Woj: Rockets want to trade Harden "sooner rather than later"

@Nook knows what he's talking about but please quit quoting 7% as the definitive number. There are extenuating circumstances because of his age, profession and the severity of his first injury. He's had two surgeries.

I, like Nook, have personally worked with back injuries in my profession.

I personally wouldn't touch MPJ because of his injury. His profession and his age pretty much guarantees he will have lingering back issues for the rest of his life. Does that mean extended serious injuries? No. What it does mean is at anytime he could be debilitated due to back problems flaring up that are just lingering effects of the initial injuries.

You want the face of the franchise to be a guy who is going to have injury concerns forever? Didn't we already play this game with Yao? T-Mac?CP3? Russ? Dwight? Didn't we just dodge these with Chandler Parsons? Chris Bosh?

I don't want to trade James, but if I had to, I think at this point I'd take two packages.

1. Jaylen Brown/Marcus Smart/3 FRP for James and Chris Clemons
2. Ben Simmons/ Maxey/ Thybulle/ Milton / 3 FRP for James, PJ and Clemons.

I think MPJ could be gotten in later years for Brown or Simmons despite his growth because the back issues are going to be a cloud forever.

 

Also mpj was 90 percentile last year in isolation scoring, again on small sample because Denver wouldn't use him that way. But it's further indication that he would excell if given a bigger role on offense. He's blown up every game that Murray was out last year and the nuggets were forced to use him more so it's not just based on one game. It's based on his overall efficiency as a rookie and the limited role he was given, and how he looked whenever that role expanded. And his pedigree and skillset, and his progression so far this season. Add it all up I think he is on track to become something special.

 

I'd take Option 1 but swing Smart and a couple of picks over to Orlando for Aaron Gordon. Orlando sorely needs better perimeter defenders even at 4-0, Boston gets their star player, we get two solid players (with a potentially great one in Brown) plus picks in return. Recoup draft capital by trading PJ to anyone that's willing to give us a 1st Rounder with mild protections.

Wall
Gordon
Brown
Gordon
Wood

hell you could take Eric out and play a bigger front court of AG, Wood and Boogie.

 

I'm not huge on Aaron Gordon and absolutely love Smart's tenacity, but honestly, that's a really solid idea. I'm not even sure it takes picks to be honest. Smart is a very highly rated asset and each player would fit each team better.

 

The % of reoccurring is widely available online, not just from nook. He had two surgeries because he had issues with two separate disks. It's not that he had both surgeries on the same one.

Jaylen brown is closer to Harrison Barnes than any of these other star names being mentioned, that trade would doom the franchise.

I'm ok with Simmons, he's a great player, but his shooting will limit his ultimate upside to perennial all star instead of superstar. Mpj has the chance to be all world.

 

It’s not just 1 game. He’s shown flashes of brilliance last year whether you think the sample size is small or not. He more than passes the eye test. He has all the talent and tools to be a top 10 player in the next 5 years. Teams gamble on potential and “what could be” all the time. You’d have to seriously consider him if he’s on the table especially considering he’s 10 years younger than Harden.

Sleep on MPJ too long and he’s the type of guy to become untouchable.

 

Mpj as a 22 year old second year player is already one of the most efficient scorers in the entire league. If anything, the nuggets should be getting the ball to him more and he should be more of a black hole.

He did not have complications from his first back surgery, it was a separate disk.

 

I honestly think people are being farfetched if they think the Nuggets will trade MPJ AND Murray for Harden. It's an either/or proposition IMO. I get many on this board may not like that, but I'll believe otherwise when I see it.

Either way, many on here are undervaluing MPJ. No one is reacting to "one game." The dude is obviously a star in the making.

 

Peyton Manning, Tony Romo, Tiger Woods, Dwight Howard all had back surgery. You guys acting like a herniated disk is a career risk.

 

MPJ is a rookie. Kinda young compared to the others?

 

You watch the Celtics at all? I've been watching every team mentioned in serious trade talks. Boston, Philly, Miami and Denver. Jaylen Brown has added something to his game this season that I didn't expect. He's actually creating for his team. I think he's actually more James Harden than we are giving him credit for and that's in work ethic. Seems like he works his ass off to improve his game. Brown is the most impressive of the guys listed so far this season. I was Ben Simmons team a week ago. He seems like he's satisfied just doing what he's doing. I'm fine with either.

You're quoting 4 guys whose careers were seriously altered because of injury.

 

They’re definitely not trading both and I personally don’t think they’re trading Murray for Harden either. If we keep waiting they’re not trading us Porter either.

 

...I'm comparing their back injury. Those others don't even play the same sport dude.

 

U really think MPJ talk is based off of 1 game? People were talking about him long before last night...

 

So let's entertain the idea that MPJ will be the centerpiece for Harden. To make salaries align, Denver is going to have to include Gary Harris and Will Barton. I'm not even considering Murray or Jokic because that's not going to happen.

So now you have MPJ, Gary Harris with one year left on his current contract and Will Barton who also has one year left on his contract. We'll then need picks. Denver's 2023 pick belongs to OKC (not surprising) so you're looking at 2022, 2024, 2026 at the very least.

MPJ
Harris
Barton
2022 1st
2024 1st
2026 1st

for Harden

 

Talking about him is one thing; actually considering him as the centerpiece for James Harden is another. Of course I don't read this forum as much as I used to so maybe there's a cult built around acquiring MPJ in exchange for Harden that's been established that I don't know about.

 

I haven't watched Brown this season, but hes been in the league for 5 years now and I highly doubt he just made such a giant leap from mid teens PER to 24 in his 5th year. Much more likely that he has just had a few hot games. His advanced numbers the past few years are less than impressive, Harrison Barnes esque. This year his numbers are way up but only been 4 games.

Yes those 4 players were never quite the same. Dwight was dpoy and never got back to that level, but has been healthy and playing for years. We may never know what mpj could have been without the injury, but we do know what he is TODAY, that despite the injury he is still playing at this level and on a fast track to greatness.

 

MPJ is a lemon with a Ferrari kit put on it. The back problems will haunt him his entire career. That's not to say he won't have his moments of brilliance, but I'm in no hurry to bring on another Tracy McGrady type.

 

But Ben Simmons or Jaylen Brown should definitely be the centerpiece, and if acquired, that’s a win for Harden as opposed to MPJ?

 

This is year 3 of Porter.