan Omar thread because it is getting less about Ilhan Omar and more about Hamas versus Israel.

In the other thread posters have talked about the importance of getting out of our bubble and I agree that is important to get out of one's bubble but that doesn't mean stepping into another bubble. Too often these discussions end up with a relative yet also zero sum morality. Either the asymmetric power that the IDF has means that Hamas and other Palestinian groups shouldn't be criticized for their tactics or the indiscriminate nature of Hamas and other anti-Israeli groups tactics mean that the IDF tactics shouldn't be criticized. The IDF tactics mean that Hamas is right to oppose Israel violently and Hamas tactics mean that Netanyahu is right to take a hard line on Palestinians.

There is enough truth to both of these views that makes the conflict intractable and also one that demands people take a side. Are you on the side of oppressed occupied people fighting for their rights or are on the side of a democratic western looking country fighting to survive against extremists that want to see it wiped out? So much of the debate ends up being in one of those bubbles.

I fully accept that Gaza is dense place that is oppressed. It's been constricted by economic blockades that prevent it from developing and making life miserable for all there. Any attempt to fight within Gaza is bound to kill many civilians and given the asymmetric nature of the conflict Hamas doesn't have the ability to fight on a different battlefield with more effective weapons. All of that is true but that doesn't justify Hamas or make it comparable to the US. It can be both be true that Hamas is fighting against an much more powerful enemy that has killed far more of their people and also that Hamas is a repressive and violent organization that isn't just willing to sacrifice it's own people but celebrates their deaths. It's an organization that while it's been fighting Israel also has killed political opponents and drove out it's political rivals forcefully out of Gaza.

At the same time it's true that Israel has been dealing with terrorism for decades and for most of it's history has been under threat from invasion by other countries in the region. That doesn't justify that it's dealt collective punishment on the Palestinians. Has been annexing lands and building settlements in violation of international laws, and of course in any conflict they kill far more Palestinians than the other way around.

If we're going to make any sense of this conflict and if we are really going to step out of our bubbles we need to recognize all of this and that just because one side is more powerful while the other side are the underdogs doesn't make either more moral.

 

We're funding the whole gig.

We give billions to Israel for aid

Israel uses those billions to buy arms deals. So taxpayer money ---> Israeili aid ,--->back to american private arms companies profits(and thats why lobbying works across the booard, they just have to transfer our money somehow to our donors)

Then more taxpayer money--->rebuild the damage we helped fund in Gaza

Don't forget, we're doing the same with YEmen

But nah, we don't have enough money for the upgrades here at home...